Time to Take a Little Class Trip!

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Comments

  • crogscrogs Posts: 287 ★★

    Its not possible to get enough markers to 100% epic, is it?

    I'm not the most active player. I finished epic and master and have 7500 shields left (keep in mind you get them for completion and exploration too) . All I've done this month is content that led to earning them via the objectives. I did get lucky (or unlucky on that actual pull) pulling a spider 5*, but I now have two 5* crystals to open. And to say I'm not that active, I haven't even earned a 2nd t5b yet. Still 42k or so away from my 2nd. Sigh.

    As far as arena, I got doc ock twice to help earn the arena objectives. First time I've gone for a basic since magneto's first run at basic ages ago. Much easier to hit 1.7 now.
  • crogscrogs Posts: 287 ★★
    edited July 2019

    My in game name is sophia2901. I am at level 45 but still I am unable to view level 4 or 5 permission slip. I can only see upto level 3.

    My nephew is having a similar issue. I wish you could follow a post because I'd like to see the answer you receive.

    It may be dependent on the level of the story quest you're currently in. I've become uncollected and have access to all permission slips. Meanwhile, my nephew working on completing Act 4 can only see up to Heroic (level 3) similar to what you have shown.
    Guessing you didn't read the first post of this thread. What level you're at is pretty much meaningless. It's what title you're up to via story questing. Apparently that's all they care about when determining what you're allowed to unlock or special gifts and rewards you deserve. I think it's BS, but it is what it is. Also rather dumb they don't spell out below in the actual quest info. Why you should have to go to the forums for basic entry info makes zero sense. But when does this company ever make sense?

    Level 3 Permission Slip (Heroic Difficulty) - 500 S.H.I.E.L.D. Markers (Available for Proven and beyond)
    Level 4 Permission Slip (Master Difficulty) - 750 S.H.I.E.L.D. Markers (Available for Conqueror and beyond)
    Level 5 Permission Slip (Epic Difficulty) - 1000 S.H.I.E.L.D. Markers (Available for Uncollected and beyond)
  • crogscrogs Posts: 287 ★★
    Triguy said:


    The way the warning is worded it 100% sounds like you would be refunded your entry ticket. Kabam needs to fix this. There is no way of knowing which paths you've already taken unless you just happen to remember so it's necessary to allow for a ticket refund in case I grab the wrong champs for the gate or path you needed. It is definitely not refunding entry tickets.

    You mean the bright red letters that say you'll need another ticket to re-enter wasn't a giveaway?

    Depending on your roster, you shouldn't need more than 3 champs to finish an epic path. So if you are not capable of writing something down, remembering or just throwing both gated champs and thee top champs in, well, shame on you then. Granted it'd be easier if kabam spelled out which path you finished. A little x over the one gate would solve that problem, but it's not like you can't take steps to remember all on your own.

    Heck, just do the center path to completion. Then do one gate. You have enough energy to start the 2nd gate so it should be fresh in your head who you just used since you have to swap them out. Then start the 2nd gate and finish when you have enough energy. Rinse and repeat. I think the one with agent evenom I just brought both gate champs along with synergy with Rulk and x23 and whatever random champ to use.
  • crogscrogs Posts: 287 ★★
    AndiYTDE said:

    I just hope Kabam gets rid of randomized rewards in the near future... For doing 100% in the epic difficulty I could get either a 4* Iron Patriot or a 5* Symbiote Supreme, that´s just a hell of a difference...

    You complete master and epic and get a guaranteed 5*, a full t2a, 1000 6* shards, Epic and Ultimate crystal plus 5000 shield markers. Not to mention the t4b and t4c shards/shard crystals and full t4c crystal. I'd like to see a little more 6* shards and t5b for epic. But in general I thought it was fairly helpful.

    Doing master and unc EQ as well made it a nice month for 5* crystals and rank up help. And for me it was the first time I've explored uncollected.
  • HidanHidan Posts: 3
    about this event, I think the rewards of the master and epic could be better
  • djr17djr17 Posts: 528 ★★
    I think part of the reason it isn't just a 5* spider crystal is that would be a guaranteed pull for the objective.

    I don't think it's a very good reason, but I'd bet it went into the discussion of rewards.
  • BrandoBrando Posts: 1
    edited July 2019

    I have a problem, I mistakenly bought 3 super mission tickets in epic, but I already passed it, now I can't sell or use them, what can I do?
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 9,278 Guardian
    AndiYTDE said:

    What´s the problem with giving out fixed rewards for everyone?

    Honestly, it is because games that do that have lower engagement. It is really that simple. People keep voting with their words to have less random rewards, and they vote with their time and their money to have more random rewards. Convince everyone to spend more time and more money on games with fewer random rewards, and you'll change this. No amount of asking will do anything.

    Asking why games insist on making random rewards is like asking why fast food restaurants keep making food no one wants to eat. Nobody cares what anyone asks them to cook. They only care what people actually want to pay for. People asked McDonalds to make healthier food. When they did, sales dropped dramatically. Their conclusion was to stop listening to the people asking for healthier food, because they were only asking, not buying. The only healthy options that still exist are the ones people actually ended up paying for.

    McDonalds makes the food they make not in spite of what people want, but because that is what people want, and everyone who says differently is just wrong. The people saying no one likes random rewards or wants them reduced or eliminated are just wrong. They can get a lot of people to agree with them, but can't seem to get anyone to spend time or money on anything else.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 9,278 Guardian
    AndiYTDE said:

    DNA3000 said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    What´s the problem with giving out fixed rewards for everyone?

    Honestly, it is because games that do that have lower engagement. It is really that simple. People keep voting with their words to have less random rewards, and they vote with their time and their money to have more random rewards. Convince everyone to spend more time and more money on games with fewer random rewards, and you'll change this. No amount of asking will do anything.

    Asking why games insist on making random rewards is like asking why fast food restaurants keep making food no one wants to eat. Nobody cares what anyone asks them to cook. They only care what people actually want to pay for. People asked McDonalds to make healthier food. When they did, sales dropped dramatically. Their conclusion was to stop listening to the people asking for healthier food, because they were only asking, not buying. The only healthy options that still exist are the ones people actually ended up paying for.

    McDonalds makes the food they make not in spite of what people want, but because that is what people want, and everyone who says differently is just wrong. The people saying no one likes random rewards or wants them reduced or eliminated are just wrong. They can get a lot of people to agree with them, but can't seem to get anyone to spend time or money on anything else.
    Your example doesn´t work, like at all. Who would quit the game if the rewards for a side quest were not that random anymore? Not a single type of person comes to my mind. Plus, what you´re saying doesn´t make any sense at all. Just ask yourself one question: If they had put in a 5* Spider-Verse crystal (which would have been possible considering that a similar 5* crystal was a reward for a far easier quest with a similar structure almost a year ago), who would have said "But I want an 80% chance at a 4* hero!"? If you think anybody would have said that, you´re lying to yourself and you know that.
    Nobody would have been hurt if the rewards was not a legendary crystal, but a 5* crystal. It would have hurt neither the players, the game nor Kabam. There is literally not a single logical reason for that decision.
    No one likes to lose. But not many people play games that have no chance to win either. If every reward is identical, there's no chance to lose, but there's also no chance to win. And it doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense to you, because this isn't about theory, this is about history. Random rewards are proven to work, not theorized to work. The games industry is full of game designers that disagree with you because all the game designers that think like you went out of business.

    There's a lot of room for nuance, for people willing to discuss nuance. How exactly we should implement and integrate random rewards into games is an ongoing discussion in the industry. But once you argue for removing random rewards on principle, because you believe people don't want random rewards in general, you're basing your arguments on a principle already proven wrong too many times for anyone to be willing to waste time making a game just to prove them wrong again.

    You're arguing that relativity is wrong because you don't understand it, and no one you knows understands it either. What you don't seem to understand is that I'm not advocating for random rewards because I think they are "logical" I'm simply stating the completely uncontroversial fact that they work in games like this because players gravitate to the games that have them, and away from the games that lack them. Why is a question for psychologists. That it happens is an observable fact.
  • GrandiddyChrisGrandiddyChris Posts: 2
    edited July 2019
    In the event, it says “all items will be refunded” when you back out of the class trip. So why didn’t i get my ticket back? I have one path left in epic and I don’t have a chance to get any more markers!!
  • FingfangfoomfanesFingfangfoomfanes Posts: 1,102 ★★★
    Sorry if i havent searched or read yet, but what happens to left over markers? I have 6k and cant find any desirable items to buy at the souvenir store. Any 5 star AG to be issued later? TIA
  • MagrailothosMagrailothos Posts: 2,306 ★★★★
    edited July 2019
    AndiYTDE said:

    DNA3000 said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    DNA3000 said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    What´s the problem with giving out fixed rewards for everyone?

    Honestly, it is because games that do that have lower engagement. It is really that simple. People keep voting with their words to have less random rewards, and they vote with their time and their money to have more random rewards. Convince everyone to spend more time and more money on games with fewer random rewards, and you'll change this. No amount of asking will do anything.

    Asking why games insist on making random rewards is like asking why fast food restaurants keep making food no one wants to eat. Nobody cares what anyone asks them to cook. They only care what people actually want to pay for. People asked McDonalds to make healthier food. When they did, sales dropped dramatically. Their conclusion was to stop listening to the people asking for healthier food, because they were only asking, not buying. The only healthy options that still exist are the ones people actually ended up paying for.

    McDonalds makes the food they make not in spite of what people want, but because that is what people want, and everyone who says differently is just wrong. The people saying no one likes random rewards or wants them reduced or eliminated are just wrong. They can get a lot of people to agree with them, but can't seem to get anyone to spend time or money on anything else.
    Your example doesn´t work, like at all. Who would quit the game if the rewards for a side quest were not that random anymore? Not a single type of person comes to my mind. Plus, what you´re saying doesn´t make any sense at all. Just ask yourself one question: If they had put in a 5* Spider-Verse crystal (which would have been possible considering that a similar 5* crystal was a reward for a far easier quest with a similar structure almost a year ago), who would have said "But I want an 80% chance at a 4* hero!"? If you think anybody would have said that, you´re lying to yourself and you know that.
    Nobody would have been hurt if the rewards was not a legendary crystal, but a 5* crystal. It would have hurt neither the players, the game nor Kabam. There is literally not a single logical reason for that decision.
    No one likes to lose. But not many people play games that have no chance to win either. If every reward is identical, there's no chance to lose, but there's also no chance to win. And it doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense to you, because this isn't about theory, this is about history. Random rewards are proven to work, not theorized to work. The games industry is full of game designers that disagree with you because all the game designers that think like you went out of business.

    There's a lot of room for nuance, for people willing to discuss nuance. How exactly we should implement and integrate random rewards into games is an ongoing discussion in the industry. But once you argue for removing random rewards on principle, because you believe people don't want random rewards in general, you're basing your arguments on a principle already proven wrong too many times for anyone to be willing to waste time making a game just to prove them wrong again.

    You're arguing that relativity is wrong because you don't understand it, and no one you knows understands it either. What you don't seem to understand is that I'm not advocating for random rewards because I think they are "logical" I'm simply stating the completely uncontroversial fact that they work in games like this because players gravitate to the games that have them, and away from the games that lack them. Why is a question for psychologists. That it happens is an observable fact.
    You say that people actually like random rewards, but you have literally no proof of that.
    He never did people liked random rewards. He said they preferentially choose games in which rewards are random
    AndiYTDE said:

    DNA3000 said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    DNA3000 said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    What´s the problem with giving out fixed rewards for everyone?

    Honestly, it is because games that do that have lower engagement. It is really that simple. People keep voting with their words to have less random rewards, and they vote with their time and their money to have more random rewards. Convince everyone to spend more time and more money on games with fewer random rewards, and you'll change this. No amount of asking will do anything.

    Asking why games insist on making random rewards is like asking why fast food restaurants keep making food no one wants to eat. Nobody cares what anyone asks them to cook. They only care what people actually want to pay for. People asked McDonalds to make healthier food. When they did, sales dropped dramatically. Their conclusion was to stop listening to the people asking for healthier food, because they were only asking, not buying. The only healthy options that still exist are the ones people actually ended up paying for.

    McDonalds makes the food they make not in spite of what people want, but because that is what people want, and everyone who says differently is just wrong. The people saying no one likes random rewards or wants them reduced or eliminated are just wrong. They can get a lot of people to agree with them, but can't seem to get anyone to spend time or money on anything else.
    Your example doesn´t work, like at all. Who would quit the game if the rewards for a side quest were not that random anymore? Not a single type of person comes to my mind. Plus, what you´re saying doesn´t make any sense at all. Just ask yourself one question: If they had put in a 5* Spider-Verse crystal (which would have been possible considering that a similar 5* crystal was a reward for a far easier quest with a similar structure almost a year ago), who would have said "But I want an 80% chance at a 4* hero!"? If you think anybody would have said that, you´re lying to yourself and you know that.
    Nobody would have been hurt if the rewards was not a legendary crystal, but a 5* crystal. It would have hurt neither the players, the game nor Kabam. There is literally not a single logical reason for that decision.
    No one likes to lose. But not many people play games that have no chance to win either. If every reward is identical, there's no chance to lose, but there's also no chance to win. And it doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense to you, because this isn't about theory, this is about history. Random rewards are proven to work, not theorized to work. The games industry is full of game designers that disagree with you because all the game designers that think like you went out of business.

    There's a lot of room for nuance, for people willing to discuss nuance. How exactly we should implement and integrate random rewards into games is an ongoing discussion in the industry. But once you argue for removing random rewards on principle, because you believe people don't want random rewards in general, you're basing your arguments on a principle already proven wrong too many times for anyone to be willing to waste time making a game just to prove them wrong again.

    You're arguing that relativity is wrong because you don't understand it, and no one you knows understands it either. What you don't seem to understand is that I'm not advocating for random rewards because I think they are "logical" I'm simply stating the completely uncontroversial fact that they work in games like this because players gravitate to the games that have them, and away from the games that lack them. Why is a question for psychologists. That it happens is an observable fact.

    What I see is people complaining about them, for example about the AW Season crystals for over a year now. I only saw frustration about random rewards..
    the majority of the community vocally expressed their negative feelings towards random rewards.
    I have yet to see anyone complaining about pulling 6* Cull or Corvus.

    People's frustration is not the problem: frustration drives people to try again. That's one of the fundamental drivers behind all gambling behaviour; and that's what keeps the game going - people want to 'win'.

    You want proof? You don't need fancy scientific or psychological theory here: Have you ever been to Vegas or Atlantic City? Those massive shiny casinos don't stay in business by giving money away. They offer the possibility of getting rich; but the vast majority of patrons leave poorer than they arrived. Sure, some will never come back. But as long as you can keep pulling in new customers, you don't need to retain all the old ones; just sustain enough interest to keep the business going.

    Seriously: frustration is part of the business model!
  • Scouse92Scouse92 Posts: 26

    What rarities does the Legendary Homesick Crystal contain? Also is it 80% 4* / 20% 5* drop rates?

    The Legendary Homesick Crystal contains 4 and 5-Star Champions, and has the 80/20 4-Star 5-Star Split.

    Of course, 4-Star Rhino is not included.
    I ended up pulling a 5* carnage and then with the 5* shards I revived ended up pulling a 5* nightcrawler so overall I wasn’t too disappointed
  • crogscrogs Posts: 287 ★★

    In the event, it says “all items will be refunded” when you back out of the class trip. So why didn’t i get my ticket back? I have one path left in epic and I don’t have a chance to get any more markers!!

    Read the bright red lettering next time.
  • JediJones77JediJones77 Posts: 76
    MCOC Team said:


    Have spare S.H.I.E.L.D. Markers? In the last week of the event, we’ll be adding a selection of items for you to spend your spare Markers on! These items are not as good as the rewards that you can earn in the Class Trip quests, so if you can do the Quests, we suggest doing those first!

    So, did they make a mistake in this text saying "the last week of the event?" It seems like the items they list in the first post were added by the second week of the event. Are they going to add more items to the store next week?
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 9,278 Guardian

    People's frustration is not the problem: frustration drives people to try again. That's one of the fundamental drivers behind all gambling behaviour; and that's what keeps the game going - people want to 'win'.

    I don't think it is the frustration itself that drives people, rather it is the anticipation. The reward itself isn't the thrilling part, it is the more of the denouement. It is the not knowing if and when that provides the excitement.

    There's a theory in psychology I happen to be a proponent of called overjustification. Experiments suggest that when you deliver fixed and predictable rewards to an activity people were already predisposed to do, they psychologically "transfer" a desire to do the activity into a desire to earn rewards for the activity. When you remove the rewards, the people either stop doing the activity or do it far less than before you started rewarding it. The conjecture is that the reward displaces enjoyment of an activity, which is another way of saying rewards make people like activities less. This is problematic because of acclimation: when you provide some kind of stimulation to people, they get used to it, and it takes larger and larger levels of stimulus to generate the same reaction.

    Combine overjustification with acclimation and you get a situation where providing rewards that are too fixed and too predictable is an unsustainable situation: you are invisibly causing people to be repelled from an activity unless an unsustainable spiral of increasing rewards is given. Switching to variable randomized rewards causes the opposite effect: the operand conditioning effect where people are psychologically encouraged to pursue the activity in spite of the lack of rewards, provided they happen often enough.

    This makes the whole situation of what is ethical in game design very tricky. People often say that psychological manipulation is intrinsically wrong, but they presume only random rewards are manipulative. Evidence suggests fixed rewards are also equally manipulative, just in different and often counter-productive ways. So unfortunately you can't take the coward's way out and say you'll avoid manipulation, because it isn't random rewards that are manipulative, it is rewards themselves that are manipulative. You have to ask the more difficult question what kinds of manipulation are fair, and which are not.

    Incidentally, something I've been thinking about for a while now is whether the game is often not random enough. Consider T5B rewards in AW. For a lot of people, that's the reward they focus on. It is a random reward, but is it psychologically unpredictable? Doesn't everyone predict 1k? If they do, the reward isn't random in the psychological sense, and it can actually be damaging the enjoyment of those rewards that it is "random" but not "unpredictable" enough. Maybe they are triggering both overjustification and acclimation.

    Aren't a lot of people complaining that they are only participating in seasons for that reward, and it is always not enough for the effort, and it is always 1k (even if it technically isn't)? Doesn't that sound like overjustification and acclimation? That's not proof (and it is a big oversimplification), but it is interesting.
  • LainuaLainua Posts: 718 ★★★
    100% Epic Master Heroic, no intention to clear normal even I can do it.

  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,668 ★★★★★
    edited July 2019
    The game is heavily based on RNG, and believe it or not, this is fair distribution. Everyone opening the same random Reward does so with the same chances. Drop Rates are the same for everyone. In the case of this Event, the majority of Rewards are fixed. One Item was based on RNG, the Crystals. The Shards are also based on RNG because that's how Champs are distributed. That's not only necessary for fairness, but longevity as well. As much as people argue against RNG, this game has been based on it for years, so I don't see that changing. Just to add to that, people think they would prefer to choose what they wanted everytime. Add that to this game, and it would crash and burn very quickly.
  • GerbilGerbil Posts: 40
    Why is it that the level 5 permission slips don't even show up in the souvenir store? I'm lvl 59 but not Uncollected... Is that why?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,668 ★★★★★
    Gerbil said:

    Why is it that the level 5 permission slips don't even show up in the souvenir store? I'm lvl 59 but not Uncollected... Is that why?

    Yes, The Level you have access to has to do with the Titles you've earned.
  • JCristianos09JCristianos09 Posts: 7
    I'm super sad with the worst month rewards so far. 4* Miles Morales where I could gain a 5* and no 4* where I could get one...
  • winterthurwinterthur Posts: 3,602 ★★★★
    Only have sufficient permission slips to run one path in each of the four chapters of Epic difficulty.

    Obtained this. :)

  • MrTicTac19992008MrTicTac19992008 Posts: 463
    I got a 4* Iron Patriot from the crystal.
  • Darkness275Darkness275 Posts: 294 ★★
    edited July 2019
    Is there going to be anything added to the Souvenir shop? I don't want to spend all of my tokens only to have something get released in the last week or two. I've already spent in the shop and kind of regret it, I have this sinking feeling that unannounced things will be added after I have nothing left to spend.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 9,278 Guardian
    Mdawood41 said:

    @Kabam Miike how are we supposed to 100% these paths without the champs for the gates.

    You aren't.
    Mdawood41 said:

    I’ve won a **** ton of homesick crystals and also purchased multiple crystals in order to get a stark spidey yet no luck. I think it’s bs that you can’t explore this quest because of the lack of a champion. Poor form.

    Get used to it. Champion requirements, like it or not, are going to be part of the benefit of having a larger and more developed roster over time. A lot of people think this is somehow wrong or bad design, but it is neither. It is a preference. The game rewards certain twitch skills. The game rewards certain tactics. The game rewards certain resource management skills. The game rewards patience. And it chooses to reward those with larger rosters. Since collecting champions is the fundamental basis of the game as a whole, that shouldn't be surprising.

    As to this quest specifically, in about a week I think Kabam is supposed to be rolling out some defeat objectives that you can grind out to get specific champs. A lot of people say that grinding a lot of effort for a guarantee at something is better than relying on random chance. If they also complain they don't want to grind for that specific champ to unlock the gates because grinding isn't "fun" then they simply want what they can't have.
  • D4H0D4H0 Posts: 12
    Hi everyone, just a quick question, upon completion, does it count as Event Quest Completion in Solo Events? @Kabam Miike
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