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Why the arena scores for Hercules don’t signal how broken the system is

SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,008 ★★★★★
Since people saw the high arena cutoff for six star Hercules, (170,280,131 to be exact) there have been some posts and comments about how the system is broken, and how this spells doom for the arena system going forward. These concerns are somewhat valid, as this score is on the high side and the general playerbase doesn’t want to grind out that much for a six star, with what the unit cost to refresh and the sheer roster depth required. Not to mention it’s an utter time sink and most of us have real life responsibilities. However, this score is at this point, incredibly rare and is not the norm, and therefore shouldn’t be fussed over. Now, those of you of the aforementioned “What’s next, 250 mil?” group may not simply take my word for it, so I have some data compiled from https://www.reddit.com/r/ContestOfChampsArena/ about the previous featured arena scores, along with some basic math for comparison.

The first round of the Black Widow Deadly Origin arena was run a week ago. She was the featured champion, and 95th place on the leaderboard netted a six star version of her with 79,229,316 points. Doing the math, that’s a gap of 91,050,815 points between 95th in the BWDO arena, and 100th in the Hercules arena. Now, you may be saying, “But Spidey! BWDO wasn’t a new champion, this comparison isn’t fair!” Well, let’s take the scores from the Overseer arena and compare with the ones from Hercules just like above. 95th place in the Overseer arena was given with a score of 140,500,125 points. Again doing the math, this time our gap is a much smaller 29,780,006 points. Still almost a gap of 30 million. But once again, I can hear your voice: “But Spidey! Overseer is a mediocre science champion unlike the hyped beast that is Hercules!” Alright, fine. Why not the scores from the Shang-Chi featured? This time, we can compare two number 100 scores. The last spot to get a six star in the Shang-Chi arena was achieved with a whopping score of 129,236,072. That equates to a gap of 41,044,059 points.

As the data and comparisons show, this first round of the Hercules arena was very high, even by the standards of the arena. And why is that? There’s a very simple answer to that question. The arena system isn’t broken. Hercules is. You don’t believe me? Let’s begin. First off, let’s hit the suicides angle. Is he friendly? Yes. He takes 50% less damage from bleeds, up to 80% if you run max coagulate. He takes 15% less damage from poison and reduces it’s healing reduction 20% less effective. He also has a synergy with himself that gives him +15% attack while suffering from the poison applied by Liquid Courage. Getting into his feats of strength, the main way he deals damage. He can get a feat in one of three ways: Intercepting the opponent, hitting a non stunned opponent with any hit of a heavy attack, and standing up after being knocked down. These can stack up to twelve and each feat of strength gives him 186.96 armor penetration and all attacks deal a burst of physical damage equal to 10% of the damage they dealt. When Herc completes a feat, he gains +50% buff duration and 1001.28 attack rating for 2 seconds. If Herc uses a special attack during that 2 second window, the bonus remains until the special attack is finished. Additionally, the first time a unique feat is completed in a fight, he gains a persistent charge. When Hercules starts a fight with persistent charges, he starts the fight with a number of strength equal to the number of persistent charges. Now this gives Hercules, when at 12 twelve strength, the ability to deal an additional 120% of damage on top of his basic attacks.

You’re thinking, so what, it’s just damage. Ghost has damage. Doom has damage. In addition to this damage, whenever Herc has a feat of strength, he becomes stun immune. Anytime he would be stunned, he just loses a feat instead. Encroaching stun, mesmerize, etc. As long as he has strength, he isn’t affected. If he dashes back after the first medium or light in a combo he inflicts a 7 second Infuriate debuff, which reduces the opponent’s offensive ability accuracy by 60% and makes them more aggressive, which allows for easier intercepts and helps to work around passive ai. Now, onto his specials. His special 1 gives a precision buff increasing his crit rate by 2150 for 25 seconds, but if you intercept the opponent with the special 1 you gain an additional two more. It also gives a true sense buff allowing him to ignore miss and auto block effects for 16 seconds. This makes him an option for Tunnel Vision or any pesky auto block/miss champions you may have problems with. His special 2 gives a 15 second cruelty buff increasing his critical damage rating by 1262.7. As with the special 1, if he intercepts the opponent with this attack, he gains two more. Also inflicts a three second stun debuff at the end. These two special attacks combined make him not only crit very often, but they also pack a real punch. Adding on his 120% damage from the feats of strength, and the opponents melt faster than ice in the sahara. His special 3 gives him a 4 second indestructible buff, and if the opponent has their special 3 afterwards he gets a power gain buff giving him a bar of power over 3 seconds.

Now for his signature ability. Along with giving him up to 35% combat power rate for 2 seconds after completing a feat, he gets an immortality buff that lasts from 3.9 to 9 seconds depending on his sig level. Now, normally this is a neat little bonus that can save you. However, what’s unique about this immortality is that while Hercules is using his specials or landing his basic combo hits, this buff is paused. Meaning it can last a lot longer if you attack with Hercules. This is so so so incredibly handy and is yet another great piece of utility. For more on Herc and his wide range of uses, please check out this showcase by @Karatemike415
Plus, he’s top 5 prestige in game. That’s another big one.

This kinda deviated from an arena post to a here’s what hercules can do post, but I hope you found it informative. As a reminder, the arena scores are not all going to suddenly become close to the 200mil range like Hercules, only when an incredibly broken champion like Herc comes around. Thanks for reading, and have a splendiferous day
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Comments

  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,008 ★★★★★

    WHile I agree to most points here. Hercules just shows what scores summoners are capable of. Comparison to Shang Chi is not fair since the system was new at the time. But now, after Herc arena, you have the possibility that the cutoff CAN be as high as 170million. Will it be every arena? No. But the potential rises. The Herc arena raised the ceiling and every desirable champ, moving forward will be compared to this score, and the ceiling will eventually be pushed forward. If a champ can push 100+ summoners to post such ridiculous scores in a fairly new arena system, imagine what the next Herc like champ could do.

    That was the conclusion I came to while writing this. I kinda touched upon it in the small conclusion, but I think you’ve wrote it out better than I could.
  • odishika123odishika123 Posts: 4,792 ★★★★★
    Unio77 said:

    In conclusion the arena system isn't broken but Hercules is!

    Edit: You already said this 😔

    Welcome back
  • Unio77Unio77 Posts: 2,121 ★★★★★

    Unio77 said:

    In conclusion the arena system isn't broken but Hercules is!

    Edit: You already said this 😔

    Welcome back
    Your a few days late to the party, you can start by picking up the trash that was left over. Gives broom and scoop

    Jk jk, thx for the welcoming
  • Unio77Unio77 Posts: 2,121 ★★★★★
    I wonder if Omega Sentinel would've gone this high? 🤔

    Guess we'll never know 😂
  • odishika123odishika123 Posts: 4,792 ★★★★★

    Can’t wait to see Chavez go for 100K points 😂, she looks horrible

    10k at best
  • Wiredawg1Wiredawg1 Posts: 380 ★★★★
    You really can’t not compare the score of bwdo who been in game and this her 2nd time thru arena to a champ that it’s his 1st time. He went that high for multiple reasons. 1 he top 5 prestige 2 he is a good champ. So yes he gonna go high. Just like doom did and namor
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,008 ★★★★★
    Wiredawg1 said:

    You really can’t not compare the score of bwdo who been in game and this her 2nd time thru arena to a champ that it’s his 1st time. He went that high for multiple reasons. 1 he top 5 prestige 2 he is a good champ. So yes he gonna go high. Just like doom did and namor

    I compared other champs to Hercules as well
  • SpideyFunkoSpideyFunko Posts: 19,008 ★★★★★

    The arena system is still broken though.

    Honestly I dont know how people have so much free time to obtain these insane scores.

    I dont mind that they only reward the feature champ to the top 100, but they really should change the basic 6* arena to the top 5 or 10% to get the reward. I think a lot more people would be compelled to push the basic arena, thus potentially lowering the insane scores that the feature champ goes for.

    170m score, assuming no boosts/starting streak already at 5 (3x multiplier) and lets say ONLY using 6* champs averaging 64k per win... thats roughly 2,656.25 fights. and that 170m isnt even the cutoff, it was 172 something.

    Thats a total of 885.4 rounds, assuming every fight was won.

    Lets take it a step further, if you experienced no latency, connection issues, or crashes (all while playing as effeciently and like a pro every fight)
    on apple devices average round take around 70 seconds including load screens, on an android itll be about 90 seconds.

    885.4 rounds x average time = total time (approximately)
    apple = 17.216 hours
    android = 22.135 hours

    and that's being absolutely optimal & perfect conditions.
    Unit refreshes
  • BadroseBadrose Posts: 753 ★★★
    I added a like for the effort / the massive number of words
  • awesomesauceawesomesauce Posts: 514 ★★★

    The arena system is still broken though.

    Honestly I dont know how people have so much free time to obtain these insane scores.

    I dont mind that they only reward the feature champ to the top 100, but they really should change the basic 6* arena to the top 5 or 10% to get the reward. I think a lot more people would be compelled to push the basic arena, thus potentially lowering the insane scores that the feature champ goes for.

    170m score, assuming no boosts/starting streak already at 5 (3x multiplier) and lets say ONLY using 6* champs averaging 64k per win... thats roughly 2,656.25 fights. and that 170m isnt even the cutoff, it was 172 something.

    Thats a total of 885.4 rounds, assuming every fight was won.

    Lets take it a step further, if you experienced no latency, connection issues, or crashes (all while playing as effeciently and like a pro every fight)
    on apple devices average round take around 70 seconds including load screens, on an android itll be about 90 seconds.

    885.4 rounds x average time = total time (approximately)
    apple = 17.216 hours
    android = 22.135 hours

    and that's being absolutely optimal & perfect conditions.
    Unit refreshes
    I get its unit refreshes. Nobody has 2600 6* champs lol.

    I personally have 90 something, and I wouldn't even consider putting myself through this torment. Moreso, don't think the wife and kids would appreciate it much.
  • SearmenisSearmenis Posts: 552 ★★★
    Well, the Hercules 6* cutoff may be rare, I agree on that, but the percentage cutoffs are getting higher every time. 1-5% got to 27, and last time with BWDO was, well, almost 27 as well, and the 6* champ cutoff was 80. That's the real problem here for me.
  • Negative_100Negative_100 Posts: 1,650 ★★★★
    I don't care that there are paragraphs. I still ain't reading that.
  • Zuko_ILCZuko_ILC Posts: 1,308 ★★★★
    I've been a heavy arena grinder for years. I don't even care to grind anymore. I can put up the 170m score, I did 175 for shang chi. But haven't done much since and dont care to anymore to be honest.
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