I think what we can agree on is that the primary reason for Account Sharing being outlawed is to avoid players getting a competitive advantage. Competitive advantage can be gained in all the combat areas of the game. Let's be honest, there is no evidence to suggest letting some "lucky" family member open your crystals has any bearing on the outcome... no competitive advantage.
Correct. They're just splitting hairs to argue. We're all aware of what Account Sharing is. It involves giving your Login Information to other Players.
Kabam have made no qualification that sharing your details is only against TOS if the other person is a "player". It is sharing your account details with anyone, which brings me to a secondary reason Kabam outlaw account sharing. They can insulate themselves against issues with the account. How many times have we seen someone post... my son/daughter blah blah sold all my 5* champs, Kabam please give them back! Kabam make it easy by saying, you're the account holder, whatever happens on that account is your responsibility as you are the only one using it.
It's already been mentioned specifically that two people in the same room, sharing the same device is not what they mean by Account Sharing. If you wanted to get technical, it is, but it's not the sort of thing they are looking to ban.
I think they would look to prevent it if it provides a competitive advantage. Same room, same device is still account sharing. Consider the following scenarios:
1) I open an account and all I like to do is open crystals, but my roommate does all the fighting. Is this account sharing? Only one person ever does the fights.
2) I own an account and my roommate and I take alternating shifts in arena. He is not another account holder. There is a definite competitive advantage.
Same device, same account. Are these considered account sharing? Are these considered equal infringements?
I think what we can agree on is that the primary reason for Account Sharing being outlawed is to avoid players getting a competitive advantage. Competitive advantage can be gained in all the combat areas of the game. Let's be honest, there is no evidence to suggest letting some "lucky" family member open your crystals has any bearing on the outcome... no competitive advantage.
Correct. They're just splitting hairs to argue. We're all aware of what Account Sharing is. It involves giving your Login Information to other Players.
Kabam have made no qualification that sharing your details is only against TOS if the other person is a "player". It is sharing your account details with anyone, which brings me to a secondary reason Kabam outlaw account sharing. They can insulate themselves against issues with the account. How many times have we seen someone post... my son/daughter blah blah sold all my 5* champs, Kabam please give them back! Kabam make it easy by saying, you're the account holder, whatever happens on that account is your responsibility as you are the only one using it.
It's already been mentioned specifically that two people in the same room, sharing the same device is not what they mean by Account Sharing. If you wanted to get technical, it is, but it's not the sort of thing they are looking to ban.
I think they would look to prevent it if it provides a competitive advantage. Same room, same device is still account sharing. Consider the following scenarios:
1) I open an account and all I like to do is open crystals, but my roommate does all the fighting. Is this account sharing? Only one person ever does the fights.
2) I own an account and my roommate and I take alternating shifts in arena. He is not another account holder. There is a definite competitive advantage.
Same device, same account. Are these considered account sharing? Are these considered equal infringements?
Is it Sharing? Technically yes. Is it what they're looking for in terms of dealing with it? Probably not. There's no way to enforce that without some sort of admission. The question in the old Forum was whether allowing a sibling to take turns was an issue. The response was that it is not what they mean by Account Sharing.
We don't need to split hairs. We know exactly what we're talking about. Swapping Logins and having people run your Account. You're not allowed to share your Account details with anyone.
Mike or adora, can you respond and acknowledge this is an issue? I also submitted a ticket and have video showing alliance piloting. These piloting alliance should be disqualified from season rewards
Hi!
If you've witnessed suspected cheating in game, submitting a support ticket is appreciated. We take violations of the terms of service seriously and will investigate the situation. But keep in mind, we will not discuss any actions taken with third parties. So you will not be updated on the status of your report.
Unless your then you can participate in account sharing multiple times with no repercussions
Not supposed to call out specific players in the forums check the rules.
Also these threads are really quite meaningless. Unless you have a degree in computer science and or game design and development most aren't qualified to even remotely speculate how they could implement a practical solution to stop piloting and account sharing.
The only way they could realistically stop sharing is to make the game sprint-able. What does that mean well basically no limits on energy, and no recharge timers, basically infinite energy to move as much as possible. Players could than sit down for an hour or 2 or split it up into sections to clear maps in AQ, AW would need to remove linked nodes so no one would be reliant on someone else to move to clear their path, same could also work for AQ. This would be all well and good however the flaw is that this removes the team work aspect of the game modes in a big way by not requiring any coordination with fellow alliance members.
Perhaps a more practical solution could also be to simply reduce the amount of nodes AQ and AW maps have thus reducing the energy total needed to complete. This would mean more time can be spent away from the game while still being able to manage the maps. As an example imagine how much time players could take back for themselves if AQ maps were restructured to 2 sections max and points adjusted accordingly. I get the design philosophy about the harder maps but the more dedicated players may also have obligations outside of the game.
tl:dr
Lots of complaining no solid practical solutions provided, and there is apparently no good reason anyone could possibly have to give for why they needed a bud to help them with the game while they were busy.
Funny how your saying check the rules but it's ok for man crush to break them
Right. Even a temporary ban would work. 2 days banned. The alliance if running map 6 or competitive war would kick them.
And that little deterrent would be enough to stop everyone.
I think that's a good idea. I don't know the logistics of implementing it but that kind of deterrent would have a real impact on changing the culture without going overboard.
@GroundedWisdom I guess I would consider competitive advantage to be the defining factor of what is punishable account sharing and not the fact that actual credentials were shared... whether or not they can detect it or not is another matter.
If I log in my tablet and set it in my recreation room and tell my family, whenever they have free time, please grind arena for me and placed in the top 150 for 5* featured and then compare this to someone moving me in AQ. Let's say they move me and don't even fight. They move on empty nodes. As a player, I would be more upset with the former scenario. What are your thoughts on that?
[I love how so many people are trying to justify how cheating is ok. Look at all the comments here and other threads on this topic.... There is a whole community of players who are ready to see a change and see the game feel fair so enjoy feeling like you matter or mean something. If kabam doesnt address this then I will personally raise hell with apple and google which they do not approve of companies that allow certain players to violate tos because of profits. Netmarble has already been pressured to shut games down in the past for this exact reason (marvel war of heroes) and most players were able to get a refund of every penny spent from the moment there account was created to the point the game was shut down. The players who couldn't get refunds were those who had evidence against them for violaton of tos.
Is this game worth being shut down because people want to cheat?
Explain how any of this is true. How was Marvel war of heroes shutdown because of TOS violations? How is Netmarble connected to marvel war of heroes?
How would you enforce that? You couldn't. Unless you can prove that someone in your family is a Master Grinder and they indeed placed for you, there's nothing that can be done. I highly doubt that it's what happens, not impossible, but not likely. What was being discussed was someone wanting to try the game.
Would it be wrong in your example? Yes. Someone wouldn't be playing for their own Rewards. Would I support taking action against them? Sure. There's just no way of detecting that and dealing with it.
However, if you're asking me if one is a lesser evil, it's not as gradient for me. It's not the individual act of someone moving another in War or AQ. It's the widespread existence of it. The simple fact is, if someone is not on their Account, they can't move. When you have Pilots and Ally Members doing double work for others, it's an unfair advantage. It doesn't matter if they are just doing what someone can do or not. It's wrong. It's not isolated incidents. It's a huge problem, one that has been going on for some time, and countless excuses have been made for it. Allies are demanding it as a requirement for Membership. People have been going by some false sense of being untouchable. Players are putting their Accounts at risk because they're misinformed by other Members. Allies are working double time for Rewards, and some Members are driving the Accounts of the entire Ally. It's not a lesser evil in my mind.
In both cases, the Account Piloting and the family member that Grinds for your 5*, it's wrong. One thing does not excuse or justify another for me.
Also let me pose this question to you how would deal with those that played for and completed other players content with out exchanging login info but had access to a device already logged with the account? Figure that answer and solution out and you may just be on to a real solution for piloting.
You make it sound like people here actually want a "solution". They don't.
They just want to vent because they claim that some target of their hate didn't get punish when in reality, the only reason that he even posted the video was because he was punished. And he was punished because there is no denying that an illegal hero was used in AW. There was no need to send an email to confess or make a video of it.There's game data to show that an inappropriate hero was used and there are witnesses (such as the other alliance) to that fact.
Nobody can say the same thing about "piloting" but they don't care. Do we see a sign confession from the other guy who allegedly used his account? Do we even know if this "Top Gun" actually exist and not a story made up to spice up the misdeed of using the wrong hero in AW? He claims to have a good time drinking that night. Not many of us can use a wrong hero in AW, only a very limited group of people even have the opportunity to make such a screw up. Was the story fabricated to create sympathy?
They simply don't care if anything can be proven. To them, making a statement is proof enough. In their minds, there is no need for facts to support a statement, none at all. So just admit to murder; a dead body isn't needed.
How would you enforce that? You couldn't. Unless you can prove that someone in your family is a Master Grinder and they indeed placed for you, there's nothing that can be done. I highly doubt that it's what happens, not impossible, but not likely. What was being discussed was someone wanting to try the game.
Would it be wrong in your example? Yes. Someone wouldn't be playing for their own Rewards. Would I support taking action against them? Sure. There's just no way of detecting that and dealing with it.
That's why I said that whether or not they can be detected is another matter. You would, as you've said, essentially require an admission. The point being that it's an example of account sharing that I would consider cheating that don't involved sharing login details, but does involve getting a competitive advantage.
However, if you're asking me if one is a lesser evil, it's not as gradient for me. It's not the individual act of someone moving another in War or AQ. It's the widespread existence of it. The simple fact is, if someone is not on their Account, they can't move.
Which is why I'm promoting the idea of increasing the availability of energy for AQ maps. Really, what do Kabam get out of restricting energy in AQ? All they do is make players stay up at night or wake up early in the morning to help their alliance complete maps. You can't buy energy to complete AQ maps, unlike solo play. The biggest difficulty in AQ is not the level of play, it's the energy restriction and that is why people pilot.
AW is a different matter. Obviously piloting there allows players to get rewards that based on their skill level, they do not deserve.
I know you've already said that just because alliances run particular AQ maps doesn't justify widespread piloting, so then why doesn't Kabam just create an environment where it isn't required? AQ can punish people for having a life, is that really what a game wants to promote?
Also let me pose this question to you how would deal with those that played for and completed other players content with out exchanging login info but had access to a device already logged with the account? Figure that answer and solution out and you may just be on to a real solution for piloting.
You make it sound like people here actually want a "solution". They don't.
They just want to vent because they claim that some target of their hate didn't get punish when in reality, the only reason that he even posted the video was because he was punished. And he was punished because there is no denying that an illegal hero was used in AW. There was no need to send an email to confess or make a video of it.There's game data to show that an inappropriate hero was used and there are witnesses (such as the other alliance) to that fact.
Nobody can say the same thing about "piloting" but they don't care. Do we see a sign confession from the other guy who allegedly used his account? Do we even know if this "Top Gun" actually exist and not a story made up to spice up the misdeed of using the wrong hero in AW? He claims to have a good time drinking that night. Not many of us can use a wrong hero in AW, only a very limited group of people even have the opportunity to make such a screw up. Was the story fabricated to create sympathy?
They simply don't care if anything can be proven. To them, making a statement is proof enough. In their minds, there is no need for facts to support a statement, none at all. So just admit to murder; a dead body isn't needed.
Lmao I think thou doth protest too much.
Also, I actually do have a confession. Some people only really talk with their own alliance in this community. Some of us intermingle a lot more than that. The details of this episode are very much common knowledge to many people, as they were told first hand. I won't be calling anyone out like he did tho. The only part that wasn't true was it being framed as a "special occasion" kinda thing.
As for the precedent set, this is just one example of many in my line groups. Across the board, people are taking this as a thumbs up from kabam. Not many actually care about the cc program or at least who is doing the videos. In the end, that's just a game-related thing with no impact on a player's account. It's like I was doing 120mph in a lambo that I was reviewing for Car and Driver.. But the cops didn't ticket me, only said I couldn't do reviews for Car and Driver anymore.
Also let me pose this question to you how would deal with those that played for and completed other players content with out exchanging login info but had access to a device already logged with the account? Figure that answer and solution out and you may just be on to a real solution for piloting.
You make it sound like people here actually want a "solution". They don't.
They just want to vent because they claim that some target of their hate didn't get punish when in reality, the only reason that he even posted the video was because he was punished. And he was punished because there is no denying that an illegal hero was used in AW. There was no need to send an email to confess or make a video of it.There's game data to show that an inappropriate hero was used and there are witnesses (such as the other alliance) to that fact.
Nobody can say the same thing about "piloting" but they don't care. Do we see a sign confession from the other guy who allegedly used his account? Do we even know if this "Top Gun" actually exist and not a story made up to spice up the misdeed of using the wrong hero in AW? He claims to have a good time drinking that night. Not many of us can use a wrong hero in AW, only a very limited group of people even have the opportunity to make such a screw up. Was the story fabricated to create sympathy?
They simply don't care if anything can be proven. To them, making a statement is proof enough. In their minds, there is no need for facts to support a statement, none at all. So just admit to murder; a dead body isn't needed.
Lmao I think thou doth protest too much.
Also, I actually do have a confession. Some people only really talk with their own alliance in this community. Some of us intermingle a lot more than that. The details of this episode are very much common knowledge to many people, as they were told first hand. I won't be calling anyone out like he did tho. The only part that wasn't true was it being framed as a "special occasion" kinda thing.
As for the precedent set, this is just one example of many in my line groups. Across the board, people are taking this as a thumbs up from kabam. Not many actually care about the cc program or at least who is doing the videos. In the end, that's just a game-related thing with no impact on a player's account. It's like I was doing 120mph in a lambo that I was reviewing for Car and Driver.. But the cops didn't ticket me, only said I couldn't do reviews for Car and Driver anymore.
They can take it as precedent if they want, but it doesn’t mean there won’t be any enforcement.
And can you back up your marvel war of heroes assertions or was that more of your bs?
Lmao. Very respectful and nice, sir. Much appreciated.
I've never played or mentioned that game. I also don't bs. Just speak the truth and people can believe it or choose to remain ignorant of what goes on and deny it. That's their call lol.
Also let me pose this question to you how would deal with those that played for and completed other players content with out exchanging login info but had access to a device already logged with the account? Figure that answer and solution out and you may just be on to a real solution for piloting.
You make it sound like people here actually want a "solution". They don't.
They just want to vent because they claim that some target of their hate didn't get punish when in reality, the only reason that he even posted the video was because he was punished. And he was punished because there is no denying that an illegal hero was used in AW. There was no need to send an email to confess or make a video of it.There's game data to show that an inappropriate hero was used and there are witnesses (such as the other alliance) to that fact.
Nobody can say the same thing about "piloting" but they don't care. Do we see a sign confession from the other guy who allegedly used his account? Do we even know if this "Top Gun" actually exist and not a story made up to spice up the misdeed of using the wrong hero in AW? He claims to have a good time drinking that night. Not many of us can use a wrong hero in AW, only a very limited group of people even have the opportunity to make such a screw up. Was the story fabricated to create sympathy?
They simply don't care if anything can be proven. To them, making a statement is proof enough. In their minds, there is no need for facts to support a statement, none at all. So just admit to murder; a dead body isn't needed.
I agree with probably half of what you've said.
I think that there are people that want a solution and there are people that want to see him punished more severely. These aren't necessarily the same people. Some people just want everyone to stick to the rules, no ifs and no buts... it's black and white.
Some people want him punished more severely, because they either know someone or are someone that has been punished more severely for a similar crime. Alternatively, they are competitors and realise that taking someone down a peg benefits them in some way, the top alliances are very competitive amongst themselves.
The story makes no sense to fabricate. If I was a content creator and emailed Kabam, I could have written. "I just pulled a double shift, was super tired when I placed my defenders and accidentally dropped in the early preview champion." They might not even have done a thing. Instead the story creates a problem that they have to deal with.
It's not practical. Some don't stay signed in. Some have multiple Accounts. The game itself logs us in when we open it. It's not really a solution.
I’m super late to the conversation but I have to say that not only do some not stay in, Kabam actually advises us to always use the log out option to keep our account more secure.
imo, Kabam only cares about account sharing in 2 situations:
1. Helping others through tough content - which affects their bottom line for item consumed
2. People claiming to get hacked.
The TOS is there to protect Kabam, not to create a level playing field. That we interpret it that way is our prerogative, but just try to understand it from Kabam's point of view. If I had a game, I would focus developer resources on the game content, not on policing possible account sharing. Especially considering that without Alliance Wars, nobody would care about account sharing at all.
They probably do have audit logs regarding who has logged in from what device and when, but to pull them and do a cross reference to see if an account is being shared is not something they want to do often, only under exceptional circumstances (account got hacked). Point being, no way they will direct resources to analyze audit logs to determine if an War was piloted. Unless there is money involved, then that changes the equation.
c'mon u guys really think the top alliances can run m6 every single week without some kind of 'piloting', if u think this u are very naive.
At some point, some 1 in the alliance will need help to move his account, is guarantee, this is what happens when u have so bad map design,
Kabam should try to move the difficult to the fight not in the energy managment, is silly and unreal
And by the way, this topic is about piloting in AW not in AQ, they are not the same thing. How cares if some1 move some1 in AQ, its BS.
Comments
Kabam have made no qualification that sharing your details is only against TOS if the other person is a "player". It is sharing your account details with anyone, which brings me to a secondary reason Kabam outlaw account sharing. They can insulate themselves against issues with the account. How many times have we seen someone post... my son/daughter blah blah sold all my 5* champs, Kabam please give them back! Kabam make it easy by saying, you're the account holder, whatever happens on that account is your responsibility as you are the only one using it.
I think they would look to prevent it if it provides a competitive advantage. Same room, same device is still account sharing. Consider the following scenarios:
1) I open an account and all I like to do is open crystals, but my roommate does all the fighting. Is this account sharing? Only one person ever does the fights.
2) I own an account and my roommate and I take alternating shifts in arena. He is not another account holder. There is a definite competitive advantage.
Same device, same account. Are these considered account sharing? Are these considered equal infringements?
Is it Sharing? Technically yes. Is it what they're looking for in terms of dealing with it? Probably not. There's no way to enforce that without some sort of admission. The question in the old Forum was whether allowing a sibling to take turns was an issue. The response was that it is not what they mean by Account Sharing.
We don't need to split hairs. We know exactly what we're talking about. Swapping Logins and having people run your Account. You're not allowed to share your Account details with anyone.
Funny how your saying check the rules but it's ok for man crush to break them
I think that's a good idea. I don't know the logistics of implementing it but that kind of deterrent would have a real impact on changing the culture without going overboard.
If I log in my tablet and set it in my recreation room and tell my family, whenever they have free time, please grind arena for me and placed in the top 150 for 5* featured and then compare this to someone moving me in AQ. Let's say they move me and don't even fight. They move on empty nodes. As a player, I would be more upset with the former scenario. What are your thoughts on that?
Explain how any of this is true. How was Marvel war of heroes shutdown because of TOS violations? How is Netmarble connected to marvel war of heroes?
Would it be wrong in your example? Yes. Someone wouldn't be playing for their own Rewards. Would I support taking action against them? Sure. There's just no way of detecting that and dealing with it.
In both cases, the Account Piloting and the family member that Grinds for your 5*, it's wrong. One thing does not excuse or justify another for me.
You make it sound like people here actually want a "solution". They don't.
They just want to vent because they claim that some target of their hate didn't get punish when in reality, the only reason that he even posted the video was because he was punished. And he was punished because there is no denying that an illegal hero was used in AW. There was no need to send an email to confess or make a video of it.There's game data to show that an inappropriate hero was used and there are witnesses (such as the other alliance) to that fact.
Nobody can say the same thing about "piloting" but they don't care. Do we see a sign confession from the other guy who allegedly used his account? Do we even know if this "Top Gun" actually exist and not a story made up to spice up the misdeed of using the wrong hero in AW? He claims to have a good time drinking that night. Not many of us can use a wrong hero in AW, only a very limited group of people even have the opportunity to make such a screw up. Was the story fabricated to create sympathy?
They simply don't care if anything can be proven. To them, making a statement is proof enough. In their minds, there is no need for facts to support a statement, none at all. So just admit to murder; a dead body isn't needed.
That's why I said that whether or not they can be detected is another matter. You would, as you've said, essentially require an admission. The point being that it's an example of account sharing that I would consider cheating that don't involved sharing login details, but does involve getting a competitive advantage.
Which is why I'm promoting the idea of increasing the availability of energy for AQ maps. Really, what do Kabam get out of restricting energy in AQ? All they do is make players stay up at night or wake up early in the morning to help their alliance complete maps. You can't buy energy to complete AQ maps, unlike solo play. The biggest difficulty in AQ is not the level of play, it's the energy restriction and that is why people pilot.
AW is a different matter. Obviously piloting there allows players to get rewards that based on their skill level, they do not deserve.
I know you've already said that just because alliances run particular AQ maps doesn't justify widespread piloting, so then why doesn't Kabam just create an environment where it isn't required? AQ can punish people for having a life, is that really what a game wants to promote?
Lmao I think thou doth protest too much.
Also, I actually do have a confession. Some people only really talk with their own alliance in this community. Some of us intermingle a lot more than that. The details of this episode are very much common knowledge to many people, as they were told first hand. I won't be calling anyone out like he did tho. The only part that wasn't true was it being framed as a "special occasion" kinda thing.
As for the precedent set, this is just one example of many in my line groups. Across the board, people are taking this as a thumbs up from kabam. Not many actually care about the cc program or at least who is doing the videos. In the end, that's just a game-related thing with no impact on a player's account. It's like I was doing 120mph in a lambo that I was reviewing for Car and Driver.. But the cops didn't ticket me, only said I couldn't do reviews for Car and Driver anymore.
And can you back up your marvel war of heroes assertions or was that more of your bs?
I've never played or mentioned that game. I also don't bs. Just speak the truth and people can believe it or choose to remain ignorant of what goes on and deny it. That's their call lol.
But you do you, buddy
I agree with probably half of what you've said.
I think that there are people that want a solution and there are people that want to see him punished more severely. These aren't necessarily the same people. Some people just want everyone to stick to the rules, no ifs and no buts... it's black and white.
Some people want him punished more severely, because they either know someone or are someone that has been punished more severely for a similar crime. Alternatively, they are competitors and realise that taking someone down a peg benefits them in some way, the top alliances are very competitive amongst themselves.
The story makes no sense to fabricate. If I was a content creator and emailed Kabam, I could have written. "I just pulled a double shift, was super tired when I placed my defenders and accidentally dropped in the early preview champion." They might not even have done a thing. Instead the story creates a problem that they have to deal with.
I’m super late to the conversation but I have to say that not only do some not stay in, Kabam actually advises us to always use the log out option to keep our account more secure.
1. Helping others through tough content - which affects their bottom line for item consumed
2. People claiming to get hacked.
The TOS is there to protect Kabam, not to create a level playing field. That we interpret it that way is our prerogative, but just try to understand it from Kabam's point of view. If I had a game, I would focus developer resources on the game content, not on policing possible account sharing. Especially considering that without Alliance Wars, nobody would care about account sharing at all.
They probably do have audit logs regarding who has logged in from what device and when, but to pull them and do a cross reference to see if an account is being shared is not something they want to do often, only under exceptional circumstances (account got hacked). Point being, no way they will direct resources to analyze audit logs to determine if an War was piloted. Unless there is money involved, then that changes the equation.
c'mon u guys really think the top alliances can run m6 every single week without some kind of 'piloting', if u think this u are very naive.
At some point, some 1 in the alliance will need help to move his account, is guarantee, this is what happens when u have so bad map design,
Kabam should try to move the difficult to the fight not in the energy managment, is silly and unreal
And by the way, this topic is about piloting in AW not in AQ, they are not the same thing. How cares if some1 move some1 in AQ, its BS.
I know this is a topic that you all feel very strongly about, but this thread is no longer constructive so it will be closed down.