@DNA3000 this was never in court but an out of court settlement in which nintendeo was offering gloves to all owners of mario party as a result of complaints that people were suffering injury from the way they were playing a game.
So yes it is possible that a company can be found liable for this kind of thing.
If the company could be seen as or fojnd to be harbouring cyberbullying then it could very easily be held somewhat accountable. It would be very easy to show that by releasing a players name they have opened up that player to cyberbullying.
By not releasing the players name it would be easy for the company to defend that they did the best they could to maintain the playing experiance and integrity of its game for its users whilst also protecting the offender.
The law for things like this is often bs amd keeps evolving and often means that noone has to take responsibility for its actions these days as there is always some bigger fish to blame.
Agree or disagree thats your choice i dont think here is the place to continue this discussion on the legal side.
But i agree with them bot releasing the name in an attempt to pretect the players privacy but also believe the player should be auto kicked from the alliance they are in
Alliances from Master to Platinum 3 should all be reviewed for piloting and use of mod - even if they use VPN before season ends. Theyre getting gutsy thinking towards the end , nothing will be done. Just my general opinion and what ive witnessed. @Kabam Miike
If the company could be seen as or fojnd to be harbouring cyberbullying then it could very easily be held somewhat accountable. It would be very easy to show that by releasing a players name they have opened up that player to cyberbullying.
By not releasing the players name it would be easy for the company to defend that they did the best they could to maintain the playing experiance and integrity of its game for its users whilst also protecting the offender.
The law for things like this is often bs amd keeps evolving and often means that noone has to take responsibility for its actions these days as there is always some bigger fish to blame.
Agree or disagree thats your choice i dont think here is the place to continue this discussion on the legal side.
But i agree with them bot releasing the name in an attempt to pretect the players privacy but also believe the player should be auto kicked from the alliance they are in
What if an alliance gets the message that a player is cheating and they guess a random guy that they kick. The cheater in the alliance after that stops cheating and now the random guy is getting stalked because since he left the alliance is cheat free? We can make up more stories on both sides. However a Game that is heavy focused on Alliances and teamplay where now a group is being lpenalized and can’t take any action when an unknown player is refusing to play faire is terrible service.
If the company could be seen as or fojnd to be harbouring cyberbullying then it could very easily be held somewhat accountable. It would be very easy to show that by releasing a players name they have opened up that player to cyberbullying.
By not releasing the players name it would be easy for the company to defend that they did the best they could to maintain the playing experiance and integrity of its game for its users whilst also protecting the offender.
The law for things like this is often bs amd keeps evolving and often means that noone has to take responsibility for its actions these days as there is always some bigger fish to blame.
Agree or disagree thats your choice i dont think here is the place to continue this discussion on the legal side.
But i agree with them bot releasing the name in an attempt to pretect the players privacy but also believe the player should be auto kicked from the alliance they are in
What if an alliance gets the message that a player is cheating and they guess a random guy that they kick. The cheater in the alliance after that stops cheating and now the random guy is getting stalked because since he left the alliance is cheat free? We can make up more stories on both sides. However a Game that is heavy focused on Alliances and teamplay where now a group is being lpenalized and can’t take any action when an unknown player is refusing to play faire is terrible service.
This is why i say the penalized player should be auto kicked and banned.
But the alliance also needs to lose rewards that may have been gained due to that player cheating otherwise what would stop me as my alliance leader starting another account using mods to ensure we always get the boss kill with no deaths.... not caring if that account gets banned as i would just make another...
An alliance that Cheats is a cheater even if its 1 person.
The amount if piloting that happened in season 1 and even in season 2 was so bad.
If you take and look at the list of alliances that Made Master/Plat1 in SEASON 1
u can definitely see a lot of alliances have fallen off in season 2.
Just recently 3 alliances got hit with reduction to war points. I hope it continues.
I think kabam is doing a better job than last season by stepping and giving people who legitly play this game to its highest levels and to get highest rewards as best as possible.
Nothing is perfect but it was better than nothing last season.
Saw one alliance dropped from master to plat 1 with 500 points reduction.
These alliances will meet easier opponent based on their new war rating.
They are somehow punished but also having advantage for the remaining wars?
Does these alliances still deserve a plat 1 rewards after caught on cheating?
Yes, they dont get master rewards. but do they even deserve to be in plat 1?
Alliances who caught for cheating at the end of the season should be penalised more than those who get caught at the beginning of the season as they have gained points through cheating from more wars.
Saw one alliance dropped from master to plat 1 with 500 points reduction.
These alliances will meet easier opponent based on their new war rating.
They are somehow punished but also having advantage for the remaining wars?
Does these alliances still deserve a plat 1 rewards after caught on cheating?
Yes, they dont get master rewards. but do they even deserve to be in plat 1?
Alliances who caught for cheating at the end of the season should be penalised more than those who get caught at the beginning of the season as they have gained points through cheating from more wars.
They wont only get easier opponents... without cheating maybe the opponents they get now will be harder....
Unless you drop them all the way to 0 there will always be people saying they are now affected unfairly.....
But they have been dropped away from all the alliances directly affected by their cheating. And with lower multiplier will not be able to climb back.
You cannot say for certainty they gained via cheating from more wars.... it possible maybe they only cheated on a couple of wars.....
Most allies i have seen cheat (using mods) play legit for most of the war.... then if they win they dont appear to cheat.
But if they are losing they will hack last minute to steal victory.
@InfinityWarrior123 it was 2 allainces, we moved up 2 spots in plat 1. total of 3 alliances was hit yesterday.
there was 3 allainces as soon as maintenance was over, received hundreds of war rating, 2 of them even had a 3600 rating. but kabam fixed and deducted points from those 3 allainces
further showing that alliances are still "cheating" this deep into the season
I would love to see them dropped right down if it is piloting. Cus piloting involves thebwhole alliance and they deserve nothing.
This will then mean a lowly little gold 3 ally like mine can make gold 2.... we fluctuate between 1400 gold 2 and 100 gold 3 depending on exact war score and when we check....
I would like to know that are the current rankings correct? They got fluctuated quite a lot. We do wars honestly and hence our rankings got slightly better so want to know that current ranks are correct? Or any further adjustments needs to be done? Just so that we can think of giving a good final push as we are very close to going up a tier.
@DNA3000 this was never in court but an out of court settlement in which nintendeo was offering gloves to all owners of mario party as a result of complaints that people were suffering injury from the way they were playing a game.
So yes it is possible that a company can be found liable for this kind of thing.
"This kind of thing." The kind of thing your reference *legally* refers to is product liability, which is why I believe you aren't applying legal reasoning, just casual reasoning. In that case, the legal argument almost certainly revolved around whether Nintendo had a legal responsibility to design the product in a way that minimized injury to the player.
But there is no legal responsibility to punish MMO players for infractions invisibly, because if there was such a legal responsibility they couldn't ban anyone, because banning a player is not invisible: it removes them from play which is a detectable punishment. These two situations are *legally* completely different.
The legal subject you should consider researching is the fundamentals of a tort action, basically what the simplified legal test is for a valid lawsuit. It is usually stated to be duty, breach, damage, and causation. In other words, for you to be able to sue someone else for damages, you must demonstrate they had a legal duty of some kind, they breached (violated, ignored, or broke) that duty, that doing so caused harm, and that harm was reasonably foreseeable as a possible consequence of their breach.
Where your argument fails is in step one: duty. MMO operators have no legal duty to ensure no one finds out that another player is being disciplined for violating the terms of service of the game. Because of that, the other tests are moot: whether it can be shown to cause harm or not is irrelevant if there was no duty being breached.
In the Nintendo case, there was a theoretical duty: product manufacturers have some duty to make their products safe when used. Whether they exercised sufficient care in that duty is a matter that is reasonable to decide at trial.
Comments
So yes it is possible that a company can be found liable for this kind of thing.
https://www.cnet.com/news/nintendo-offers-glove-to-prevent-joystick-injuries/
As i said the line would be easy to draw when and if the company specifically stated an offending player.
By not releasing the players name it would be easy for the company to defend that they did the best they could to maintain the playing experiance and integrity of its game for its users whilst also protecting the offender.
The law for things like this is often bs amd keeps evolving and often means that noone has to take responsibility for its actions these days as there is always some bigger fish to blame.
Agree or disagree thats your choice i dont think here is the place to continue this discussion on the legal side.
But i agree with them bot releasing the name in an attempt to pretect the players privacy but also believe the player should be auto kicked from the alliance they are in
What if an alliance gets the message that a player is cheating and they guess a random guy that they kick. The cheater in the alliance after that stops cheating and now the random guy is getting stalked because since he left the alliance is cheat free? We can make up more stories on both sides. However a Game that is heavy focused on Alliances and teamplay where now a group is being lpenalized and can’t take any action when an unknown player is refusing to play faire is terrible service.
This is why i say the penalized player should be auto kicked and banned.
But the alliance also needs to lose rewards that may have been gained due to that player cheating otherwise what would stop me as my alliance leader starting another account using mods to ensure we always get the boss kill with no deaths.... not caring if that account gets banned as i would just make another...
The amount if piloting that happened in season 1 and even in season 2 was so bad.
If you take and look at the list of alliances that Made Master/Plat1 in SEASON 1
u can definitely see a lot of alliances have fallen off in season 2.
Just recently 3 alliances got hit with reduction to war points. I hope it continues.
I think kabam is doing a better job than last season by stepping and giving people who legitly play this game to its highest levels and to get highest rewards as best as possible.
Nothing is perfect but it was better than nothing last season.
These alliances will meet easier opponent based on their new war rating.
They are somehow punished but also having advantage for the remaining wars?
Does these alliances still deserve a plat 1 rewards after caught on cheating?
Yes, they dont get master rewards. but do they even deserve to be in plat 1?
Alliances who caught for cheating at the end of the season should be penalised more than those who get caught at the beginning of the season as they have gained points through cheating from more wars.
They wont only get easier opponents... without cheating maybe the opponents they get now will be harder....
Unless you drop them all the way to 0 there will always be people saying they are now affected unfairly.....
But they have been dropped away from all the alliances directly affected by their cheating. And with lower multiplier will not be able to climb back.
You cannot say for certainty they gained via cheating from more wars.... it possible maybe they only cheated on a couple of wars.....
Most allies i have seen cheat (using mods) play legit for most of the war.... then if they win they dont appear to cheat.
But if they are losing they will hack last minute to steal victory.
there was 3 allainces as soon as maintenance was over, received hundreds of war rating, 2 of them even had a 3600 rating. but kabam fixed and deducted points from those 3 allainces
further showing that alliances are still "cheating" this deep into the season
further increases our chances of being in master! please keep busting down cheaters, this season isn't over till its over.....
@Kabam Miike
@Kabam Wolf
@Kabam Vydious
@Kabam Zibiit
@Kabam Loto
This will then mean a lowly little gold 3 ally like mine can make gold 2.... we fluctuate between 1400 gold 2 and 100 gold 3 depending on exact war score and when we check....
"This kind of thing." The kind of thing your reference *legally* refers to is product liability, which is why I believe you aren't applying legal reasoning, just casual reasoning. In that case, the legal argument almost certainly revolved around whether Nintendo had a legal responsibility to design the product in a way that minimized injury to the player.
But there is no legal responsibility to punish MMO players for infractions invisibly, because if there was such a legal responsibility they couldn't ban anyone, because banning a player is not invisible: it removes them from play which is a detectable punishment. These two situations are *legally* completely different.
The legal subject you should consider researching is the fundamentals of a tort action, basically what the simplified legal test is for a valid lawsuit. It is usually stated to be duty, breach, damage, and causation. In other words, for you to be able to sue someone else for damages, you must demonstrate they had a legal duty of some kind, they breached (violated, ignored, or broke) that duty, that doing so caused harm, and that harm was reasonably foreseeable as a possible consequence of their breach.
Where your argument fails is in step one: duty. MMO operators have no legal duty to ensure no one finds out that another player is being disciplined for violating the terms of service of the game. Because of that, the other tests are moot: whether it can be shown to cause harm or not is irrelevant if there was no duty being breached.
In the Nintendo case, there was a theoretical duty: product manufacturers have some duty to make their products safe when used. Whether they exercised sufficient care in that duty is a matter that is reasonable to decide at trial.
The issue with the incorrect ratings has been resolved. This thread will now be closed because it has gone off topic.
Please keep in mind that calling out and accusing players of cheating is against the forum rules.