Do you agree with kabam John?

RiptideRiptide Member Posts: 3,166 ★★★★★
in General Discussion
In Bgs video where he had 8 people talk about rank ups, kabam John made some interesting points.

He said that it is better to take a champ with better utility but less damage to R3, then someone likes mags who has crazy damage.

Start the debate!
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Comments

  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,302 Guardian
    xNig said:

    I agree with Kabam John.

    Utility decides whether you CAN take the fight. Damage decides how long you take.

    Duration has no bearing if a champ cannot take the fight.

    It depends on how you define "utility" but my definition mirrors this one: to me utility is a measure of how broadly useful a champion is. At the moment most people doing rank 3 rankups have very few, if any rank 3s. When you only have a few, you need to get the most bang for buck, and every r3 has to be as widely useful as possible, in my opinion.
  • Putang76Putang76 Member Posts: 283 ★★
    I believe he was saying take utility over damage when ranking to R3, because at rank 3’s damage is not much more then a rank 5/65.
    And you can always rank the damage dealer later when you need it!
  • Prakhar_82Prakhar_82 Member Posts: 713 ★★★
    I really don't think he said anything like that. He might have said anything else but you got it wrong.Can you post a sreenshot?
  • Spurgeon14Spurgeon14 Member Posts: 1,665 ★★★★
    ItsDamien said:

    xNig said:

    I agree with Kabam John.

    Utility decides whether you CAN take the fight. Damage decides how long you take.

    Duration has no bearing if a champ cannot take the fight.

    My only issue is that nowadays there are champs with high damage and utility that are better to wait for than just the champs with the better utility and lower damage. Especially now when you can have a team of 5 champs for questing that can cover all the utility you'd need plus having that higher damage.

    Duration always has a bearing regardless. Low damage and great utility just means you have to extend the length of time you can't mess up or die to potential block damage.

    Ultimately until the availability of rank up materials are able to be acquired easily by the majority, ranking up less desirable champs isn't really the best investment, especially if people are doing it just for TB.
    I couldn't agree more. It's not really that hard to build a team that has both. I am a F2P player but have built up a solid set of champs, now have 23 5* R5s and 6* R2s/R3 and these days you can build up both. I find damage dealers more fun but utility definitely has its place and the best champs have some of both.
  • The_Sentry06The_Sentry06 Member Posts: 7,783 ★★★★★
    I agree with Kabam John but some damage also has to be considered. I wouldn't rank 3 someone like Psycho-Man.
  • Prakhar_82Prakhar_82 Member Posts: 713 ★★★
    The_Sentry06 said:

    I agree with Kabam John but some damage also has to be considered. I wouldn't rank 3 someone like Psycho-Man.

    I mean I would rank 3 psycho man if it's for TB. Beside that, never.
  • DrZolaDrZola Member Posts: 8,893 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    xNig said:

    I agree with Kabam John.

    Utility decides whether you CAN take the fight. Damage decides how long you take.

    Duration has no bearing if a champ cannot take the fight.

    It depends on how you define "utility" but my definition mirrors this one: to me utility is a measure of how broadly useful a champion is. At the moment most people doing rank 3 rankups have very few, if any rank 3s. When you only have a few, you need to get the most bang for buck, and every r3 has to be as widely useful as possible, in my opinion.
    Right.

    But...is Magneto the best example of damage over utility?

    Magnetized is a pretty darn useful utility, before you add things like shock, energy damage and bleed resistance.

    If we are talking Hit-Monkey versus someone like Mysterio, that’s probably a better comparison. I’m more than a little surprised Magneto was the example used.

    Dr. Zola
  • xNigxNig Member Posts: 7,329 ★★★★★
    edited February 2021
    Generally, on top of utility, if the playstyle requires the additional 16% health, they’re worth R3 as well, Eg Mag HT AA etc
  • LiquidkoldLiquidkold Member Posts: 200 ★★
    This game is always about diversity. As more and more content comes out they are forcing you to use different champs then you would traditionally use. Act 7 and all of the variants prove that you need utility and damage, you have to find a mixture of both.
  • Colinwhitworth69Colinwhitworth69 Member Posts: 7,406 ★★★★★
    There is no one answer that fits all. Depends on your roster needs, the champs you are able to rank up, whether you run Recoil, and even the content you have to face. I value utility champs as long as their damage doesn’t stink.
  • GreanGrean Member Posts: 1,397 ★★★★
    Tbh if the utility is the same at r2 than r3, why not rank up a damage champ?
  • The_Sentry06The_Sentry06 Member Posts: 7,783 ★★★★★
    Grean said:

    Tbh if the utility is the same at r2 than r3, why not rank up a damage champ?

    Because damage champs already have amazing damage and utility heavy champions are offset by not as great damage. Rank up utility heavy champions to boost their damage considerably.
  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Member Posts: 11,598 ★★★★★
    BitterSteel said:

    Lvernon15 said:

    Depends on the method of damage, someone like mags or aegon isn’t going to gain as much benefit as someone like Corvus or cmm due to their methods of damage, ramp vs burst

    Just to add, not in terms of damage, but I'd argue Mags is one champ who really really benefits from being r3. And surprisingly this is because of damage through block. Magneto has his 50% perfect block, which is awesome don't get me wrong. But in longer content, where block damage can take it's toll, that extra health from being r3 can be the difference between life and death. Just take someone like IMIW in abyss. If you take an r5 Mags into that fight, itll be tough to get him down just due to the block damage, you will rarely run out of abyss charges with Mags and his low hit count style. But with the r3 you last longer, and do a hell of a lot more damage
    Oh yeah, I’m not saying don’t r3 magneto, he’s still an absolute beast and benefits from the rankup, but as you say it’s much more in the sustainability category that he benefits rather than damage
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,302 Guardian
    DrZola said:

    DNA3000 said:

    xNig said:

    I agree with Kabam John.

    Utility decides whether you CAN take the fight. Damage decides how long you take.

    Duration has no bearing if a champ cannot take the fight.

    It depends on how you define "utility" but my definition mirrors this one: to me utility is a measure of how broadly useful a champion is. At the moment most people doing rank 3 rankups have very few, if any rank 3s. When you only have a few, you need to get the most bang for buck, and every r3 has to be as widely useful as possible, in my opinion.
    Right.

    But...is Magneto the best example of damage over utility?

    Magnetized is a pretty darn useful utility, before you add things like shock, energy damage and bleed resistance.

    If we are talking Hit-Monkey versus someone like Mysterio, that’s probably a better comparison. I’m more than a little surprised Magneto was the example used.

    Dr. Zola
    Short answer to your question is: no. By my definition of utility, Magneto has huge utility value. But I understand that by a more old-school definition of utility - namely possessing some of the big "utility abilities" like power control - (which was also my definition of utility say four years ago) Magneto isn't a traditional utility powerhouse.

    But more importantly, I don't really consider "damage" to be independent of utility. If your champ's damage is zero, he has zero utility because he can't win any fights. Meanwhile a champ that deals a billion unavoidable damage at the start of every fight has infinite utility, because it can do every fight.

    Damage has to be part of the equation. You don't necessarily need high damage to have strong utility, but you still have to win the fight. I used King Groot for some of the Variant paths. His damage is pathetic. But for the fights I used him in he had very strong utility because he could basically win every fight while more or less keeping full health. So while he was slow, he was safe to run. He didn't make unwinnable fights winnable, he made winnable fights cheap. But that lack of damage means there's tons of fights where I wouldn't use him in, because his slow damage output makes fights longer, and there are a lot of fights that get progressively more dangerous the longer they last, which makes him unsuitable.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,489 ★★★★★
    People focus way too much on big yellow numbers. Agree.
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