Battlegrounds "sandbagging"

AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
in General Discussion
I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.
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Comments

  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    GroundedWisdom said:

    The matches are off because many people are manipulating it at the same time. Otherwise, people would progress and either keep going higher, or plateau. That's the cycle.

    @GroundedWisdom So will the update fix this? I think its suppose to match players based on prestige but prestige is only top 5 champs and not 30 champs
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,639 ★★★★★
    We don't yet know what criteria they're going to use, but it will balance out, yes.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,639 ★★★★★
    Ideally, anyway.
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    Panchulon21 said:

    Technically GW is right. Manipulating the matchmaking isn’t fair. There are times you are facing accounts way smaller than yours. I tested this theory and mopped the floor with 4 straight accounts. I got matched with cavaliers and they stood no chance. I even had a bad draft but my roster was so much more advanced it wasn’t even fair. I have a large account but I still faced whales and beat them. This mode is skill based at times and other times it’s definitely roster based. Crit me with your best shot might have showcased the better part of skill over roster.

    If you can’t matchup against people who are in your same bracket because you’re progressing then that means you’ve reached the limit of where you should be progressing. Just like war, eventually as you move up in ranks you’ll need to face alliances bigger and better than yours until you level off where you should be. This isn’t story or event quest, labyrinth or abyss where you can revive your way through when you can’t handle the fight.

    @Panchulon21 Manipulating the matchmaking in this situation is fair.
    When i say i faced off against players with way better accounts than mine i mean over half my deck is 5 stars and over half their deck is r4 and r3 6 stars and i have no good counters to many of their champs and the only time i had ever won one of those matches was by pure luck maybe they slipped up in a fight or their game froze. I do agree that it is unfair if the matches were fair to begin with. When adding 2 stars to my deck i never had any unfair matches like i said my deck might've been slightly better than theirs or theirs slightly better than mine but when you factor in the rng to actually draft the champs it was as fair as it possibly could be and the winner would be the most skilled player
  • Sokrates_77Sokrates_77 Member Posts: 13 ★
    I hear what you say, but unfortunately I don't think it's as simple as that. Your opponent wasn't based on which level you were fighting at, like Gold 2, but on your pool strength. Then, if that is the case, I would have loved to fight guys with the same strenth as me.

    I get your example about the higher you get, the tougher it should be. But if Gold 2 is the league of the Paragons, who are the guys who are fighting in the Gladiator track?
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    edited November 2022
    Ironman3000 said:

    Sokrates_77 said:

    I hear what you say, but unfortunately I don't think it's as simple as that. Your opponent wasn't based on which level you were fighting at, like Gold 2, but on your pool strength. Then, if that is the case, I would have loved to fight guys with the same strenth as me.

    I get your example about the higher you get, the tougher it should be. But if Gold 2 is the league of the Paragons, who are the guys who are fighting in the Gladiator track?

    Correct. Paragons should either start higher or get higher multipliers to move to the GC as quickly as possible.
    @Ironman3000 A better system would be the rank you start at is releative to the rank you finished in the pervious season. So basically if you finished in celestial you'd be placed in like diamond II at the start of next season or something along the line of that.
  • ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Member Posts: 5,444 ★★★★★
    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Member Posts: 1,993 ★★★★★
    Anly said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    Sokrates_77 said:

    I hear what you say, but unfortunately I don't think it's as simple as that. Your opponent wasn't based on which level you were fighting at, like Gold 2, but on your pool strength. Then, if that is the case, I would have loved to fight guys with the same strenth as me.

    I get your example about the higher you get, the tougher it should be. But if Gold 2 is the league of the Paragons, who are the guys who are fighting in the Gladiator track?

    Correct. Paragons should either start higher or get higher multipliers to move to the GC as quickly as possible.
    @Ironman3000 A better system would be the rank you start at is releative to the rank you finished in the pervious season. So basically if you finished in celestial you'd be placed in like diamond II at the start of next season or something along the line of that.
    That would be fine too. Basically anything is better than starting everyone at 0 with the same multiplier but restricting matches to roster strength.
  • Ironman3000Ironman3000 Member Posts: 1,993 ★★★★★
    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
    What many don't understand that the people you should be mad at is Kabam, not the sandbaggers. They are the ones who decided to put everyone in Bronze 3 with a win gaining 1 point.
  • ccrider474ccrider474 Member Posts: 677 ★★★
    Me personally, I set up my deck with no higher than r3 5* and r5 4*. My goal was to target sandbagging fools. I made it to the circuit beating people like you and 9 times out of 10, I just needed to win one of the 1st 2 matches and it was my win because they were stuck with 2 *. Added benefit is it didn't make me feel bad if I got matched against lower accounts as they had a legitimate chance because my roster was the same size as theirs.

    I could drop so many of these picks and each one makes me happy.


    But the ones that made me happier is when my 4* can't be taken with the 6* they had left.


    Not sure why targeting sandbagging people made it more fun for me but it just did.
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    ccrider474 said:

    Me personally, I set up my deck with no higher than r3 5* and r5 4*. My goal was to target sandbagging fools. I made it to the circuit beating people like you and 9 times out of 10, I just needed to win one of the 1st 2 matches and it was my win because they were stuck with 2 *. Added benefit is it didn't make me feel bad if I got matched against lower accounts as they had a legitimate chance because my roster was the same size as theirs.

    I could drop so many of these picks and each one makes me happy.


    But the ones that made me happier is when my 4* can't be taken with the 6* they had left.


    Not sure why targeting sandbagging people made it more fun for me but it just did.

    @ccrider474 You wouldnt find me down there i only put like 4, 2*'s stars in my deck
  • MackeyMackey Member Posts: 1,597 ★★★★★
    edited November 2022
    Panchulon21 said:


    If you can’t matchup against people who are in your same bracket because you’re progressing then that means you’ve reached the limit of where you should be progressing. Just like war, eventually as you move up in ranks you’ll need to face alliances bigger and better than yours until you level off where you should be. This isn’t story or event quest, labyrinth or abyss where you can revive your way through when you can’t handle the fight.

    Not sure this makes much sense tbh, if he is in, for arguments sake, diamond 2 and matches massive accounts when he doesn't sandbag but then similarly he matches smaller accounts when he does sandbag. Then how is that unfair/fair, either way he matches player in the same bracket as him (diamond 2). I can safely say that 90% of my own matches was against equal size accounts to mine or they was noticeably higher. Never did I face a mid level TB or cavalier unless I sandbagged .... but when I did match those type of players they was still in the same bracket as me. Hardly unfair when you consider all that.

    If anything, Kabam haven't got the matchmaking parameters set up in a fair way, in that it doesn't match you with ANYBODY in your bracket, it seems to match you against similar (or higher) accounts as you in that bracket. If a cav player and Paragon player are both in diamond 2 then they should absolutely meet at some point or other.

    Side note (before anyone pounces lol) ** I didn't make a point of sandbagging to progress quicker/have an easier life, I did it a few times to test the theory of it all.
  • ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Member Posts: 5,444 ★★★★★
    Chatterofforums said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
    What many don't understand that the people you should be mad at is Kabam, not the sandbaggers. They are the ones who decided to put everyone in Bronze 3 with a win gaining 1 point.
    I'm not mad at any sandbaggers for sandbagging, bad gamed design isn't their fault. However, if you sandbag and you talk as if it was something completely fair that shouldn't be removed from the game then that's a different situation
    I agree that sandbagging should be removed as well as match making done based on prestige should be removed. Matchmaking should be based on what tier the players are in and nothing else.

    Meaning someone in gold 3 should be eligible to face absolutely anyone in gold 3 regardless of prestige based on everyone fighting for same rewards. This thereby eliminates sandbagging as it would be irrelevant.
    Yeah I wouldn't mind that change at all, I don't mind facing a Paragon or a Thronebreaker every once in a while and as long as it's completely random, it would be unrealistic to expect to win every single match after all.
  • MackeyMackey Member Posts: 1,597 ★★★★★
    Chatterofforums said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
    What many don't understand that the people you should be mad at is Kabam, not the sandbaggers. They are the ones who decided to put everyone in Bronze 3 with a win gaining 1 point.
    I'm not mad at any sandbaggers for sandbagging, bad gamed design isn't their fault. However, if you sandbag and you talk as if it was something completely fair that shouldn't be removed from the game then that's a different situation
    I agree that sandbagging should be removed as well as match making done based on prestige should be removed. Matchmaking should be based on what tier the players are in and nothing else.

    Meaning someone in gold 3 should be eligible to face absolutely anyone in gold 3 regardless of prestige based on everyone fighting for same rewards. This thereby eliminates sandbagging as it would be irrelevant.
    Well said, couldn't agree more. If we are all fighting for the same rewards then by rights we should all be matched against one another irrespective of titles etc
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    Chatterofforums said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
    What many don't understand that the people you should be mad at is Kabam, not the sandbaggers. They are the ones who decided to put everyone in Bronze 3 with a win gaining 1 point.
    I'm not mad at any sandbaggers for sandbagging, bad gamed design isn't their fault. However, if you sandbag and you talk as if it was something completely fair that shouldn't be removed from the game then that's a different situation
    I agree that sandbagging should be removed as well as match making done based on prestige should be removed. Matchmaking should be based on what tier the players are in and nothing else.

    Meaning someone in gold 3 should be eligible to face absolutely anyone in gold 3 regardless of prestige based on everyone fighting for same rewards. This thereby eliminates sandbagging as it would be irrelevant.
    @Chatterofforums This would be fine if they if the point system wasnt win 3-5 matches in a row if anyone faces anyone in their bracket then UC and Cav will go up against Paragon which obviously isnt fair you shouldnt be hard stuck because of your progression level this idea would work if you could get points based on how well you did in a match so even if you lose you have the chance to gain points
  • ChatterofforumsChatterofforums Member Posts: 1,779 ★★★★★
    Anly said:

    Chatterofforums said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Anly said:

    I dont think this mechanic works like people think it works, from my experience i would put 2 stars in my deck to find fair matches whenever i would use nothing but my best champs i would always get matched against people with accounts way bigger and better than my own and the same goes for my alliance mates when i did put 2 stars i was able to find fair matches their deck might've been a little better than mine or mine a little better than theirs but for the most part it was fair especially when you factor in the rng to draft champs in your deck. My question now is what am i suppose to do just go on a losing streak because im getting matched against accounts way better than mine? Or just wait till i get lucky win one match then proceed to lose the next 10 matches? If this is gonna be the case for the next season they need to change the point and rank system so that a certain point threshold lets say 0-50 points is stone 51-100 is silver and so on, and you can still gain point if you lose a match and the amount of points you get is based on how well you did that match.

    This is exactly what I've been saying for weeks, top players sandbagging causes a domino effect that ruins the experience for everyone else that isn't at the top. It's getting fixed this upcoming season though so don't sweat it.
    What many don't understand that the people you should be mad at is Kabam, not the sandbaggers. They are the ones who decided to put everyone in Bronze 3 with a win gaining 1 point.
    I'm not mad at any sandbaggers for sandbagging, bad gamed design isn't their fault. However, if you sandbag and you talk as if it was something completely fair that shouldn't be removed from the game then that's a different situation
    I agree that sandbagging should be removed as well as match making done based on prestige should be removed. Matchmaking should be based on what tier the players are in and nothing else.

    Meaning someone in gold 3 should be eligible to face absolutely anyone in gold 3 regardless of prestige based on everyone fighting for same rewards. This thereby eliminates sandbagging as it would be irrelevant.
    @Chatterofforums This would be fine if they if the point system wasnt win 3-5 matches in a row if anyone faces anyone in their bracket then UC and Cav will go up against Paragon which obviously isnt fair you shouldnt be hard stuck because of your progression level this idea would work if you could get points based on how well you did in a match so even if you lose you have the chance to gain points
    We are all competing for same rank rewards. What a low player considers "fair" is very unfair for higher players and vice versa.

    As a comparison example, my alliance is a 85 million alliance. We are mostly retired players and run one optional BG group which keeps us in silver AW most the time. This caused us to face alliances with 20-30 million rating fairly often. Is it fair in AW? Kabam seems to think so as it's been like this for years and we are all fighting for same rank aw rewards. If it's fair in AW when everyone fighting for same rank rewards in season why in world wouldn't it be fair in BG season?

    On a side note, bigger isn't always better. I noted how much stronger we are that. Many alliances we face, funny thing is, it's not that uncommon for us to lose to them at times as we put zero effort into BG (no diversity, no set defenders, no set paths, usually don't even fill a full BG). The little guy can and does (happens in BG too) beat the big guy at times.
  • Panchulon21Panchulon21 Member Posts: 2,605 ★★★★★
    Anly said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    Sokrates_77 said:

    I hear what you say, but unfortunately I don't think it's as simple as that. Your opponent wasn't based on which level you were fighting at, like Gold 2, but on your pool strength. Then, if that is the case, I would have loved to fight guys with the same strenth as me.

    I get your example about the higher you get, the tougher it should be. But if Gold 2 is the league of the Paragons, who are the guys who are fighting in the Gladiator track?

    Correct. Paragons should either start higher or get higher multipliers to move to the GC as quickly as possible.
    @Ironman3000 A better system would be the rank you start at is releative to the rank you finished in the pervious season. So basically if you finished in celestial you'd be placed in like diamond II at the start of next season or something along the line of that.
    This wouldn’t work because then you are punishing paragons for being placed really high and missing out on everything before Diamond or where ever you place us.

    You can’t say “oh just increase the rewards here and there”. Then the ones below us would benefit greatly from playing below us and then getting to where we are with those rewards.
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    Mauled said:

    The word manipulating is the clue. You shouldn’t be manipulating things for your betterment, especially when it’s a clear loophole/coding error.

    If you can’t play against the big boys get better at the game, build your roster and build your skills like the rest of us. After playing this game for 6 months I didn’t you know what, it’s time to join a top 10 alliance because I want those rewards. You have to earn it. Most players won’t ever hit those heights.

    @Mauled Yes i will start manipulating things for my betterment when the the odds are always stacked against me and i have no chance of winning especially when the matches i get from doing so are fair and im not preying on smaller accounts its a no brainer.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,639 ★★★★★
    The problem is what you're describing is a symptom of the larger issue.
  • AnlyAnly Member Posts: 615 ★★
    Panchulon21 said:

    Anly said:

    Ironman3000 said:

    Sokrates_77 said:

    I hear what you say, but unfortunately I don't think it's as simple as that. Your opponent wasn't based on which level you were fighting at, like Gold 2, but on your pool strength. Then, if that is the case, I would have loved to fight guys with the same strenth as me.

    I get your example about the higher you get, the tougher it should be. But if Gold 2 is the league of the Paragons, who are the guys who are fighting in the Gladiator track?

    Correct. Paragons should either start higher or get higher multipliers to move to the GC as quickly as possible.
    @Ironman3000 A better system would be the rank you start at is releative to the rank you finished in the pervious season. So basically if you finished in celestial you'd be placed in like diamond II at the start of next season or something along the line of that.
    This wouldn’t work because then you are punishing paragons for being placed really high and missing out on everything before Diamond or where ever you place us.

    You can’t say “oh just increase the rewards here and there”. Then the ones below us would benefit greatly from playing below us and then getting to where we are with those rewards.
    @Panchulon21 Correct me if im wrong but you are saying that because of this system you would miss out on all the rewards from previous ranks, which is a fair point but i think that can be easily dealt with by just adding trophy tokens and elder mark's to solo obj under the bg's tab
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