It is a good response to getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar.
Nah… I think the team didn’t fully consider all the angles when this was initially launched, took the time and read the feedback on this thread, considered it and adjusted.
If we want to have a chance to engage in discussions like this in the future then it doesn’t make sense to bash them further for taking the time to hear us out and offer a compromise.
Sometimes the right response is a simple thanks to let them know we’re all people too.
Making a limited offer like this available to all was going to realistically result in maybe a handful more R2s and maybe an extra couple R3s for some. Minimal impact.
The class catalysts would have limited the rest of us and Kabam coulda hand a small W on their hands as this would not have helped us keep pace with the largest spenders but it would have shown fair treatment across the board in an effort to rebalance the SBCs pay outs.
+1 - it also would have stopped that gap from widening too much that they want to keep in check..or so I read.
We all had to endure those SBCs aka t6cc crystals.
I honestly don’t think opening this deal to the rest of us would have impacted that gap either way. Those that got this deal probably had the ability to R2 every 7star they own or close to it and/or had to dump catalysts into 6stars to prevent items expiring… while adding many R3 7stars as well.
What is telling though, and why it seems to me that this is a knee jerk reaction to appease mega spenders, is that apparently the SBCs were so imbalanced towards class catalysts that the game team opted to remove any cap limits on this offer to make sure all of the mega spenders would be happy. They didn’t take the time analyze what would be needed to balance the drop rates from the SBC, they simply made it unlimited.
I do think some of the folks who believe that expanding this deal to the rest of us would have hurt the game economy and shortened the life span of 7stars are raising a concern from a logical thought process. But I remain unconvinced that this is the case. Class catalysts and T4as for most of us who participated in the event are probably not in overflow, and if they are are probably not going to provide more than a few extra rank ups. I don’t think that will accelerate things anymore than the need to keep the whales invested in the next chase… which many of them not only have multiple R4s but all the relevant trophy champs at high or max sig… including Jessica Jones. Oh and a 7star of their choice next year… which from watching USAFAs stream it seems spenders at that tier got a preview list too. So all that to say what are they even chasing then coming out of this… and how is that not bad for the game economy? Consider that less than 1% of them carried approximately 10% of the realm score… I’ll let that settle in.
Personally I’m not that fused about getting this deal or not. I do think it makes more sense than not for the team to extend this deal or a version of it to the rest of us, but I’m not going to lose any sleep over it. It would at least offer an olive branch to other spenders that their dollars matter to Kabam as well, if FTPs get to benefit too, who cares, most of them invest so much time and energy into the game they deserve a windfall too.
Most ironic about this thread though… are some of the people who seem to be ok with this band aid patch offer, seem to be the ones who leap on top of others saying “buyer beware” and “it’s not Kabam’s responsibility to manage player inventories”. And here’s a situation where ultimately this would have been the best answer to the situation and they are picking the opposite side. That’s worth a chuckle.
TBF I was being sarcastic! The premise that banquet crystals had to have high drop rates of lesser-desired resources to keep the whales in check was always flimsy. No matter what drop rates are there, true whales will buy enough crystals to get what they want as SuperBroZ proved. He didn't want just 1 but at least 3 7r4 and he ended up with 5 - before the rank rewards even dropped. He will have at least 7 or 8 now if he used those rewards.
Yeah… this deal eradicated any ground that premise stood on.
I’m not saying there shouldn’t be a gap or extra privilege for spending at this level… it’s just more a comment on what was communicated to us vs actions.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
Making a limited offer like this available to all was going to realistically result in maybe a handful more R2s and maybe an extra couple R3s for some. Minimal impact.
The class catalysts would have limited the rest of us and Kabam coulda hand a small W on their hands as this would not have helped us keep pace with the largest spenders but it would have shown fair treatment across the board in an effort to rebalance the SBCs pay outs.
+1 - it also would have stopped that gap from widening too much that they want to keep in check..or so I read.
We all had to endure those SBCs aka t6cc crystals.
I honestly don’t think opening this deal to the rest of us would have impacted that gap either way. Those that got this deal probably had the ability to R2 every 7star they own or close to it and/or had to dump catalysts into 6stars to prevent items expiring… while adding many R3 7stars as well.
What is telling though, and why it seems to me that this is a knee jerk reaction to appease mega spenders, is that apparently the SBCs were so imbalanced towards class catalysts that the game team opted to remove any cap limits on this offer to make sure all of the mega spenders would be happy. They didn’t take the time analyze what would be needed to balance the drop rates from the SBC, they simply made it unlimited.
I do think some of the folks who believe that expanding this deal to the rest of us would have hurt the game economy and shortened the life span of 7stars are raising a concern from a logical thought process. But I remain unconvinced that this is the case. Class catalysts and T4as for most of us who participated in the event are probably not in overflow, and if they are are probably not going to provide more than a few extra rank ups. I don’t think that will accelerate things anymore than the need to keep the whales invested in the next chase… which many of them not only have multiple R4s but all the relevant trophy champs at high or max sig… including Jessica Jones. Oh and a 7star of their choice next year… which from watching USAFAs stream it seems spenders at that tier got a preview list too. So all that to say what are they even chasing then coming out of this… and how is that not bad for the game economy? Consider that less than 1% of them carried approximately 10% of the realm score… I’ll let that settle in.
Personally I’m not that fused about getting this deal or not. I do think it makes more sense than not for the team to extend this deal or a version of it to the rest of us, but I’m not going to lose any sleep over it. It would at least offer an olive branch to other spenders that their dollars matter to Kabam as well, if FTPs get to benefit too, who cares, most of them invest so much time and energy into the game they deserve a windfall too.
Most ironic about this thread though… are some of the people who seem to be ok with this band aid patch offer, seem to be the ones who leap on top of others saying “buyer beware” and “it’s not Kabam’s responsibility to manage player inventories”. And here’s a situation where ultimately this would have been the best answer to the situation and they are picking the opposite side. That’s worth a chuckle.
TBF I was being sarcastic! The premise that banquet crystals had to have high drop rates of lesser-desired resources to keep the whales in check was always flimsy. No matter what drop rates are there, true whales will buy enough crystals to get what they want as SuperBroZ proved. He didn't want just 1 but at least 3 7r4 and he ended up with 5 - before the rank rewards even dropped. He will have at least 7 or 8 now if he used those rewards.
Yeah… this deal eradicated any ground that premise stood on.
I’m not saying there shouldn’t be a gap or extra privilege for spending at this level… it’s just more a comment on what was communicated to us vs actions.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
Thank you.
Dr. Zola
Love the comparison, specially when it also means that a regular Joe can go into a High Limit room with enough to do 1 single bet.
This is awesome but I'm more interested in what a certain forum personality will say about this news who's been confidently confirming nothing like this will happen
Definitely appreciated. Like another user said, I never wanted to get free compensation out of these debacle. I just wanted to ability to purchase some myself with my units. I did the rankups I was toeing around for the past week or 2, and as expected, I’m back to not having enough T6CC to continue until my stock replenishes. Balanced as all things should be.
It is a good response to getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar.
Nah… I think the team didn’t fully consider all the angles when this was initially launched, took the time and read the feedback on this thread, considered it and adjusted.
If we want to have a chance to engage in discussions like this in the future then it doesn’t make sense to bash them further for taking the time to hear us out and offer a compromise.
Sometimes the right response is a simple thanks to let them know we’re all people too.
My point was I don't think that they thought about it getting out and the backlash they'd get.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
On behalf of my alliance we thank you, it takes something in people to recognize mistakes, and improve upon them. I think we need you to be a Kabam representative on the forums lol.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
I think we need you to be a Kabam representative on the forums lol.
It is a good response to getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar.
Nah… I think the team didn’t fully consider all the angles when this was initially launched, took the time and read the feedback on this thread, considered it and adjusted.
If we want to have a chance to engage in discussions like this in the future then it doesn’t make sense to bash them further for taking the time to hear us out and offer a compromise.
Sometimes the right response is a simple thanks to let them know we’re all people too.
My point was I don't think that they thought about it getting out and the backlash they'd get.
More likely the reverse. They assume everything they do will suffer backlash, so if they stopped to consider the backlash that might accrue after every decision they'd be completely paralyzed. And once anything gets into the hands of players not under an NDA limitation, they always assume it will get out.
Many decisions suffer strong backlash but the devs stick to them, because the backlash however strong doesn't undermine the original logic of the decision. In this case, I suspect it was the very logic of the decision that created an avenue for this to happen. As I said earlier, the presumption was that the original offer had very limited overall balance impact to the players it was offered to, and was therefore a reasonable way to give a needed and otherwise non-existent opportunity to rebalance the stashes of the largest whales. It wasn't seen as something necessary beyond those extreme edge cases.
However, the very fact that the devs already went through the thought process to determine that the offer had very limited and short-term impact on resource balance for a limited set of players meant they could become more comfortable with extending it to larger set of players that would also see limited balance impact overall: Valiant players. In this case, the backlash had an already established pathway to convince the devs to do more than they originally thought was necessary.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
Thank you crashed for doing the right thing. I’ve been a big critic, but this was definitely an olive branch to valiants and acknowledgment of our frustration. Still waiting to see your post mortem write up though.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
this is good to see, and as Valiant i am going to benefit from it, but i do worry about it creating a bit of a wall for upcoming Valiant players. this deal will allow existing Valiants to do a lot of 6r4->r5, 7r1->r2, and maybe 7r2->r3 rankups that would have otherwise taken longer (main limitation being immediate access to t6cc and possibly t4a, although also gives us one t4a for 200 units if we buy ahead of the updated Sigil change-in).
but it becomes a pull-ahead mechanic for existing Valiants vs future ones. i hope Kabam considers making this available to every new Valiant, for 3 days. yes, with planning ahead they could perhaps stockpile t6cc to take advantage, but that's hard enough to do pre-Valiant, and even if so, a catch-up mechanic is not as big a negative to game economy/health.
then again maybe it doesn't matter, titles aren't real, birds aren't real, etc.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
Really happy with this solution for valiants, given the context. Thanks for taking on board the feedback in this thread and acting on it.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
this is good to see, and as Valiant i am going to benefit from it, but i do worry about it creating a bit of a wall for upcoming Valiant players. this deal will allow existing Valiants to do a lot of 6r4->r5, 7r1->r2, and maybe 7r2->r3 rankups that would have otherwise taken longer (main limitation being immediate access to t6cc and possibly t4a, although also gives us one t4a for 200 units if we buy ahead of the updated Sigil change-in).
but it becomes a pull-ahead mechanic for existing Valiants vs future ones. i hope Kabam considers making this available to every new Valiant, for 3 days. yes, with planning ahead they could perhaps stockpile t6cc to take advantage, but that's hard enough to do pre-Valiant, and even if so, a catch-up mechanic is not as big a negative to game economy/health.
then again maybe it doesn't matter, titles aren't real, birds aren't real, etc.
We have been complaining about Valiant being grouped with TB all along, this is not the best fix; but it helps a bit...
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
this is good to see, and as Valiant i am going to benefit from it, but i do worry about it creating a bit of a wall for upcoming Valiant players. this deal will allow existing Valiants to do a lot of 6r4->r5, 7r1->r2, and maybe 7r2->r3 rankups that would have otherwise taken longer (main limitation being immediate access to t6cc and possibly t4a, although also gives us one t4a for 200 units if we buy ahead of the updated Sigil change-in).
but it becomes a pull-ahead mechanic for existing Valiants vs future ones. i hope Kabam considers making this available to every new Valiant, for 3 days. yes, with planning ahead they could perhaps stockpile t6cc to take advantage, but that's hard enough to do pre-Valiant, and even if so, a catch-up mechanic is not as big a negative to game economy/health.
then again maybe it doesn't matter, titles aren't real, birds aren't real, etc.
"Future Valiants" will be playing in a game where Valiant isn't the top title, and Valiant resources will be commensurately easier to get. There are already lots of existing mechanisms built into the game economy that slow down everyone in the top progression tier and act to push lower progress players upward faster than the past players did when that lower tier was the top progression tier. The only reason why the offer is being allowed to be extended to current Valiants is precisely because the associated acceleration is temporary, and game inflation depreciates them over time. If the problem you mention was actually a problem, if it was going to cause some permanent relic to exist for all time in the game, it would force the devs to not extend the offer in the first place.
In my opinion, if you do something for one tier of player, it should done for every tier of players. I'm paragon and I'm fine with valiant getting a 10 unit offer. But why not the same offer according to your progression level? 25 units for paragon. 50 units for cav. And so on. We ALL participated in the event, so we should ALL be involved in the "compensation package".
In my opinion, if you do something for one tier of player, it should done for every tier of players. I'm paragon and I'm fine with valiant getting a 10 unit offer. But why not the same offer according to your progression level? 25 units for paragon. 50 units for cav. And so on. We ALL participated in the event, so we should ALL be involved in the "compensation package".
The lower you go, the more compounding problems you create that will need to be resolved later.
In my opinion, if you do something for one tier of player, it should done for every tier of players. I'm paragon and I'm fine with valiant getting a 10 unit offer. But why not the same offer according to your progression level? 25 units for paragon. 50 units for cav. And so on. We ALL participated in the event, so we should ALL be involved in the "compensation package".
Making a limited offer like this available to all was going to realistically result in maybe a handful more R2s and maybe an extra couple R3s for some. Minimal impact.
The class catalysts would have limited the rest of us and Kabam coulda hand a small W on their hands as this would not have helped us keep pace with the largest spenders but it would have shown fair treatment across the board in an effort to rebalance the SBCs pay outs.
+1 - it also would have stopped that gap from widening too much that they want to keep in check..or so I read.
We all had to endure those SBCs aka t6cc crystals.
I honestly don’t think opening this deal to the rest of us would have impacted that gap either way. Those that got this deal probably had the ability to R2 every 7star they own or close to it and/or had to dump catalysts into 6stars to prevent items expiring… while adding many R3 7stars as well.
What is telling though, and why it seems to me that this is a knee jerk reaction to appease mega spenders, is that apparently the SBCs were so imbalanced towards class catalysts that the game team opted to remove any cap limits on this offer to make sure all of the mega spenders would be happy. They didn’t take the time analyze what would be needed to balance the drop rates from the SBC, they simply made it unlimited.
I do think some of the folks who believe that expanding this deal to the rest of us would have hurt the game economy and shortened the life span of 7stars are raising a concern from a logical thought process. But I remain unconvinced that this is the case. Class catalysts and T4as for most of us who participated in the event are probably not in overflow, and if they are are probably not going to provide more than a few extra rank ups. I don’t think that will accelerate things anymore than the need to keep the whales invested in the next chase… which many of them not only have multiple R4s but all the relevant trophy champs at high or max sig… including Jessica Jones. Oh and a 7star of their choice next year… which from watching USAFAs stream it seems spenders at that tier got a preview list too. So all that to say what are they even chasing then coming out of this… and how is that not bad for the game economy? Consider that less than 1% of them carried approximately 10% of the realm score… I’ll let that settle in.
Personally I’m not that fused about getting this deal or not. I do think it makes more sense than not for the team to extend this deal or a version of it to the rest of us, but I’m not going to lose any sleep over it. It would at least offer an olive branch to other spenders that their dollars matter to Kabam as well, if FTPs get to benefit too, who cares, most of them invest so much time and energy into the game they deserve a windfall too.
Most ironic about this thread though… are some of the people who seem to be ok with this band aid patch offer, seem to be the ones who leap on top of others saying “buyer beware” and “it’s not Kabam’s responsibility to manage player inventories”. And here’s a situation where ultimately this would have been the best answer to the situation and they are picking the opposite side. That’s worth a chuckle.
TBF I was being sarcastic! The premise that banquet crystals had to have high drop rates of lesser-desired resources to keep the whales in check was always flimsy. No matter what drop rates are there, true whales will buy enough crystals to get what they want as SuperBroZ proved. He didn't want just 1 but at least 3 7r4 and he ended up with 5 - before the rank rewards even dropped. He will have at least 7 or 8 now if he used those rewards.
Yeah… this deal eradicated any ground that premise stood on.
I’m not saying there shouldn’t be a gap or extra privilege for spending at this level… it’s just more a comment on what was communicated to us vs actions.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
Thank you.
Dr. Zola
Love the comparison, specially when it also means that a regular Joe can go into a High Limit room with enough to do 1 single bet.
Aha…you saw the comment that was in draft form before I edited!!!
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
For all the shouting that is done over matters which we don’t (always) agree with, matters that cause immense frustration (at times), I firmly believe that an equal amount of noise should be made when things do go right.
For this reason, and irrespective of how we got to this point (that is a separate matter entirely) I would like to say thank you for listening to the feedback here Crashed, and for making the decision to extend this offer to Valiant players… fair dues.
There were some good points made in this thread, and we didn't want to leave things as they were, so we decided to release this to all Valiant players.
Now you will have to excuse me, I need to make a spreadsheet for my plans with this haha.
For all the shouting that is done over matters which we don’t (always) agree with, matters that cause immense frustration (at times), I firmly believe that an equal amount of noise should be made when things do go right.
For this reason, and irrespective of how we got to this point (that is a separate matter entirely) I would like to say thank you for listening to the feedback here Crashed, and for making the decision to extend this offer to Valiant players… fair dues.
Hello. I'm working on a lengthy Banquet post-mortem for all of you, but I'm just going to go ahead and try to head this one off at the pass now.
The reason the Banquet crystal was unbalanced was 100% on me. Our Live Ops team produced a perfectly balanced tuning for the crystal in which this wouldn't have been a problem. In reviewing it, I counted all T6B/T3A drops as filler, and in an effort to reduce the amount of filler I moved some of those drops to other resources. For most players this wasn't a problem. I personally put up around 100,000 points and finished ~1500th, and for me the imbalance wasn't perceptible.
However in monitoring the event over the break, we realized players at the top were going to put up more points than we expected, and for them it was going to become a real problem. So we did something quick and dirty to help them correct the imbalance. If I could go back in time to before the event I would have thought of something else, but I'm pretty sure players wouldn't have liked the Banquet event more if it had included more T6B/T3A in the crystals.
I personally don't see this as a fairness problem, as I can tell you the difference between my account and these accounts has nothing to do with T6B/T3A. And I don't see it as these players getting to buy T6B/T3A for 10 Units, I see them as getting to buy T6B/T3A for 750,000 Units + 10 Units, which is what somebody had to spend to unlock this offer.
You've probably already reached this conclusion, but a Monday Morning quarterback fix of these crystals would have been T6B T3A fragments alongside all of the T6 class fragments. That would have gone a long way to fixing these.
Putting these out there at 10 units is a great gesture of good faith. I only request a temporary increase of the storage capacity of these assets.
In my opinion, if you do something for one tier of player, it should done for every tier of players. I'm paragon and I'm fine with valiant getting a 10 unit offer. But why not the same offer according to your progression level? 25 units for paragon. 50 units for cav. And so on. We ALL participated in the event, so we should ALL be involved in the "compensation package".
Because Valiants shouldn't have been lumped in with paragon and TB in the first place in banquet, or damn near every event, really. It's not good enough you and TB players got the exact same rewards as we di if you had the units, so they should offer you this deal at a slightly marked up price? It's about time variants got something the rest of the players don't besides a once a year xmas gift that was progression based.
Comments
If we want to have a chance to engage in discussions like this in the future then it doesn’t make sense to bash them further for taking the time to hear us out and offer a compromise.
Sometimes the right response is a simple thanks to let them know we’re all people too.
Dr. Zola
I think we need you to be a Kabam representative on the forums lol.
Many decisions suffer strong backlash but the devs stick to them, because the backlash however strong doesn't undermine the original logic of the decision. In this case, I suspect it was the very logic of the decision that created an avenue for this to happen. As I said earlier, the presumption was that the original offer had very limited overall balance impact to the players it was offered to, and was therefore a reasonable way to give a needed and otherwise non-existent opportunity to rebalance the stashes of the largest whales. It wasn't seen as something necessary beyond those extreme edge cases.
However, the very fact that the devs already went through the thought process to determine that the offer had very limited and short-term impact on resource balance for a limited set of players meant they could become more comfortable with extending it to larger set of players that would also see limited balance impact overall: Valiant players. In this case, the backlash had an already established pathway to convince the devs to do more than they originally thought was necessary.
but it becomes a pull-ahead mechanic for existing Valiants vs future ones. i hope Kabam considers making this available to every new Valiant, for 3 days. yes, with planning ahead they could perhaps stockpile t6cc to take advantage, but that's hard enough to do pre-Valiant, and even if so, a catch-up mechanic is not as big a negative to game economy/health.
then again maybe it doesn't matter, titles aren't real, birds aren't real, etc.
Dr. Zola
For this reason, and irrespective of how we got to this point (that is a separate matter entirely) I would like to say thank you for listening to the feedback here Crashed, and for making the decision to extend this offer to Valiant players… fair dues.
Putting these out there at 10 units is a great gesture of good faith. I only request a temporary increase of the storage capacity of these assets.
It's not good enough you and TB players got the exact same rewards as we di if you had the units, so they should offer you this deal at a slightly marked up price?
It's about time variants got something the rest of the players don't besides a once a year xmas gift that was progression based.