In the 5 * arena in the "endless series" he puts 6 * 3/45 against the teams

DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
in General Discussion
After the 20th series in any of the arenas, the so-called "Endless series" begins, in which the complexity of the opponents is always "high" and always corresponds to the level of the Summoner team. The problem is apparently that people pumped 6 * to 3/45 and because of this, some levels of maximum and minimum ratings for the 5 * arena have shifted.

Now teams against which literally one or two weeks ago made equal opponents, throws at the most difficult opponents - 6 * 3/45. And this is more than the 20th in the series! It turns out that in order to avoid such a situation, you need to put 5 * 2/35 leveling characters at least, but, for example, I have 17 5 * characters in the first rank. To the second rank, I pump them, but I’ll pump them all for another three months, if not more.

It would be great if the player did not have to wonder if the team is suitable for the rating or other conditions for an endless series or not. If the minimum required rating were shown, as when choosing a team for the job. It is unclear why he is not in the character selection window for the arena.

P.S.
sorry for my google translate
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Comments

  • -sixate--sixate- Member Posts: 1,532 ★★★★★
    I haven't seen a change or a single R3 6*
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★



    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?
  • SummonerNRSummonerNR Member, Guardian Posts: 12,866 Guardian
    At Streak of 20, might still be 1 more match before able to use minimum required in Streak ?

    And for 2nd case (Streak 22), you are only using 1 champ at 2/35 (with two at 1/25), and 2 of then are Not Dup. So could have been a borderline case as well.
  • lowlevelplayerlowlevelplayer Member Posts: 4,292 ★★★★★
    Wow I remember back when there was only one 3/45 6 star! Now, after the aby$$ theres 2 on one arena team!! LOL
  • phil56201phil56201 Member Posts: 986 ★★★
    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
  • TehsigzorzTehsigzorz Member Posts: 1,233 ★★★★
    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    Not true, I regularly use 1r2 5* and 2r1 5*
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,701 Guardian
    SummonerNR said:

    At Streak of 20, might still be 1 more match before able to use minimum required in Streak ?

    And for 2nd case (Streak 22), you are only using 1 champ at 2/35 (with two at 1/25), and 2 of then are Not Dup. So could have been a borderline case as well.

    Both pictured teams I would have considered dangerous even before rank 3s arrived. I would only use a 3163 if it was paired with two champs over 4k. I wouldn't be surprised to see death matches at that rating value.

    Now if you want to see something funny, I also noticed the game do this occasionally:



    Kang's 6* pulls suck, but you gotta love his conviction ranking them all the way up to rank 5.
  • phil56201phil56201 Member Posts: 986 ★★★
    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    Not true, I regularly use 1r2 5* and 2r1 5*
    Your getting lucky, then. Thats not a safe team.

  • FloorKillerFloorKiller Member Posts: 149 ★★
    It has always been "unsafe" to run 3x 5* 1/25. Only safe way to run is 1x 4* 5/50 + 2x 5* 1/25.
    5* 2/35 are "safe" to run in trio
  • SummonerNRSummonerNR Member, Guardian Posts: 12,866 Guardian
    The relative Rating of a particular champ compared to your other champs at the same rank also matters. Using all 3 champs that are in the lower rating end within whatever their Rank is, compared to a normally OK combination of different Ranks but using champs whose rating is in middle to upper end within their Rank.

    One case could spell disaster, while the other case would be safe. Even if both cases were using 1x 4/40 and 2x 3/30 (or their 5* equivalents).

    And in fact you could maybe see that a full team of your very highest rated 3/30, versus another case of a full team of your very lowest 4/40, actually might give you similar matchups. Even though man-for-man each one is technically a full Rank higher that that slot in the other case. Because Rating-wise, they are very comparable.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    DNA3000 said:

    SummonerNR said:

    At Streak of 20, might still be 1 more match before able to use minimum required in Streak ?

    And for 2nd case (Streak 22), you are only using 1 champ at 2/35 (with two at 1/25), and 2 of then are Not Dup. So could have been a borderline case as well.

    Both pictured teams I would have considered dangerous even before rank 3s arrived. I would only use a 3163 if it was paired with two champs over 4k. I wouldn't be surprised to see death matches at that rating value.

    Now if you want to see something funny, I also noticed the game do this occasionally:



    Kang's 6* pulls suck, but you gotta love his conviction ranking them all the way up to rank 5.
    This is an exit to the "endless series", i.e. until the 20th series, there are no complaints, it has always been like that and it's normal.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    I know that the team’s rating is low, but last week this rating was enough, now it’s not.
    The formula has changed, but nowhere is this said. The current minimum required rating is not shown anywhere.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    SummonerNR said:

    At Streak of 20, might still be 1 more match before able to use minimum required in Streak ?

    And for 2nd case (Streak 22), you are only using 1 champ at 2/35 (with two at 1/25), and 2 of then are Not Dup. So could have been a borderline case as well.

    I tried with another team and the series is more than 22. The same thing - low rating two r2 5 * and one r1 5 * puts against 6* 3/45 opponents.
    I will try to post screenshots later.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    SummonerNR said:

    The relative Rating of a particular champ compared to your other champs at the same rank also matters. Using all 3 champs that are in the lower rating end within whatever their Rank is, compared to a normally OK combination of different Ranks but using champs whose rating is in middle to upper end within their Rank.

    One case could spell disaster, while the other case would be safe. Even if both cases were using 1x 4/40 and 2x 3/30 (or their 5* equivalents).

    And in fact you could maybe see that a full team of your very highest rated 3/30, versus another case of a full team of your very lowest 4/40, actually might give you similar matchups. Even though man-for-man each one is technically a full Rank higher that that slot in the other case. Because Rating-wise, they are very comparable.

    It is clear, but why do you have to find out empirically?
    Why it is impossible to show the minimum rating, as for tasks?

    I’ve been playing a game for a year now and have always played arenas. First, for the Basic 4 * arena, it was necessary to determine the teams that fit the rating.
    When there were more champions, I began to play the Main 4 * arena - for her again I experimentally determined for which teams I put equal opponents.
    Moreover, for the Guillotine, 4 * 4/40 through time set against 5 * 5/65 opponents. Raised the Guillotine to rank 5.
    About 3-4 months ago I began to play the 5 * arena. For her, it turned out that not all 4 * 4/40 hold the "endless series." The Rhino 5 * fell out - with its presence in the team it was against 6 * 2/35, it raised the Rhino 2 ranks.
    People pumped 6 * characters to 3 ranks. Again, everything has changed. This week already against the Rhino of the 2nd rank puts a team of 6 * 3/45.

    I'm already angry that your minimum rating is hidden, that all this has to be determined independently. And again, it will have to somehow shuffle teams from 17 champions of 5 * 1 rank, so as not to hit against difficult opponents.
  • phil56201phil56201 Member Posts: 986 ★★★
    Dioved said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    I know that the team’s rating is low, but last week this rating was enough, now it’s not.
    The formula has changed, but nowhere is this said. The current minimum required rating is not shown anywhere.
    A low team like that might get you by, but it's not a sure thing. Trust me. Ive been grinding these arenas in what feels like forever, and have made the cutoff for the 5* featured champion before. Ive done alot of matches in there and it's a ever evolving formula as the game progresses.
    It happened before when players were starting to get alot of 5/65's, and it's reasonable to assume we are seeing a shift again.
    These "formulas" are not official and thus are never officially announced. We, the players figure them out, and as the game progresses with higher ranked champions, the minimum goes up. It's trial and error on our part.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    I know that the team’s rating is low, but last week this rating was enough, now it’s not.
    The formula has changed, but nowhere is this said. The current minimum required rating is not shown anywhere.
    A low team like that might get you by, but it's not a sure thing. Trust me. Ive been grinding these arenas in what feels like forever, and have made the cutoff for the 5* featured champion before. Ive done alot of matches in there and it's a ever evolving formula as the game progresses.
    It happened before when players were starting to get alot of 5/65's, and it's reasonable to assume we are seeing a shift again.
    These "formulas" are not official and thus are never officially announced. We, the players figure them out, and as the game progresses with higher ranked champions, the minimum goes up. It's trial and error on our part.
    Ok, let the formula be hidden, but in the end it comes down to a number. If the number of the summoner’s team is less than this value, he will put against 6 * 3/45 opponents. Is not it?
    Is it really impossible to display this number on the character selection screen? Is it so complicated technically?
    How much would this simplify the life of the players. Especially for those who are just starting to play the game.
    Many would stop asking how to play in such an arena :)
  • -sixate--sixate- Member Posts: 1,532 ★★★★★
    Maybe if you can't keep endlees easy streak going you just don't have enough champs to do that. So what. Wait until the champs with higher rating are refreshed or rank up more champs if you want to run the 5* arena.

    I run my R1 5* to streak 7. Then from there I only run my R4 and R5 5* and my 6*. Nothing has changed for me. I was expecting to face R3 6*, but I have yet to face one.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    -sixate- said:

    Maybe if you can't keep endlees easy streak going you just don't have enough champs to do that. So what. Wait until the champs with higher rating are refreshed or rank up more champs if you want to run the 5* arena.

    I run my R1 5* to streak 7. Then from there I only run my R4 and R5 5* and my 6*. Nothing has changed for me. I was expecting to face R3 6*, but I have yet to face one.

    Changes have occurred for a series of more than 20. Until the 20 series, everything is as before.

    For 5 * champions they give twice as many points as for 4 *, but the rollback takes 7 hours. This is a lot, I would not want to miss them.
  • -sixate--sixate- Member Posts: 1,532 ★★★★★
    What kind of point total are you shooting for? Unlikely you're going for a feature. Better to wait for higher ranked champs than rebuilding your streak every run imo. I easily rank in the top 1-10% every arena and feel like I barely play. Maybe just run nothing lower than R3 5*. Or try a R5 4* with two R2 5* as your lowest team. Not sure if that would work, just a suggestion.
  • -sixate--sixate- Member Posts: 1,532 ★★★★★
    Actually, I just tried a R5 4* with two R1 5* and still got an easy fight. Could be a way to use lower ranked 5* and keep your streak going if you don't play 4* arena.
  • -sixate--sixate- Member Posts: 1,532 ★★★★★


    An example of what I suggested
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    -sixate- said:



    An example of what I suggested

    Yes, apparently i will have to use this variant in the near future.

    From 4 * arenas, i usually took stages.
  • FilmsauceFilmsauce Member Posts: 82 ★
    Just r2 all your 5*s and you won’t have the issue anymore
  • TehsigzorzTehsigzorz Member Posts: 1,233 ★★★★
    phil56201 said:

    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    Not true, I regularly use 1r2 5* and 2r1 5*
    Your getting lucky, then. Thats not a safe team.

    I grind every 5 star arena and get 9 mil to 15 mil score everytime, guess I am the luckiest man alive and should register in every lottery ever
  • phil56201phil56201 Member Posts: 986 ★★★
    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    Not true, I regularly use 1r2 5* and 2r1 5*
    Your getting lucky, then. Thats not a safe team.

    I grind every 5 star arena and get 9 mil to 15 mil score everytime, guess I am the luckiest man alive and should register in every lottery ever
    Better get on that.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,701 Guardian
    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Tehsigzorz said:

    phil56201 said:

    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    That team is too low. You need a bare minimum of two r2 5* and a r1 5*, with at least a total team rating of 12k, but if the formula has shifted due to r3 6*s (which is entirely likely), then even the old minimum might not cut it anymore.
    Not true, I regularly use 1r2 5* and 2r1 5*
    Your getting lucky, then. Thats not a safe team.

    I grind every 5 star arena and get 9 mil to 15 mil score everytime, guess I am the luckiest man alive and should register in every lottery ever
    I have grinded almost every 5* featured since the existence of 5* featured, and I almost always register my score in the Reddit survey so that's verifiable, and I can tell you that I try to avoid going that low because it has triggered death matches in the past (sometimes without thinking I just go too far down the roster). I also know that there's no such thing as a perfect rule that only mentions ranks: the arena "system" for choosing match ups clearly factors in rarity (star rating), rank, and (unmodified) PI in whatever formula it is using, because some specific teams of a certain rank composition seem to always work, and some seem to generally fail. Unless you want to memorize them all or reverse engineer the formula, you don't go below a certain composition for safety.

    The reason why some people get away with going lower and others don't is because I think in general most arena grinders have a system for how they go through their roster (like top to bottom, or some other method), and their roster doesn't change constantly below a certain rank (because rank ups tend to be focused on higher champs). As a result, two different players could use the same "rules" and one would draw death matches while the other one wouldn't, because those rules resolve to different team compositions consistently for those two players.

    If you're giving recommendations to other players, it is dangerous to tell them the best (lowest) combination that consistently works for just you. You have to either factor in other players' reports, or deliberately mix up your own roster choices as you progress through your streak to see if all possible combinations of teams using those rules work.
  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Member Posts: 11,598 ★★★★★
    Dioved said:




    and how does it go when the series is already endless?
    A week ago, against such a team put equal opponents.
    In the morning I was thrown to 6 * 3/45 with a team of two 2/35 and one 1/25.

    It turns out that the minimum required rating for holding the series has changed, and where can I see it?

    1 r2 5* and 2 r1 5 stars were never truly safe
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,581 ★★★★★
    Although, it will shift. That much was predicted. It's just the way the Arena is structured. When you increase the ceiling, you increase the Total PI required. Mind you, that will plateau. It won't increase substantially.
  • World EaterWorld Eater Member Posts: 3,759 ★★★★★
    Lol, bring rank1 & rank2 5* to the arena at you’re own risk.
  • DiovedDioved Member Posts: 36 ★
    In general, developers are not able to display the minimum required PI and some players have to suffer?
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