Spider-Man Buff Reactions [Merged Threads]
NeoDazaras
Member Posts: 123 ★
In case you're unaware of the details of the OG Spidey rework, here is KarateMike's video covering it. As is commonly known, the rework is subject to change.
In the early days of the Contest, the Science class was by far the weakest. This was in large part due to the general lack of damage in favor of ineffective debuffs. Ironically, Spider-Man was one of the only well-liked Science champions on account of his access to Armor Break (and the damage that came with it). And while champs like Luke Cage and She-Hulk were eventually reworked to have access to both damage and utility, this Spider-Man rework seems to ride the line between the old Science class' meaningless playstyles and the new Science class' toolbox of relevant God-tiers.
As Kabam has mentioned before, many of these buffs to older characters are "not meant to appeal to the endgame players, but to newer players who need easy-to-use champs". This line of thinking is flawed, proven entirely by Seatin's newest Free-To-Play challenge which moves past 1, 2, and 3 champions almost immediately. I digress, the point is that Spidey's rework seems to prioritize a debuff-reliant loop of damage. Kabam has had issues with this implementation in the past, as Deadpool (X-Force) is a prime example of a champion that requires 2 minutes of setup for a miniscule amount of damage. Unlike the missed mark of DPX's rework, Spider-Man's loop seems to have some legs to it despite being very flawed.
Though the loop seems very satisfying to pull off, and the damage seems to be present even if less than expected, the consistency and damage of the loop hinges on the Stun from the Special 2 (which weakens Physical Resistance). This is a problem, as the abundance of content that actively punishes players who rely on Stuns and Parry are prevalent both in early acts and in the latest War and EOP content. And unlike champions like Doctor Doom and America Chavez, who have mechanics that can activate without the assist of a Stun, there's no way to work around a Stun immunity. It simply does not work if they can't be stunned (or worse, punish you for trying it).
So how do we fix it? For starters, replace the Stun effect with a simple Physical Resistance debuff (scaling with the Taunt count as it currently does). This works around the flaw of the loop while still keeping Spidey a debuff reliant Science champion. Additionally, while the selection of Debuffs at Spidey's disposal is very tantalizing, I would like for Kabam to preserve the Armor Break on Heavy that the current version has. Outside of teammate and synergy bonuses (like CAIW), the current Spider-Man is the only Science Champion with access to Armor Break. This gives him a sense of individuality in the class, and acts as a sort of homage for older players as the once useful Spider-Man in the early days of the contest.
TL;DR Spidey's rework looks fun and relevant, but suffers a critical design flaw that may hinder its ease-of-use for both new and veteran players. With these changes, I think Spider-Man's new kit would be a welcome addition to The Contest. [6.5/10]
In the early days of the Contest, the Science class was by far the weakest. This was in large part due to the general lack of damage in favor of ineffective debuffs. Ironically, Spider-Man was one of the only well-liked Science champions on account of his access to Armor Break (and the damage that came with it). And while champs like Luke Cage and She-Hulk were eventually reworked to have access to both damage and utility, this Spider-Man rework seems to ride the line between the old Science class' meaningless playstyles and the new Science class' toolbox of relevant God-tiers.
As Kabam has mentioned before, many of these buffs to older characters are "not meant to appeal to the endgame players, but to newer players who need easy-to-use champs". This line of thinking is flawed, proven entirely by Seatin's newest Free-To-Play challenge which moves past 1, 2, and 3 champions almost immediately. I digress, the point is that Spidey's rework seems to prioritize a debuff-reliant loop of damage. Kabam has had issues with this implementation in the past, as Deadpool (X-Force) is a prime example of a champion that requires 2 minutes of setup for a miniscule amount of damage. Unlike the missed mark of DPX's rework, Spider-Man's loop seems to have some legs to it despite being very flawed.
Though the loop seems very satisfying to pull off, and the damage seems to be present even if less than expected, the consistency and damage of the loop hinges on the Stun from the Special 2 (which weakens Physical Resistance). This is a problem, as the abundance of content that actively punishes players who rely on Stuns and Parry are prevalent both in early acts and in the latest War and EOP content. And unlike champions like Doctor Doom and America Chavez, who have mechanics that can activate without the assist of a Stun, there's no way to work around a Stun immunity. It simply does not work if they can't be stunned (or worse, punish you for trying it).
So how do we fix it? For starters, replace the Stun effect with a simple Physical Resistance debuff (scaling with the Taunt count as it currently does). This works around the flaw of the loop while still keeping Spidey a debuff reliant Science champion. Additionally, while the selection of Debuffs at Spidey's disposal is very tantalizing, I would like for Kabam to preserve the Armor Break on Heavy that the current version has. Outside of teammate and synergy bonuses (like CAIW), the current Spider-Man is the only Science Champion with access to Armor Break. This gives him a sense of individuality in the class, and acts as a sort of homage for older players as the once useful Spider-Man in the early days of the contest.
TL;DR Spidey's rework looks fun and relevant, but suffers a critical design flaw that may hinder its ease-of-use for both new and veteran players. With these changes, I think Spider-Man's new kit would be a welcome addition to The Contest. [6.5/10]
Post edited by Kabam Miike on
19
Comments
The data disagrees with your statement. This is the current spidey kit.
But i think it is okay, not good but still okay
The things I like about what OP shows
1. More damage and no random evades when trying to parry.
2. More utility
3. He will be a less annoying defender since champions like valkyrie can safely hit his block without worry of him evading. Also with all those debuffs, willpower is going to go crazy 🤣
That's pretty pathetic as a passing grade for reworks of champs that absolutely suck. The goal shouldn't be for him to still suck, but only oh-so slightly less and in a different way. It's a waste of time and what we've been told are very limited resources to do this bit of worthlessness.
What is this bringing to the table? His evade is better because it won't screw you up when it unexpectedly triggers. That's definitely a thing. He can stack exceedingly weak taunts. They couldn't work in something of more value like a solid perk for each debuff or some novel application of those existing debuffs?
As far as what he is bringing to the table, he brings utility, that's about it. Easy to access utility that can help newer players deal with more annoying enemies if they don't have better options.
Assuming that was the case though, why do they have to keep his damage this low? Hulk's new kit isn't looking that complicated yet his damage is going to be very very good. They can increase the damage and keep it simple.
"Not all buffs are intended to be for every kind of player. Classic Spider Man's new kit is carefully designed with new players as the primary focus since he is one of the champs that new players get early on in the game"
IMO even Cosmic Spidey is better than this buffed kit for Classic Spidey
He is not bringing anything new to the table