So September is the 1 year anniversary of the 7* Incursions and Loyalty crystals

Think they will be updated in the next patch?

Comments

They should be in an announcement or a special message, instead of the thread of a player, because interesting for a lot of players.

You could potentially argue that ANYTHING than a Kabam Mod replies in ANY thread should be in a separate announcement type post, to expand visibility, etc.

If you’re interested (and especially while the Forum Server Bug is continuing with not applying Mod/Admin Label under posts where a Mod has commented in), you could always just have permanent open tabs (or bookmarks) for each of the Mods (Crashed, Dork, Pinwheel), to see their Profile.
In which you can either click on all of their COMMENTS made in posts, or their Posts they’ve created.

Checking those, you'd be able to see whatever they are commenting or posting about, no matter what category or thread it was in.

ShashankGupta

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.
AW engagement didn't go up, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Incursions engagement went through the roof, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Lol what
Not sure if this is a good faith argument or not, but if you read what I wrote, Incursions engagement increased as a result of the work we did with Sagas. The spike happened long after the Incursions crystal was introduced, and it's clear the fact the crystal hasn't been updated is not holding back participation at all.

So as you are reading the msg continuously so Sir I want to ask you are there any plans to update the incursion rewards for the sec 6 Because even after having a ranked up hercules aegon 7 Star Angela galan still I don't feel any worth to do incursion at all.The only time I do incursion is when we get buffed up incursion in one saga month
Remember the sec 6 rewards were so good when it got updated first time but these rewards are so outdated now considering you can get way more t6cc crystals t6 basic and t3 alpha and sig stones from battleground store
I feel like you should do something to bring back the engagement in this mode
For example - I am currently at 342k incursion artifacts and but still don't want to do incursion because I feel like one mistake and one dangerous node can destroy all your hardwork

I want to give you the best example of my incursion experience via other game mode
Like when I know I have the backup of revive i literally don't use that much revive but if I play a game mode without revive that day I use way more revive
So I want you to give us the ability to purchase incursion revive and potions via incursion artifacts I can wait for one more month to get incursion crystal instead of using units to get through incursion zone 25

I want to say so much more but for now I am stopping on this much
I will make a post on my feelings on incursion in future
I hope you reply positively
Thank you

Ayden_noah1

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.
AW engagement didn't go up, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Incursions engagement went through the roof, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Lol what
Not sure if this is a good faith argument or not, but if you read what I wrote, Incursions engagement increased as a result of the work we did with Sagas. The spike happened long after the Incursions crystal was introduced, and it's clear the fact the crystal hasn't been updated is not holding back participation at all.

Reading is not part of a Summoners' repertoire. So you are definitely expecting to much. Thanks for all the info. Now my hunt for Angela and Black Cat continues.

Buttehrs

While we're on the subject of adding champs to basic 7* pool, any word on when saga chase champs will be added as well? Speaking specifically of CMM, nightcrawler and soon to be Mr sinister?

Searmenis

Well, a few months after the incursions crystal was introduced, the engagement kept being high because of the meta saga rewards, not for a bunch of champs that most (valiant) players already got the majority if not all of them.

As for the AW one, 70 days waiting to open one crystal, is what makes it false "engagement". That's still unchangeable, and the reason is...well, a 70 days waiting period of one crystal. I m not even mentioning the loyalty store, it s a joke for this engaged year now.

Elwind

AW and Incursions crystals don't bring anybody on this game mods because this crystals' champion pools is not interesting enough as u think.
Why don't you consider this possibility?

Maverick75

@SummonerNR

First thanks for the tip!

I meant that these informations are very important and could avoid some threads in the different parts of the forum (General, Feedbacks, Requests). The lazy players don’t bother to use the search function and simply create new threads…

The 7* roadmap is a topic on which very few informations are communicated.

MaxtheSilent

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.

Appreciate the response and transparency. It’s helpful in deciding whether or not to open them now for people who don’t get loyalty all that quickly.

EdisonLaw

Screw these crystals. Opened 2 of each for 2 namors and 2 mordos.

Mordo and Namor highly benefit from their sigs

Searmenis

Screw these crystals. Opened 2 of each for 2 namors and 2 mordos.
Mordo and Namor highly benefit from their sigs

Yeah, if he continues pop the same champs, he ll have a sig 100 fall next year.

Oakenshield

Screw these crystals. Opened 2 of each for 2 namors and 2 mordos.

Definitely feel your pain. Hoping for something new vs this again with my next spin in a couple of weeks.

Emilia90

I agree with Lags take on this, why do we need this same pool for another year lmao. There’s not much incentive for most of us and getting some of these champs in the basic would be great

I think the incursions pool is fine actually but come on, only one champ in the loyalty pool needs high sig. Guess it gives me more chances to get black cat but otherwise that’s pretty disappointing

DNA3000

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.
AW engagement didn't go up, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Incursions engagement went through the roof, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Lol what
Not sure if this is a good faith argument or not, but if you read what I wrote, Incursions engagement increased as a result of the work we did with Sagas. The spike happened long after the Incursions crystal was introduced, and it's clear the fact the crystal hasn't been updated is not holding back participation at all.

If it helps at all, as the senior forum expert I'm sure.

BigBlueOx

I agree with Lags take on this, why do we need this same pool for another year lmao. There’s not much incentive for most of us and getting some of these champs in the basic would be great

I think the incursions pool is fine actually but come on, only one champ in the loyalty pool needs high sig. Guess it gives me more chances to get black cat but otherwise that’s pretty disappointing

Considering there are champs that are in the game that could move into these crystals naturally it does seem like an odd decision but considering all the much larger issues this seems like a super low hanging fruit too.

Viper198787

Screw these crystals. Opened 2 of each for 2 namors and 2 mordos.
Definitely feel your pain. Hoping for something new vs this again with my next spin in a couple of weeks.

I want that so bad 😭. He’s the only champ I cared about and the only champ I don’t have.

Wicket329

I agree with Lags take on this, why do we need this same pool for another year lmao. There’s not much incentive for most of us and getting some of these champs in the basic would be great

I think the incursions pool is fine actually but come on, only one champ in the loyalty pool needs high sig. Guess it gives me more chances to get black cat but otherwise that’s pretty disappointing
Considering there are champs that are in the game that could move into these crystals naturally it does seem like an odd decision but considering all the much larger issues this seems like a super low hanging fruit too.

I think people are looking at this from the wrong angle, let me try to put a different perspective on it.

The game has a finite number of older champions who have not yet been released as 7*s, and their data says that these crystals are not what drive engagement with the modes. So why would they take twelve more champions out of their limited supply to refresh crystals that do not seem to be a draw for the mode?

More importantly, do we really want that? Like, if you had to choose between 7* Kingpin going into the Incursions or Loyalty pool for another year+ or the Titan pool, which would you prefer? Personally I open way more Titans than I do either of the limited pool, so that would be my preference.

IlociaM

Is it too costly to grind for 4 months to get a chance at a mid 7*?? Noooo I'm sure the problem are the players who don't engage whit the crystals

BigBlueOx

I agree with Lags take on this, why do we need this same pool for another year lmao. There’s not much incentive for most of us and getting some of these champs in the basic would be great

I think the incursions pool is fine actually but come on, only one champ in the loyalty pool needs high sig. Guess it gives me more chances to get black cat but otherwise that’s pretty disappointing
Considering there are champs that are in the game that could move into these crystals naturally it does seem like an odd decision but considering all the much larger issues this seems like a super low hanging fruit too.
I think people are looking at this from the wrong angle, let me try to put a different perspective on it.

The game has a finite number of older champions who have not yet been released as 7*s, and their data says that these crystals are not what drive engagement with the modes. So why would they take twelve more champions out of their limited supply to refresh crystals that do not seem to be a draw for the mode?

More importantly, do we really want that? Like, if you had to choose between 7* Kingpin going into the Incursions or Loyalty pool for another year+ or the Titan pool, which would you prefer? Personally I open way more Titans than I do either of the limited pool, so that would be my preference.

Let my clarify, I’m referring exclusively to 7stars that have already been introduced to the game but are not in the basic or titan pool. Like this group of reunion champs could have moved to AW crystal easily with Wags and Man Thing being in there.

For incursions, the gifted guardians could have moved in there as an example. No runway burn and it creates a rotation that Kabam can use going forward, keeping those pools fresh too.

IvarTheBoneless

Well, a few months after the incursions crystal was introduced, the engagement kept being high because of the meta saga rewards, not for a bunch of champs that most (valiant) players already got the majority if not all of them.

As for the AW one, 70 days waiting to open one crystal, is what makes it false "engagement". That's still unchangeable, and the reason is...well, a 70 days waiting period of one crystal. I m not even mentioning the loyalty store, it s a joke for this engaged year now.

This this this. I played high tier aw for more than a few seasons and didn't open a lot of crystals. The only thing keeping me from engaging with it is how long it takes to acquire one. I simply don't care anymore.

And that's from someone with a r2 unduped void.

Savage123456789

It's not really the idea of these crystals that hasn't pulled people into incursions/AW, it's the pool of champions in the crystals. I would wager a lot of money that the omega days pool would have increased participation in incursions. The same is true if you guys tried to sell the current incursions pool for cash like the omega days event, I doubt if they would sell for that much in comparison. Unless you really love namor, capiw, mojo or angela, most people aren't playing these guys unless they are sig 200. So the effort doesn't really match the reward for most people to keep going into incursions. I mainly run incursions cause I still want the resources from top zone rewards (don't spend that much in game) and want to collect all champs especially now with the introduction of crucible.

ShashankGupta

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.
AW engagement didn't go up, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Incursions engagement went through the roof, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Lol what
Not sure if this is a good faith argument or not, but if you read what I wrote, Incursions engagement increased as a result of the work we did with Sagas. The spike happened long after the Incursions crystal was introduced, and it's clear the fact the crystal hasn't been updated is not holding back participation at all.
So as you are reading the msg continuously so Sir I want to ask you are there any plans to update the incursion rewards for the sec 6 Because even after having a ranked up hercules aegon 7 Star Angela galan still I don't feel any worth to do incursion at all.The only time I do incursion is when we get buffed up incursion in one saga month
Remember the sec 6 rewards were so good when it got updated first time but these rewards are so outdated now considering you can get way more t6cc crystals t6 basic and t3 alpha and sig stones from battleground store
I feel like you should do something to bring back the engagement in this mode
For example - I am currently at 342k incursion artifacts and but still don't want to do incursion because I feel like one mistake and one dangerous node can destroy all your hardwork

I want to give you the best example of my incursion experience via other game mode
Like when I know I have the backup of revive i literally don't use that much revive but if I play a game mode without revive that day I use way more revive
So I want you to give us the ability to purchase incursion revive and potions via incursion artifacts I can wait for one more month to get incursion crystal instead of using units to get through incursion zone 25

I want to say so much more but for now I am stopping on this much
I will make a post on my feelings on incursion in future
I hope you reply positively
Thank you

Do you guys think I said right here ?
Do you think we need the incursion update/rewards with other ways to buy incursion revive

Kuzuri_1832

I think Kabam might remove those crystals before introducing new exclusive 7 stars. If the crystals aren't attracting new summoners to the modes, they might sunset the idea altogether. Consider how many 6 stars aren't yet available as 7 stars, and how many Titan and special event pools will be added before Kabam needs to rethink their 7-star release strategy. Since Titans are meant to be exclusive, they need to space out releases and avoid introducing new 7 stars in other ways, or they’d have to adjust their Titan cadence.

Pandingo

Lower. The. Cost. And up the availability. The fact that we are this deep into 7* and we are only able to open one every like two months.....if you wanna keep em that's fine. But for God's sake lower the cost. Most champs need a high sig to be viable. And with such a deep 7* pool now they are no longer chase champs. Make em more available.

Savage123456789

Lower. The. Cost. And up the availability. The fact that we are this deep into 7* and we are only able to open one every like two months.....if you wanna keep em that's fine. But for God's sake lower the cost. Most champs need a high sig to be viable. And with such a deep 7* pool now they are no longer chase champs. Make em more available.

Funny thing is they increased the amount of loyalty tokens we get from AW rewards, so that makes the loyalty crystal easier to obtain, but they haven't changed the rate of acquisition for the incursion one which has champs that want to be sig 200. Kabam logic is funny.

Rebark

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.
AW engagement didn't go up, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Incursions engagement went through the roof, so we're not changing the crystal pool.

Lol what
Not sure if this is a good faith argument or not, but if you read what I wrote, Incursions engagement increased as a result of the work we did with Sagas. The spike happened long after the Incursions crystal was introduced, and it's clear the fact the crystal hasn't been updated is not holding back participation at all.

As a player, I can say that I stopped doing incursions because the reward x difficulty ratio is not worth it.
I'm not even talking about difficulty in the literal sense, but raids already involve a lot of RNG, with 25 rooms, it's terrible.
I think that reducing the number to 15 rooms would already make everything satisfactory.

captain_rogers

I believe kabam has a responsibility here.

A year ago, when 7* loyalty and incursions crystal were introduced, The 7* pool is quite limited, so they had more "balanced options" to introduce.

Now, if they try to change the pool, they are forced to introduce champs who are better than the current pool, in order to make it more exciting. But if they introduce the good options, like stealthy or ibom, then they run out of options for titan cystals. If they introduce mid champs, people will complain.

dr2ws

Unsure if this is already here, but Lagacy made a good point about adding a BG’s crystal or an AQ crystal, something for people to grind for, hopefully this is something Kabam is down to do in the future, as I’d play BG’s even more if a 7* crystal like that was available at a high cost, I’m sure a lot of people would too.

ahmynuts

Screw these crystals. Opened 2 of each for 2 namors and 2 mordos.
Definitely feel your pain. Hoping for something new vs this again with my next spin in a couple of weeks.

Ronin is massively underrated

unknown

This content has been removed.

Viper198787

When we introduced these crystals, I said they would remain unchanged for at least a year. We deliberately included champions requiring high sig to give them some longevity, in case we decided against updating them. After reviewing the data, we have no plans to update these crystals.

In the case of the AW crystal, the idea was that including a champion chase would result in more players engaging with AW. I can't find any evidence of that. It looks like the same players that always played AW continue to play it, and the same players that didn't play AW continued to not play it. It creates a fun additional chase for those playing AW, but given there was effectively no discernable behaviour change, it seems unwise to use up six more champions in our 7-star runway to update the crystal.

On the Incursions side, our iteration on Saga Incursions has absolutely crushed our engagement targets. More players played Incursions for Arcade Games than any point aside from when Incursions replaced the Side Quest. Similar to AW, I don't believe updating the Incursions pool is going to bring anybody into Incursions that isn't already playing it. It might make a few people do Incursions in off cycles, but Saga Incursions is intended to be the late-game Incursions meta moving forward. So again, burning six champions from the runway to update the crystal for little to no benefit seems unwise.

I am not saying they will literally never change, but I will give players at least a few builds of warning if/when that happens. Until you hear more from us it's safe to assume they are not changing.

I also echo a few of the statements with the cost. I’ve lost interest in incursions due to the sheer amount of currency needed to buy the crystals. 400k is still a huge price to pay for these crystals. I might open one every 3 months on average. Some months I can’t be bothered to do incursions because I don’t feel good about the RNG for 25 rooms. Other times I just think about how many times I’ve done it just to not pull a champ I want. I know 1/6 chance is better than 1/100 but it hasn’t worked out for me yet. At least if those champs move to the basic we have more opportunities to acquire them via basic, nexus, paragon, and valiant crystals. It just feels bad. It’s such a slog for disappointment.

You’re by far my favorite Kabam employee. You tend to try to do your best to toe the line between Kabam and players and from what I’ve seen you’re always direct. I just wanted to see if you’d let us know what the intention was behind the massive increase in incursion crystal cost. Every rarity crystal higher has always been a 300% increase. This means that the 7* crystal should theoretically be 162,000 incursions artifacts. Yet it actually skyrocketed 740% to 400,000. I could understand that 7* were newer and a smaller pool but the pool also doesn’t contain top tier champs like the 6* and lower ones. So why wasn’t the cost ~250,000 or 300,000 at the most? Can you reduce the cost of the artifacts to get a crystal so it feels more worthwhile to do incursions? 400,000 is just so much.