Battle Grounds is ridiculous

PatientZero

I've been fighting my way to to achieve enough points to be eligible for the top tier community event rewards. I have found several issues with this. First, there are people purposely losing just not to advance and stay at the lower tiers for points. Not realizing this at first, I grinded for days to get points. Next, I have had several fights where it's over and neither my defender nor their attacker lost anything, granting a guaranteed 15,000. They pause the game in order to average points. So, now that I made it to a higher tier, it's absolutely stupid. My highest champions are the ones I invested in, 23,000 or so. The rest are like 15k and lower. I am consistently being matched up against Legend or others with awakened 7 star rank 3 champs. When the lowest champion I'm fighting is 33,000, it gets to a point that I'm just done with it. Why isn't their any matchmaking ability that keeps the playing field fair? Why not a way to match players by their highest ranked player in the roster or limit what the opponent can select. With the sheer unfairness of the event, I don't even want to play anymore. I think the only way to get points is to cheat. Purposely lose, stay way low so you stay in the lower brackets and just pause every game so you average 15000. Unless I'm extremely lucky, I'll never win against people dropping a buffed up 78,000 Serpent against my 14,300 Havoc. Maybe I'm wrong, but my latest discussions seems like most are in agreement with me. I should not be matched up against the whales.

BringPopcorn

You are trying to get top tier rewards in an event where you are not top tier...

Furrymoosen

Not that you should be matched up against whales exclusively, but you should be able to be matched up against whales. The fairest matchmaking is matchmaking that pits players against other players in the same tier. If they only pinned players against accounts their size, then smaller accounts would have an easier road than larger accounts - that would not be fair.

Outside of that, the rest of your post is fair observation and feedback. Kabam created a bit of a mess with this one.
You can gain more points per match in the GC, but there's no real penalty for losing in VT. So you've got a bunch of "players" pausing there way through or purposely losing matches with energy so they can stay in VT and match up against easier opponents when they use their elders marks. These are tactics that won't help in GC, and for only 50 points less per win it doesn't not make sense to point farm.
Kabam has called out and promised action against point farming before, but hasn't been doing anything about it, so why would anyone stop?
The way they created the event incentivized, to some extent, point farming. It is less stressful to play in the VT because you can match up against easier opponents, and the point difference in GC isn't high enough to incentivize players to go play against harder opponents consistently. Had they added extra incentive to push for GC by a certain time, maybe that could've helped a bit, but the content created a need in some players' minds to manipulate the system for their benefit.

Giantwalrus56

Keep grinding, build your roster like the rest of us did

PatientZero

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

PatientZero

To this..
If they only pinned players against accounts their size, then smaller accounts would have an easier road than larger accounts - that would not be fair

I agree, but if someone at my tier is able to make it to Diamond 2, I think the first option should be others that were able to grind their way to that tier.

Cretzu

PatientZero said:

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

In Alliance war you won’t be matched vs top alliances but also your rewards are less. In Battleground, the rewards are all the same. Why should someone with a small account be able to get the same rewards than the players with massive accounts who have grinded for years and spend money to advance their accounts, would that be fair to them?

Are you expecting to get to celestial just playing against small accounts with similar ratings? Doesn’t make sense.

Furrymoosen

PatientZero said:

To this..
If they only pinned players against accounts their size, then smaller accounts would have an easier road than larger accounts - that would not be fair

I agree, but if someone at my tier is able to make it to Diamond 2, I think the first option should be others that were able to grind their way to that tier.

There's nothing to say that bigger accounts didn't grind their way too.

When you queue for a match, you queue with the available players in your tier who also queue at the same time or with 10-15 seconds (the typical time it takes to find a match in VT). You're matched with the first available player in your tier (or closest tier if there aren't many on). Unless you coordinate with those similar accounts in same tier somehow, there's no way to guarantee any of them are even online at the same time. So your options are to take the first match you get, wait significantly longer for a match, or get no match at all.
And before you think about finding accounts to coordinate matchmaking with, let's all remember how poorly that went for the now permabanned accounts that worked their way up the GC with that tactic.

Sunstar19

On the contrary I am trying to move up VT but I rarely meet a player who loses purposely. Without shame I really don’t mind if I’m matched more with such players so that it makes my climb easier

Perfect_jab

Grind an build your roster....what a joke. Annoying comment. I grind an grind only to keep pulling the same low tier champs that are no use to me. Titan after titan an no newer champs. Doesnt make me want to keep grinding or even keep playing. Just makes me disgusted an not want to play.

Maat1985

Perfect_jab said:

Grind an build your roster....what a joke. Annoying comment. I grind an grind only to keep pulling the same low tier champs that are no use to me. Titan after titan an no newer champs. Doesnt make me want to keep grinding or even keep playing. Just makes me disgusted an not want to play.

its ok to feel that way but it is just simply the nature of the game

PatientZero

Furrymoosen said:

PatientZero said:

To this..
If they only pinned players against accounts their size, then smaller accounts would have an easier road than larger accounts - that would not be fair

I agree, but if someone at my tier is able to make it to Diamond 2, I think the first option should be others that were able to grind their way to that tier.

There's nothing to say that bigger accounts didn't grind their way too.

When you queue for a match, you queue with the available players in your tier who also queue at the same time or with 10-15 seconds (the typical time it takes to find a match in VT). You're matched with the first available player in your tier (or closest tier if there aren't many on). Unless you coordinate with those similar accounts in same tier somehow, there's no way to guarantee any of them are even online at the same time. So your options are to take the first match you get, wait significantly longer for a match, or get no match at all.
And before you think about finding accounts to coordinate matchmaking with, let's all remember how poorly that went for the now permabanned accounts that worked their way up the GC with that tactic.

I appreciate this comment. It kind of puts the aggravation into perspective. So many just want to offer nothing, and instead just say something like, "be better." This comment does make perfect sense and I guess during my moment of irritation,I didn't take that in to consideration. I'm up to Diamond 1, and think this is where I'm going to top out. Gonna keep trying though.

PatientZero

Cretzu said:

PatientZero said:

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

In Alliance war you won’t be matched vs top alliances but also your rewards are less. In Battleground, the rewards are all the same. Why should someone with a small account be able to get the same rewards than the players with massive accounts who have grinded for years and spend money to advance their accounts, would that be fair to them?

Are you expecting to get to celestial just playing against small accounts with similar ratings? Doesn’t make sense.

True. The rewards are all the same. And it does make sense, the higher I get the more likely I'm going to go up against players that are stronger than I am. So, there seems to be a method to the madness.

BloodyRose

PatientZero said:

Cretzu said:

PatientZero said:

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

In Alliance war you won’t be matched vs top alliances but also your rewards are less. In Battleground, the rewards are all the same. Why should someone with a small account be able to get the same rewards than the players with massive accounts who have grinded for years and spend money to advance their accounts, would that be fair to them?

Are you expecting to get to celestial just playing against small accounts with similar ratings? Doesn’t make sense.

True. The rewards are all the same. And it does make sense, the higher I get the more likely I'm going to go up against players that are stronger than I am. So, there seems to be a method to the madness.

SOME people don't seem to understand that pushing us mid-tier players to the higher tiers is NOT helpful to us at all. They keep arguing that they are helping us by letting us win and advance to levels that are beyond our roster or ability. Blaming us for not appreciating them when THEY are being selfish.

JackTheSnack

Maat1985 said:

Perfect_jab said:

Grind an build your roster....what a joke. Annoying comment. I grind an grind only to keep pulling the same low tier champs that are no use to me. Titan after titan an no newer champs. Doesnt make me want to keep grinding or even keep playing. Just makes me disgusted an not want to play.

its ok to feel that way but it is just simply the nature of the game

This is the way I see it as well. And for this event it’s almost purely milestone based. Bear through it like the rest of us and get rid of those elders marks

Herbal_Taxman

BloodyRose said:

PatientZero said:

Cretzu said:

PatientZero said:

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

In Alliance war you won’t be matched vs top alliances but also your rewards are less. In Battleground, the rewards are all the same. Why should someone with a small account be able to get the same rewards than the players with massive accounts who have grinded for years and spend money to advance their accounts, would that be fair to them?

Are you expecting to get to celestial just playing against small accounts with similar ratings? Doesn’t make sense.

True. The rewards are all the same. And it does make sense, the higher I get the more likely I'm going to go up against players that are stronger than I am. So, there seems to be a method to the madness.

SOME people don't seem to understand that pushing us mid-tier players to the higher tiers is NOT helpful to us at all. They keep arguing that they are helping us by letting us win and advance to levels that are beyond our roster or ability. Blaming us for not appreciating them when THEY are being selfish.

So you would prefer that the stronger accounts kick your &$@ and keep you stuck in the same low tier? You realize that the majority of the worthwhile BG rewards come from processing into higher and higher tiers?

The whole obsession about people intentionally losing just doesn’t make sense to me. In VT, you get two medals for a win and you lose one medal when you are defeated. So for a big account to tread water and avoid moving up, they are losing a lot more often than winning. In aggregate, that seems like a benefit to weaker players rather than something that hurts them.

MizuriNicole

I made an alt account earlier this year, on January.

today it's 3m Hero rating with 4 rank 3's seven star champs and around 15 ascended champs.
I knew that the first 3-4 months I won't be able to pass above Gold in BG so I rushed content.
around June early summer I started reaching finally by end of the season to Vibranium only.

Today is the second season in row I reach on my alt to GC around mid season. no shields.

What I suggest to everyone new or progressing:
DONT Explore ACT 7, rush to 8 and 9 and do them 100%.
Skip on Carina.
Skip on Variants.
Save units for Mastery.

BloodyRose

Herbal_Taxman said:

BloodyRose said:

PatientZero said:

Cretzu said:

PatientZero said:

Just to clarify. I've been on this game for several years. I completely agree to grind and build your roster. This is how I got to Thronebreaker and building a stronger roster to get further. My single observation is in Battle Grounds. Everyone currently at my level should be pitted against each other. For example, in Alan's war, it's not going to put my alliance against a top tier alliance. That would be fair. That was my only complaint here. Every other aspect of the game is spot on, but they seem to get out of hand in BG. I appreciate everyone's feedback and I do agree with you for the majority of the game. Thank you.

In Alliance war you won’t be matched vs top alliances but also your rewards are less. In Battleground, the rewards are all the same. Why should someone with a small account be able to get the same rewards than the players with massive accounts who have grinded for years and spend money to advance their accounts, would that be fair to them?

Are you expecting to get to celestial just playing against small accounts with similar ratings? Doesn’t make sense.

True. The rewards are all the same. And it does make sense, the higher I get the more likely I'm going to go up against players that are stronger than I am. So, there seems to be a method to the madness.

SOME people don't seem to understand that pushing us mid-tier players to the higher tiers is NOT helpful to us at all. They keep arguing that they are helping us by letting us win and advance to levels that are beyond our roster or ability. Blaming us for not appreciating them when THEY are being selfish.

So you would prefer that the stronger accounts kick your &$@ and keep you stuck in the same low tier? You realize that the majority of the worthwhile BG rewards come from processing into higher and higher tiers?

The whole obsession about people intentionally losing just doesn’t make sense to me. In VT, you get two medals for a win and you lose one medal when you are defeated. So for a big account to tread water and avoid moving up, they are losing a lot more often than winning. In aggregate, that seems like a benefit to weaker players rather than something that hurts them.

YUP... You intentionally losing to my small account is NOT helpful to me.

logancloudzerz

I don't understand why people complain about being paired against higher accounts and not being able to progress ... maybe you've hit your cap. I play soccer with my kids but don't get angry that I can't play in the Olympics. It's a competitive mode, everyone maxes out somewhere.

TyEdge

“I think we should have an incentive structure that tells players to NOT rank up their champs”

Ummm ok scooter.

victor158

TheeMakaveli said:

There should be something like weight classes. Then, at the end of the season, something along the lines of a tourney between all classes on a level playing field. All classes have to use 4 stars or something.

Because there’s no skill required in a match-up where one player has a 35,000 PI playing a 48,000 PI, while the other player has to fight a 70,000 PI with their R4 18,000 PI.

Because I play these “Legends.” They’ll win match-ups with 45% health after 69 seconds with their 35,000 PI P2P rosters. They purchased every advantage, been on here for years, yet still can’t play!

Meanwhile, I’m at 18,000 fighting a 70,000 PI, and barring the perfect match-up, there’s no way I can even defeat the opponent in 120 seconds.

The math doesn’t math.

the problem is.... why should you get the same rewards as everyone else, when youre not on the level as everyone else. this is a roster building game first and foremost, and a fighting game second. the problem when making everyone using 4* champs is that it makes all a persons hard work to get ahead roster wise pointless.

sure, then it would just be "skill" based, disregarding the rng in drafts, but then people would be losing out on a core part of why they even play the game. if I cant use my 7r3 massacre in bgs, why did i even bother doing a bunch of hard challenges and using rare rank up materials, on a champ i cant even make use of.

if u have a solution that takes that into consideration, im sure kabam is all ears

England73738

I know the Original Poster has been getting some pelters for his opinion but I agree with him. There should be a secondary matchmaking part which determines the overall rating for the person's battle deck, and matches that person with someone within approvimately 10k of that value. I am in Silver IV. My top champ is 12k rated and my bottom champ is around 2k rated. I have just finished a BG match where my opponents top champ was 34k rated and his bottom champ was 23k rated. Obviously he must have also been in Silver IV but how am I meant to tackle that?! Bearing in mind my top 3 champs are always banned because they are so much better than my others so realistically the best I can expect is a few 7k champs in my roster of 7

willrun4adonut

England73738 said:

I know the Original Poster has been getting some pelters for his opinion but I agree with him. There should be a secondary matchmaking part which determines the overall rating for the person's battle deck, and matches that person with someone within approvimately 10k of that value. I am in Silver IV. My top champ is 12k rated and my bottom champ is around 2k rated. I have just finished a BG match where my opponents top champ was 34k rated and his bottom champ was 23k rated. Obviously he must have also been in Silver IV but how am I meant to tackle that?! Bearing in mind my top 3 champs are always banned because they are so much better than my others so realistically the best I can expect is a few 7k champs in my roster of 7

It would be better for you to focus on clearing story content and progression than BGs then.

DNA3000

TheeMakaveli said:

There should be something like weight classes. Then, at the end of the season, something along the lines of a tourney between all classes on a level playing field. All classes have to use 4 stars or something.

Because there’s no skill required in a match-up where one player has a 35,000 PI playing a 48,000 PI, while the other player has to fight a 70,000 PI with their R4 18,000 PI.

Because I play these “Legends.” They’ll win match-ups with 45% health after 69 seconds with their 35,000 PI P2P rosters. They purchased every advantage, been on here for years, yet still can’t play!

Meanwhile, I’m at 18,000 fighting a 70,000 PI, and barring the perfect match-up, there’s no way I can even defeat the opponent in 120 seconds.

The math doesn’t math.

Don’t go there. The math maths; if you want a tour of it just say the word.

DNA3000

England73738 said:

I know the Original Poster has been getting some pelters for his opinion but I agree with him. There should be a secondary matchmaking part which determines the overall rating for the person's battle deck, and matches that person with someone within approvimately 10k of that value. I am in Silver IV. My top champ is 12k rated and my bottom champ is around 2k rated. I have just finished a BG match where my opponents top champ was 34k rated and his bottom champ was 23k rated. Obviously he must have also been in Silver IV but how am I meant to tackle that?! Bearing in mind my top 3 champs are always banned because they are so much better than my others so realistically the best I can expect is a few 7k champs in my roster of 7

We already tried that and it was a disaster. That’s why we don’t do that anymore.

DNA3000

TheeMakaveli said:

victor158 said:

TheeMakaveli said:

There should be something like weight classes. Then, at the end of the season, something along the lines of a tourney between all classes on a level playing field. All classes have to use 4 stars or something.

Because there’s no skill required in a match-up where one player has a 35,000 PI playing a 48,000 PI, while the other player has to fight a 70,000 PI with their R4 18,000 PI.

Because I play these “Legends.” They’ll win match-ups with 45% health after 69 seconds with their 35,000 PI P2P rosters. They purchased every advantage, been on here for years, yet still can’t play!

Meanwhile, I’m at 18,000 fighting a 70,000 PI, and barring the perfect match-up, there’s no way I can even defeat the opponent in 120 seconds.

The math doesn’t math.

the problem is.... why should you get the same rewards as everyone else, when youre not on the level as everyone else. this is a roster building game first and foremost, and a fighting game second. the problem when making everyone using 4* champs is that it makes all a persons hard work to get ahead roster wise pointless.

sure, then it would just be "skill" based, disregarding the rng in drafts, but then people would be losing out on a core part of why they even play the game. if I cant use my 7r3 massacre in bgs, why did i even bother doing a bunch of hard challenges and using rare rank up materials, on a champ i cant even make use of.

if u have a solution that takes that into consideration, im sure kabam is all ears

Honestly, I’m not really concerned with fairness for P2P players. You guys circumvented fairness with your first Apple Purchase.

Fair would be if everyone had to pay exactly the same amount to play the game. MCOC is not a charity. In the end, the only reason free to play players are allowed to play the game is because someone else pays for them.

The compromise F2P games make is most people can play for free, so long as they consider it fair that the people who actually support the game get something reasonable for their support.

You don’t have to care about fairness for the spending players. That’s a luxury afforded to you by the very players you don’t care about.

Let me know when you want that math lesson.

Graves_3

Herbal_Taxman said:

If you’re not concerned with fairness for P2P, you can’t even imagine how little we care about the whims of F2P crusaders who believe there’s something valorous about maximizing their enjoyment of a product to which they contribute nothing.

It seems like you’re incapable of understanding OP’s point about roster-building. But don’t worry, just keep grinding Capt F2P, maybe one day you’ll understand…

For all the talk about skill, I am sure that P2P whale would easily humble him/her if there is a match with just 3 or 4 star deck. All the people demanding fairness and roster matching where they don’t want to face huge accounts probably disregard the fact that most with large accounts have been playing for a long time and know the ins and outs of the champs/interactions with nodes and are also far more skilled than them.

Herbal_Taxman

lol, we aren’t worried about favoritism. We already have our advantage. It’s great. There are never P2P people complaining on here, just F2P jokers hallucinating what they think is happening in our minds.

Indo

It’s filled with modders in gc

Indo

modder

JessieS

PatientZero said:

I've been fighting my way to to achieve enough points to be eligible for the top tier community event rewards. I have found several issues with this. First, there are people purposely losing just not to advance and stay at the lower tiers for points. Not realizing this at first, I grinded for days to get points. Next, I have had several fights where it's over and neither my defender nor their attacker lost anything, granting a guaranteed 15,000. They pause the game in order to average points. So, now that I made it to a higher tier, it's absolutely stupid. My highest champions are the ones I invested in, 23,000 or so. The rest are like 15k and lower. I am consistently being matched up against Legend or others with awakened 7 star rank 3 champs. When the lowest champion I'm fighting is 33,000, it gets to a point that I'm just done with it. Why isn't their any matchmaking ability that keeps the playing field fair? Why not a way to match players by their highest ranked player in the roster or limit what the opponent can select. With the sheer unfairness of the event, I don't even want to play anymore. I think the only way to get points is to cheat. Purposely lose, stay way low so you stay in the lower brackets and just pause every game so you average 15000. Unless I'm extremely lucky, I'll never win against people dropping a buffed up 78,000 Serpent against my 14,300 Havoc. Maybe I'm wrong, but my latest discussions seems like most are in agreement with me. I should not be matched up against the whales.

It’s not cheating . It’s strategy . Just use energy to and quit fights to keep you in lower rankings and use marks for when you oaky to win . Then when you reached all the rewards just play to always win
. It’s not that hard . The issue thing is stupid and a waste of time . You should only use it with Nick Fury to end up at 100% after your decoy gets destroyed