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Alliance War Death Shaming

Left an alliance over this and [REDACTED] is [REDACTED] with regards to the constant preoccupation with AW death watch culture.

Like seriously, posting in real time in main chat chastising people for dying in alliance war... like the newly shamed went in making the decision "I'm going to die on this node! Pew! Pew! Aaaarrrrggghhh!"

And the ALL CAPS warnings DON'T DIE before you've even fought anyone. Every war. Like the soon to be shamed don't get the fundamental concept of the game (kill or be killed).

Not talking about me specifically dying necessarily (though it happens! wheeeeee!), just the vibe and overt, well, nastiness. It's actually comical on a surface level. But I'm wondering where all the fun went? AW rewards aren't even good (per war or per season) except at the top insane levels (which I imagine aren't fun at all).

Is this "a thing"? Is it super prevalent? Isolated? Or am I just a death shaming culture magnet? Have I fallen into an Alliance War death shaming culture black hole?

I'm not a snow flake about it... I try to lighten the mood with animated stickers and memes and animated gifs and other fun stuff. Admittedly, at times these go over like a lead balloon. But at least I can make myself laugh about it. Thank God I have a high prestige, right?????????

Are there any alliances where people have ***fun*** with alliance war, win ***or*** lose?

Is anyone in an alliance where you are afraid to actually partake, out of fear of dying and getting death shamed? Or even afraid to talk in chat at all? [REDACTED] in an alliance where I swear over half the people I don't think I've ever seen post one word in chat. The Unchatted.

The funniest thing to me though is the biggest bullies (the death shame'rs) die too, they just spend hide it.

One guy proclaimed he gave up only one death all season (a never die'r), and (outside of that) I happened to be on in AW and saw him lose two champs on one node (!) and quickly spend revive and spend heal to spend hide it.

I never see the bullies point out their own deaths in chat... not one time. Hmmmm...

And the death shaming doesn't even touch on the ego killing.

Like in one AW, this ego fighter (also death shame'r and a self proclaimed never die'r) took out the last mini and took the first shot at the boss... I watched, and he died (even though he's a never die'r!) and I was there with my 5* R5 Hood at 100% health with a class advantage and the boss had like 5% health left (and there was hours left to finish AW) and he quickly spend revived and spend healed not only to spend hide his death but to spend ego kill the official kill and brag about it. Of course, he never mentioned he died twice. <insert Line sticker of the yellow haired dude giggling behind his hand>

Anyway, just curious about this mostly in the "normal" tiers of playing this game. I know with the blubbery alliances <insert whale sticker> it's like off the charts I'm sure <insert whale sticker blowing from his spout>, but I find it kind of laughable in the "normal" tiers since the rewards are so weak and the stakes are so low (immeasurable even?) outside of people's imaginations (and egos!).

Thoughts?

The end.

Signed,

Anonymous (posting for "a friend")
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    NojokejaymNojokejaym Posts: 3,930 ★★★★★
    edited December 2018
    well my alliance is pretty chill they dont shame people for dying, it happens it's apart of the game. I die at least 3x every season, not every war but every season
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    SMNYSMNY Posts: 69
    Tyyraww wrote: »
    Well if you know he died call that dude out haha. For real tho why give him a free pass, just stamp it with one of your stickers you know as a “joke”

    I asked "my friend" and he said he doesn't believe in death shaming. Even against the death shame'rs. Maybe he is one of The Unchatted?
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    MaatManMaatMan Posts: 958 ★★★
    We always tell peeps to he careful.
    We tell peeps constantly to duel for practice.
    We tell peeps to use boosts if need be to avoid dying.

    But at the end of the day people die.
    Its wat happens.
    We are just falling shy of gold 1 this season 100 - 200 gold 2.
    We have picked up some good strong members this season cus they got sick of the stress amd pressure and fear of the boot if they died in war.
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    KattohSKattohS Posts: 717 ★★
    My progression has slowed but the best thing I’ve done this year was take a break from AW & AQ.

    Concentrate on 100%ing act 5 (just reached 5.2.6), doing EQ and pushing thru arena (spun 1million during the gold boost week) also ranking my 5*s.
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    CoBfan1987CoBfan1987 Posts: 231
    Sounds like you need to just join a better, less intense Ally.
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    DrownedGodDrownedGod Posts: 276
    Current alliance doesnt stress at all about deaths.
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    SMNYSMNY Posts: 69
    Don't want get held accountable for deaths? Don't play in higher tiers.

    Very few people never die but there are those that refuse to use items and selfishly only use glory for stuff like t2a that are serial death givers. They should absolutely be held accountable and eventually booted if they're in a competitive alliance

    What do you consider “higher tier”?

    How do you define “competitive alliance”?

    What does “held accountable” mean?
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    DshuDshu Posts: 1,503 ★★★★
    We always shame people for dying in aw but we also shame people for not being the one to solo the boss. Its part of the fun here. We do it light heartedly nobody's getting kicked for a death in a game. Then again we are mostly retired and enjoy playing for fun it is a game after all
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    JadedJaded Posts: 5,476 ★★★★★
    zeezee57 wrote: »
    I agree to a degree. Dying occasionally happens to all but the very best, it happens and I think most people understand that. On the other hand though you do have 29 other people depending on your performance to be up to par with the rest of the alliance and if a single member or two are dying at a significantly higher rate then the rest and in turn costing the ally as a whole better rewards should they not be called out on it or at minimum have a discussion about moving to an ally that better suits their level of play?

    To be clear I'm not for "bullying" people about it or just being a **** over it, which I think is what you're getting at here, but I do think people should be held accountable and play to the standard of the rest of the ally.

    True except if everyone was capable of playing at the same level as the top few in the alliance every alliance would be fighting for plat and master rewards 😂.

    Personally, I don’t death shame. I’m also a don’t die’r in the tier 4-1 wars. Except for a couple situations. But if I don’t see those situations all season I can easily go without a death the entire time. But that being said I also don’t sit around the chat calling people out for their deaths. It’s needless stress, but the higher the season tier the alliance is the higher the accountability needs to be because 1 death can swing to the win or a loss. But if that’s the case there is better ways to handle it then to shame someone.

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    DshuDshu Posts: 1,503 ★★★★
    The rewards for aw are mediocre at best unless you are platinum or better. While I understand not wanting someone holding back progress in an alliance this is still a game and enjoying the people you game with should be more important than the measly rewards offered for aw. If alliances are going to be cutthroat about deaths in aw they really need to make that clear when recruiting. There are plenty of alliances out there that are just enjoying mcoc for what it is. The cutthroat nature of aw has seen an end to a lot of great alliances and it is sad to see guys are more interested in the pathetic rewards from this mode of the game than the people they are gaming with. I used to run platinum tier aw without minimal items and very seldom a death but it took the enjoyment out of the game to see good people who were fun to game with kicked due to skill level or roster availability. Kabam has increased the difficulty of aw to the point where if you want the top rewards you need an alliance willing to spend to win which is just laughable. Spending should be optional in this game. My personal reasons for dropping out of the aw race is that I'd rather game with people I like than someone who spends to be top tier. It is a game after all
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    SMNYSMNY Posts: 69
    Jaded wrote: »
    But that being said I also don’t sit around the chat calling people out for their deaths. It’s needless stress, but the higher the season tier the alliance is the higher the accountability needs to be because 1 death can swing to the win or a loss. But if that’s the case there is better ways to handle it then to shame someone.

    What do you consider higher season tiers?

    What does “accountability” mean?

    What are the “better ways to handle it”?
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    JadedJaded Posts: 5,476 ★★★★★
    SMNY wrote: »
    Jaded wrote: »
    But that being said I also don’t sit around the chat calling people out for their deaths. It’s needless stress, but the higher the season tier the alliance is the higher the accountability needs to be because 1 death can swing to the win or a loss. But if that’s the case there is better ways to handle it then to shame someone.

    What do you consider higher season tiers?

    What does “accountability” mean?

    What are the “better ways to handle it”?

    Do you seriously just go around asking questions without reading?

    I said what higher tiers are, if you don’t know what accountability means look it up. there are always better ways to handle situations then to bully someone.
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    A l p h aA l p h a Posts: 540 ★★★
    In war we stopped reminding everyone the cost of dying in war... they know the stakes... deaths happen! Everyone makes mistakes... but if its the same people making them then they are called up on it...

    The main thing is the get the path complete... the responsibility is to make sure its done... 0 or 10 deaths its down to you... but if you die you got to persevere to get the path finished so the exploration is done.. then its down to who had the better skill...

    Shaming for one or two deaths is wrong... nobodys perfect
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    DshuDshu Posts: 1,503 ★★★★
    It will also be interesting to see what happens to those top alliances when act 6 and map 7 aq drop. Will they be able to hold their aw standings while completing in the new content
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    SMNYSMNY Posts: 69
    Jaded wrote: »
    SMNY wrote: »
    Jaded wrote: »
    But that being said I also don’t sit around the chat calling people out for their deaths. It’s needless stress, but the higher the season tier the alliance is the higher the accountability needs to be because 1 death can swing to the win or a loss. But if that’s the case there is better ways to handle it then to shame someone.

    What do you consider higher season tiers?

    What does “accountability” mean?

    What are the “better ways to handle it”?

    Do you seriously just go around asking questions without reading?

    I said what higher tiers are, if you don’t know what accountability means look it up. there are always better ways to handle situations then to bully someone.

    So you said Tiers 1 - 4... but are you talking Platinum or Gold 1 or Gold 2 or Silver? Tier 1 - 4 of any level? It’s unclear and I’m just hoping to understand your perspective.

    I know what the word accountability means, but not sure where I can look up exactly what you mean in the context of this game? I’m asking what you mean by that?

    And I’m still curious about the better ways to handle it - I think that would be insightful.

    I’m not trying to be argumentative; I’m only trying to better understand your perspective.
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    JadedJaded Posts: 5,476 ★★★★★
    SMNY wrote: »
    Jaded wrote: »
    SMNY wrote: »
    Jaded wrote: »
    But that being said I also don’t sit around the chat calling people out for their deaths. It’s needless stress, but the higher the season tier the alliance is the higher the accountability needs to be because 1 death can swing to the win or a loss. But if that’s the case there is better ways to handle it then to shame someone.

    What do you consider higher season tiers?

    What does “accountability” mean?

    What are the “better ways to handle it”?

    Do you seriously just go around asking questions without reading?

    I said what higher tiers are, if you don’t know what accountability means look it up. there are always better ways to handle situations then to bully someone.

    So you said Tiers 1 - 4... but are you talking Platinum or Gold 1 or Gold 2 or Silver? Tier 1 - 4 of any level? It’s unclear and I’m just hoping to understand your perspective.

    I know what the word accountability means, but not sure where I can look up exactly what you mean in the context of this game? I’m asking what you mean by that?

    And I’m still curious about the better ways to handle it - I think that would be insightful.

    I’m not trying to be argumentative; I’m only trying to better understand your perspective.

    Tier 1-4 war rating ranks (there’s 21 tiers). Accountability in war on your deaths, meaning using boosts, health pots etc...that you need to clear your lane as successful as possible.

    Better ways to handle individual deaths in a war or entirely over a season;
    1)Just boot the person. Can be done in a respectful manner
    2)coach the person on the champs or nodes they have difficulty with.
    3)have everyone take videos of their fights to address issues (death or not)
    4)proper management of members and the lanes they take pending the champs they have available. (Ie don’t send someone on all or nothing nodes if they don’t have a decent power control champs)

    As an officer in basically every alliance I’ve been in I take near full responsibility if someone struggles on a path. If I do nothing to correct the issue using the aforementioned ideas then I’m just as much at fault for the deaths in the battle group as the person who is dying.
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    Jh_DezJh_Dez Posts: 1,306 ★★★
    Speaking from mmorpg views, ypu haven't seen shamers at all. This is just a small bit
    Although different games and platforms people out there are just plain rude and take pleasure in berating others
    Just have fun and ignore anyone who seeks to ruin your fun in the game
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    BeginthEndBeginthEnd Posts: 334
    It’s all about perspective and who you choose to listen too. There are many people that have “finally” figured this game out SO well that they just have to scream it in your ear so there’s no room for misunderstanding. That.. um Said. Just stuff some cotton balls in there and when they start screaming about “don’t die” just say “live long and prosper” or if they tell you to all the lil “minutes” everyone figured out last year.. just remind em this is a game, don’t gonhaving a real heart attack or screaming at electronics for fun. It is going to be a new day tomorrow and a new year after that!!!


    Happy NEWBUEARS! WhatTt 2019 comming tonMCOC SOON
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    MidevylMidevyl Posts: 215
    Honestly who wants to put up with that toxic environment? It's your game to play the way you want to. There are a ton of alliances constantly looking for people to join them, in just about every tier of the game. Leave, find a home that fits you. But if you stay and continue to take the shaming , you really have noone to blame but yourself.
    In my alliance we ask everyone to do their best. Of course there is frustration when someone doesn't take out a node that they clearly should, but under no circumstances is anyone allowed to shame another.
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    Liss_Bliss_Liss_Bliss_ Posts: 1,779 ★★★★★
    @SMNY

    We are part of the same alliance, and while yes, our leaders do post messages about not dying, it’s because there is a reason. I have seen first hand people go into fights with less than half health. I once say a guy just use a revive and give up 2 more kills.

    It’s not about the deaths, it’s about the not listening and fighting smart. People are constantly doing this, hence the reminders about HEAL UP BEFORE A FIGHT PLAY SMART AND USE BOOSTS.

    I am the quintessential FTP player and I have a full stash of boosts, and comfortably sit at a bit half potions every war. I use a lot of potions. A few time unnecessarily with hindsight. One war I over healed for a mini and ended up killing an Spider-Man with only taking about 10%. Basically wasting a few potions. But hell I’d rather waste a potion or 2 than die.

    When people constantly die to a throwaway node and even a throwaway champion IE: BB on a basic node because of “reasons” it starts to wear. Couple in with people not listening in general....sometimes caps helps.

    And I don’t think it’s death shaming to ask why someone died. Usually when alliances post messages like that and people take them personally it’s because that message rings tre to them. People usually wait till it’s too late to speak up and then then act like it’s everyone else’s fault. But if you are dying a lot especially in S1 of a war map, and you don’t speak up, that’s on you. If your not asking for help or even a lane swap and dying to the same node over and over again, then maybe you should.

    I’m not sure if you’re talking about our alliance, you’re current one, but from some of the things you have said, it sounds like it. Why not reach out to an officer? Maybe those CAPS MESSAGES aren’t directed to you. But if you feel like that are there may be a grain of truth to what they are saying.

    And on the AW boss point, if you saw her revived and healed, and you had full health, why didn’t you go in? The boss becomes available for others before said player has time to exit and rejoin. Why knowingly risk giving a kill and lose attack bonus when so many of our wars lately have hinged on deaths.

    On the note of speaking up, I was swapped from one lane to assist someone who was having s hard time on a lane. It became apparent that I was struggling also. So I was moved. I went from dying at least 3-6 times depending on the node/champ combo to dying 0-2. and never to to same node more than once. With the exception of last war when our backup went the wrong way and I gave up 6 deaths to a 6* Yondu who I am now just getting the hang of. That one mistake of someone not paying attention and pressing the wrong tile, cost me 15 potions.

    I had an issue with a member of the leadership team and after discussing it with higher people, our alliance is a family alliance and have people out of alliances you can reach out to, my relationship with that person has gotten better. I thought I was being personally attacked but after discussing the issue that day, his frustrations with the lack of movement would have been avoided had I spent a few seconds telling him what was going on.

    Remember it’s not the deaths they are mad about, it’s the fighting near death and wondering why people didn’t heal before and then blame lag, unresponsive controls, connectivity issues for the death. Rather than blame themselves people tend to play victim. I have always owned up to my mistakes and only once used unresponsive controls as an excuse and had video proof of this.

    In closing I really hope you aren’t talking about the alliance you and I are both in because despite the frustrating ALL CAPS messages the leaders are really cool people. They have their own issues outside of the game just like we do, and when we make game life harder yeah they tend to get upset. But think about it, if you were constantly reminding people about using potions and boosts and then you see the same people not doing it, wouldn’t you get irritated?
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