General Game Feedback [Merged Threads]

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  • Haji_SaabHaji_Saab Posts: 5,640 ★★★★★
    Lvernon15 said:

    Haji_Saab said:

    I don't understand the demand to reduce the difficulty of Act 6. It is like asking for a middle difficulty variant.

    Have you tried act 6 100% without having basically every champ? It’s stupidly hard and champ specific and just isn’t fun, and it’ll be quickly forgotten as new content with rewards is added, nobody will go for exploration
    But what are the rewards for? For me, the rewards are means to an end .. and the end is the difficult content that I cannot waltz through. I know some people play the game for rewards which again I do not understand.. what's the point of collecting resources for the sake of collecting resources?!

    If there is no difficulty in the game beyond your current means, what's the point?

    For the 2nd point, I don't have all champs.. heck, I don't even have Blade or Corvus or dusa or OR or Namor or Aegon or NF or Symb Supereme... i can keep listing all my wishlist :D (and I don't know how to Quake) But I do agree with the point that some encounters are too niche.

    In my first post on the thread, I did mention all the issues in the game, including champ balance and alliance game play burnout. But reducing difficulty of Act 6 takes us back to 2 years ago when we were begging for end game content.
  • TheTalentsTheTalents Posts: 1,981 ★★★★★
    I hope Kabam removes the arguments earlier from the thread. We do not need this shut down to prove which one of you all is smarter than the other. You both make valid points. Unavoidable damage isn't fun to play against but we do have enough counters in game that we can overcome those challenges if it isn't double or tripled noded.

    Going back to the topic I wanted to speak about and it has been said but we really need 5 star sig stones to become common place. We seen the change in the game meta as soon as the cavalier difficulty was introduced and I've spoke about this months ago. It holds many of our players back now, even the ones that aren't free to play due to offers being incredibly limited and few now. 6 star sig stones I understand for the most part but 5 star sig stone lockout has to go in order to relieve some of the in game tensions.
  • SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 757 ★★★
    I hope we get an update soon Miike. It’s approaching the two week mark. Now, while I understand the need to not rush to a solution, it would be nice to know what stage of this proposed solution you guys are in in regards to this process. Please and thank you.
  • Hera1d_of_Ga1actusHera1d_of_Ga1actus Posts: 1,933 ★★★★★

    It would be very nice if GW and his friend with the punisher pic stoped commenting and being so immature

    Dude, if you literally spent about 0.00005 seconds reading from the "punisher pic" you can see that he doesn't agree with Grounded Wisdom. I don't care what anyone believes about this game as long as people just speak their opinions, and are open to the possibility of incorrectness, without constantly dragging people down. It really doesn't do anything period. And while players like Grounded may have different views from you on the game; THAT'S OK! THEY ARE A DIFFERENT PERSON! Even if you disagree with someones points, don't constantly bring it up, it just creates a more negative view of the thread. Which could discourage new forum members to discuss their thoughts as they may believe they will instantly be shot down by people. The only people that most likely 100% know the game and its development process are the devs themselves. People here on the forums have been and always try to come up with ideas for the game that fit their own "development process" and will usually not be 100% accurate. I'm not saying that the community should stop coming up with how Kabam should start working on the game, I'm actually asking Kabam to be even more open with us. People are obviously not happy and don't have anything to look forward to, so they will come up with stuff that may totally be unreal or in the realm of possibility for Kabam to do. What I'm saying is that everyone here on the forums are currently discussing Kabam as if they know it's inner workings, and since we don't usually get much from Kabam we do have to rely on ourselves to come up. Kabam should definitely be more open with us and definitely leave less guessing and theory crafting to the community when I feel that they could somehow easily just tell us.

    Basically, what I'm saying is anyone can interpret the game and what it (needs/has needed) differently because at the end of the day we are all just speculating. This speculation should be undesired and removed from the community as Kabam doesn't need to keep it like this where people really don't "get" Kabam and why they do what they do. It's definitely a confusing thing to talk about (even for me lol) but I hope I properly described what I feel about the situation of people getting gunned about a different opinion they have about the inner workings for the game when all they can do in the first place is guess what exactly that is.

    *Suggestion
    I really feel that Kabam should start hopping on things like the Marvel Realm Podcast and other similar things. Dork Lessons' Kabam Dev Interviews is one of the BEST things to happen to MCoC when it started in December of last year and I for a fact KNOW that these things would be appreciated by a large majority of the community. There should also be livestreams where Kabam does Incursions with people in chat and they hop on Discord and they just play the game. Just SOMETHING to bring the community closer to Kabam would be so good for the community and Kabam. A Discord server where they host live crystal openings, chats with people, discuss possible ideas for the game would be insane and I know that it is a lot to ask but at least one of these things would go a long way. [INCOMING PERSONAL OPINION] I personally believe and see the community as a separate thing from Kabam. Kabam is a sort of "entity" that no one really knows, we all sort of have to guess what it is and why it does what it does. Kabam make the game, but at the same time make the community. If Kabam drop Book 2 tomorrow as it is, it will make the community extremely angry with the content they created, meanwhile, every time Kabam hops onto things like Dev Interviews they make the community happy and excited. They NEED to find a healthy balance between the two (making content and the community) to successfully keep this game running as it is today.
  • Hera1d_of_Ga1actusHera1d_of_Ga1actus Posts: 1,933 ★★★★★
    Unio77 said:

    This thread has passed the verge of derailing. Let's hope we can bring it back on the rails

    I mean, I believe that we need to keep the thread continually going especially right now as to not let Kabam just "wait it out" as it strangely seems like that is what they're doing. It's all a very confusing and deep discussion to talk about "General Game Feedback" as this doesn't just include the actual game. It relies on people and them talking about the issues they have, and if people are trying their best to silence others it just makes others less likely to speak about what they feel. While this thread may be derailed by others, people can attempt to bring that discussion to something that relates the game, or just ignore the people you don't want to talk to. There is no need to ask others, just don't respond to them. If they are truly attempting to derail the thread or not making any effort, not addressing them AT ALL will be more effective as they don't have anyone to fight, argue, or disagree with. If many people see disregarding members of the community as an ok thing, it'll constantly happen and encourage others to do the same and pile on for no purpose to just possibly derail the thread. We (the community) need to come to an understanding (I'm talking about this thread specifically right now) that others will have different view points on the game and the best thing we can do is find common beliefs and suggestions that we can all fully ask Kabam to look at and take in. Large amounts of people have already come to agreements over things like 5* class crystals, arena changes, and problems with endgame content but are just buried by all the threads of useless bickering. (I'd also like to say how even though GW and other people may be disagreed with usually, they can still make good suggestions that you could find yourself agreeing with. Please just don't jump on the bandwagon of hating whatever they say *GW brought up the idea of class 5* crystals in this thread.)
  • Bugmat78Bugmat78 Posts: 778 ★★★
    Tarzan041 said:

    Charnutz said:

    Tarzan041 said:

    My point is I have a lot of the same problems Seatin pointed out, I dread when AQ and AW starts. I like my alliance and the people in it, so I play to help them. I dont chase champions or care about crystal's any more. I rarely spend on the game any more, it is disheartening spending only to open a champ that I'll never have a use for. I stopped with story quest after becoming cavalier, I enjoy the monthly quest. My favorite content is any that involves just skill, I hate taking damage from bs nodes. The game is starting to be about chip away and unavoidable damage, in my opinion. My path in AQ is the bleed path I bring in 5 65 champs Electro or Void take half their health, without me getting hit once. AW I hate because we invest all the time and effort in it only to open champs I'll never use.

    You take non bleed immune down a bleed path in AQ and just eat the damage? That's easily avoidable, I honestly don't know why you brought that example up lol
    I bring three bleed immune champs, I know better than to bring a non immune champ. My problem is taking damage from a champ with out getting hit. Can you tell me a bleed immune champ that counters Electro?
    No but using only medium hits with omega red works and he's almost bleed immune.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 12,851 Guardian
    Bugmat78 said:

    Tarzan041 said:

    Charnutz said:

    Tarzan041 said:

    My point is I have a lot of the same problems Seatin pointed out, I dread when AQ and AW starts. I like my alliance and the people in it, so I play to help them. I dont chase champions or care about crystal's any more. I rarely spend on the game any more, it is disheartening spending only to open a champ that I'll never have a use for. I stopped with story quest after becoming cavalier, I enjoy the monthly quest. My favorite content is any that involves just skill, I hate taking damage from bs nodes. The game is starting to be about chip away and unavoidable damage, in my opinion. My path in AQ is the bleed path I bring in 5 65 champs Electro or Void take half their health, without me getting hit once. AW I hate because we invest all the time and effort in it only to open champs I'll never use.

    You take non bleed immune down a bleed path in AQ and just eat the damage? That's easily avoidable, I honestly don't know why you brought that example up lol
    I bring three bleed immune champs, I know better than to bring a non immune champ. My problem is taking damage from a champ with out getting hit. Can you tell me a bleed immune champ that counters Electro?
    No but using only medium hits with omega red works and he's almost bleed immune.
    There are also unconventional counters, like Blade. Blade is not bleed immune nor is he immune to Electro's strike back, but high level Blade works, because he can either heal or speed up the bleed debuff, and he can heal back Electro's strike back damage. Plus, his SP! doesn't make contact with the projectile part, so he can reduce the strike back enough to heal it back.

    On the subject of the larger issue in here, i.e. "unavoidable damage" or similar mechanics being fair or unfair, some players intrinsically think some game mechanics are "fair" and some aren't. And I'll be blunt, I don't agree with most of the people who talk about unfair mechanics. I don't think there is any such thing as an unfair mechanic. Mechanics are just fragments of content. What matters is the whole. Life Transfer has degen, so called "unavoidable damage." Raise your hand if you think Life Transfer is unfair to the players. I didn't think so.

    In fact, I think that while the focus is often on a single hard fight, like say the 6.1.5 Crossbones or the 6.2 Mysterio, most of the time I don't think about mechanics as being unfair, or even fights as being unfair. I think about whether *paths* are fair or unfair. I honestly don't care if the boss is hard but the path to him is easy, so I can throw an entire full strength team at him. If I know the path I'm on in AQ and a team of three can reasonably do it, then the path is fair overall. And that matters way more than whether any one particular fight is "fair."

    To me what matters is the effort to get from the start of the map to the end. I think about the whole. The parts make the whole, but the parts aren't the most important thing.
  • MenkentMenkent Posts: 834 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    There are also unconventional counters, like Blade. Blade is not bleed immune nor is he immune to Electro's strike back...

    Doesn't that node on map5 have heal block? It's been a while and I can't remember.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 12,851 Guardian
    Menkent said:

    DNA3000 said:

    There are also unconventional counters, like Blade. Blade is not bleed immune nor is he immune to Electro's strike back...

    Doesn't that node on map5 have heal block? It's been a while and I can't remember.
    Its possible. The last time I played Map 5 was carpooling with Fred Flintstone. If there is heal block then Blade would be suicide, but other unconventional options would exist. I think IMIW would work as you could use attack chains with most attacks not making contact. The larger point was that for any champion and any node combination, the viable options aren't necessarily the ones that directly counter the nodes and champion abilities directly. Occasionally, that happens, but not always.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 12,851 Guardian

    DNA3000 said:


    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I think Dave was mostly trying to get through as many questions as he could, but when he tried to deep dive into questions like the gold one, Kabam side stepped repeatedly. They refused to really answer it. That showed exactly why there is a big disconnect between us and the developers. Dave brought up crystals and they were basically like, "Yeah, you can do that" before moving on. They didn't want to say that if you wanted to get more gold you should just spend more. It looked like even Dave got slightly annoyed by that.
    This opens a completely different can of worms, but I will just say that the whole point of having a more focused dialog is that when the only thing you're scheduled to do is discuss a single topic, both sides are compelled to do better to clarify their points. But more importantly, a lot of apparently simple issues are actually way more complex than they seem, and the "gold issue" is one of those. There are a lot of different aspects of how gold functions as in-game currency that would take a very long time to lay out and untangle. You're not going to get a satisfactory answer in four minutes.
  • bdawg923bdawg923 Posts: 514 ★★★
    Diem926 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    *Suggestion
    I really feel that Kabam should start hopping on things like the Marvel Realm Podcast and other similar things. Dork Lessons' Kabam Dev Interviews is one of the BEST things to happen to MCoC when it started in December of last year and I for a fact KNOW that these things would be appreciated by a large majority of the community. There should also be livestreams where Kabam does Incursions with people in chat and they hop on Discord and they just play the game. Just SOMETHING to bring the community closer to Kabam would be so good for the community and Kabam.

    I mentioned this on the podcast, but I think what's missing from Kabam communication is dialog: the back and forth of communication separate from statements and answers to questions. Kabam makes statements, and they sometimes pick and choose questions to answer, but in general they don't participate in dialog. And I acknowledge that is difficult in any circumstance when it comes to things like open forums, and even moreso when there's built up pressure from lack of communication in the first place. But as I said in the podcast, while there's fault on both sides there, it is really only Kabam that can change it. They have to find ways to create opportunities for dialog, and they have to commit to doing it no matter where it goes. Because if there's an implicit understanding that if a conversation is not going to go your way you will stop participating, then the other side isn't going to feel like the conversation is a real conversation.

    It has to get worse before it gets better. It is like the player community and the company have to go into therapy. Both sides have to get past the barriers to communication before it can happen productively.

    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I actually have a crazy idea here, but right now it is a little too vague. As soon as it crystallizes I'll post it. But the question I've been thinking about since the podcast is: if I were Kabam, how would I try to engage the playerbase in a dialog where there was an opportunity to do serious back and forth on various issues, without running into the problem of having to promise things I couldn't necessarily deliver. It is a Big Idea, and thus probably not likely to happen. But the more I think about it, the more I think there's something there.
    ^^^^^Exactly^^^^ Kabam's communication is horrid. The community is thrown a bone by Kabam (insert employee name) about how something will change, sometime in the future, and by someone down the road. Being vague is nothing new with Kabam.

    I understand that trying to find the fixes take time, but not letting the community know what issues are being discussed on Kabam's end isn't the answer. There needs to be open dialog between the consumer base and Kabam, not just the select few.

    BTW, great podcast!!
    Podcast link?
  • Indrick781Indrick781 Posts: 407 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I think Dave was mostly trying to get through as many questions as he could, but when he tried to deep dive into questions like the gold one, Kabam side stepped repeatedly. They refused to really answer it. That showed exactly why there is a big disconnect between us and the developers. Dave brought up crystals and they were basically like, "Yeah, you can do that" before moving on. They didn't want to say that if you wanted to get more gold you should just spend more. It looked like even Dave got slightly annoyed by that.
    This opens a completely different can of worms, but I will just say that the whole point of having a more focused dialog is that when the only thing you're scheduled to do is discuss a single topic, both sides are compelled to do better to clarify their points. But more importantly, a lot of apparently simple issues are actually way more complex than they seem, and the "gold issue" is one of those. There are a lot of different aspects of how gold functions as in-game currency that would take a very long time to lay out and untangle. You're not going to get a satisfactory answer in four minutes.
    I agree with you in principal, but unfortunately with the history of poor at best communication, I doubt that Kabam would have answered completely even if the interviewer went in and said "We're going to talk strictly for 20 minutes about the gold issue." I also want to make it clear I'm not faulting the forum moderators here, they can only do so much. I know they are waiting on the producers to give them something to respond with.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 6,250 ★★★★★
    bdawg923 said:

    Diem926 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    *Suggestion
    I really feel that Kabam should start hopping on things like the Marvel Realm Podcast and other similar things. Dork Lessons' Kabam Dev Interviews is one of the BEST things to happen to MCoC when it started in December of last year and I for a fact KNOW that these things would be appreciated by a large majority of the community. There should also be livestreams where Kabam does Incursions with people in chat and they hop on Discord and they just play the game. Just SOMETHING to bring the community closer to Kabam would be so good for the community and Kabam.

    I mentioned this on the podcast, but I think what's missing from Kabam communication is dialog: the back and forth of communication separate from statements and answers to questions. Kabam makes statements, and they sometimes pick and choose questions to answer, but in general they don't participate in dialog. And I acknowledge that is difficult in any circumstance when it comes to things like open forums, and even moreso when there's built up pressure from lack of communication in the first place. But as I said in the podcast, while there's fault on both sides there, it is really only Kabam that can change it. They have to find ways to create opportunities for dialog, and they have to commit to doing it no matter where it goes. Because if there's an implicit understanding that if a conversation is not going to go your way you will stop participating, then the other side isn't going to feel like the conversation is a real conversation.

    It has to get worse before it gets better. It is like the player community and the company have to go into therapy. Both sides have to get past the barriers to communication before it can happen productively.

    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I actually have a crazy idea here, but right now it is a little too vague. As soon as it crystallizes I'll post it. But the question I've been thinking about since the podcast is: if I were Kabam, how would I try to engage the playerbase in a dialog where there was an opportunity to do serious back and forth on various issues, without running into the problem of having to promise things I couldn't necessarily deliver. It is a Big Idea, and thus probably not likely to happen. But the more I think about it, the more I think there's something there.
    ^^^^^Exactly^^^^ Kabam's communication is horrid. The community is thrown a bone by Kabam (insert employee name) about how something will change, sometime in the future, and by someone down the road. Being vague is nothing new with Kabam.

    I understand that trying to find the fixes take time, but not letting the community know what issues are being discussed on Kabam's end isn't the answer. There needs to be open dialog between the consumer base and Kabam, not just the select few.

    BTW, great podcast!!
    Podcast link?
    Rich's that DNA was on?

  • Diem926Diem926 Posts: 6
    bdawg923 said:

    Diem926 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    *Suggestion
    I really feel that Kabam should start hopping on things like the Marvel Realm Podcast and other similar things. Dork Lessons' Kabam Dev Interviews is one of the BEST things to happen to MCoC when it started in December of last year and I for a fact KNOW that these things would be appreciated by a large majority of the community. There should also be livestreams where Kabam does Incursions with people in chat and they hop on Discord and they just play the game. Just SOMETHING to bring the community closer to Kabam would be so good for the community and Kabam.

    I mentioned this on the podcast, but I think what's missing from Kabam communication is dialog: the back and forth of communication separate from statements and answers to questions. Kabam makes statements, and they sometimes pick and choose questions to answer, but in general they don't participate in dialog. And I acknowledge that is difficult in any circumstance when it comes to things like open forums, and even moreso when there's built up pressure from lack of communication in the first place. But as I said in the podcast, while there's fault on both sides there, it is really only Kabam that can change it. They have to find ways to create opportunities for dialog, and they have to commit to doing it no matter where it goes. Because if there's an implicit understanding that if a conversation is not going to go your way you will stop participating, then the other side isn't going to feel like the conversation is a real conversation.

    It has to get worse before it gets better. It is like the player community and the company have to go into therapy. Both sides have to get past the barriers to communication before it can happen productively.

    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I actually have a crazy idea here, but right now it is a little too vague. As soon as it crystallizes I'll post it. But the question I've been thinking about since the podcast is: if I were Kabam, how would I try to engage the playerbase in a dialog where there was an opportunity to do serious back and forth on various issues, without running into the problem of having to promise things I couldn't necessarily deliver. It is a Big Idea, and thus probably not likely to happen. But the more I think about it, the more I think there's something there.
    ^^^^^Exactly^^^^ Kabam's communication is horrid. The community is thrown a bone by Kabam (insert employee name) about how something will change, sometime in the future, and by someone down the road. Being vague is nothing new with Kabam.

    I understand that trying to find the fixes take time, but not letting the community know what issues are being discussed on Kabam's end isn't the answer. There needs to be open dialog between the consumer base and Kabam, not just the select few.

    BTW, great podcast!!
    Podcast link?
  • Tarzan041Tarzan041 Posts: 177 ★★

    Hell you could even use a ramped up marvel movie bc she'll shrug the bleed and be able to blitz electro down while indestructible. You being too stubborn or lazy to use or think of a legitimate counter to a fairly simple problem isn't a design problem

    What part of this do you not get? Electro isn't a big problem, I get passed him every week 5 time a week. My problem is taking damage from any source, with out being touched. I used Electro as an example of things I don't like. I have tried many different champs, I'm not going to spend tons of money to get a champ for one path in AQ. I stopped chasing crystals after act 5, after opening Cyclops and Magneto.
  • bdawg923bdawg923 Posts: 514 ★★★
    Thanks for the podcast links @Diem926 @Worknprogress
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 27,533 ★★★★★

    bdawg923 said:

    Diem926 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    *Suggestion
    I really feel that Kabam should start hopping on things like the Marvel Realm Podcast and other similar things. Dork Lessons' Kabam Dev Interviews is one of the BEST things to happen to MCoC when it started in December of last year and I for a fact KNOW that these things would be appreciated by a large majority of the community. There should also be livestreams where Kabam does Incursions with people in chat and they hop on Discord and they just play the game. Just SOMETHING to bring the community closer to Kabam would be so good for the community and Kabam.

    I mentioned this on the podcast, but I think what's missing from Kabam communication is dialog: the back and forth of communication separate from statements and answers to questions. Kabam makes statements, and they sometimes pick and choose questions to answer, but in general they don't participate in dialog. And I acknowledge that is difficult in any circumstance when it comes to things like open forums, and even moreso when there's built up pressure from lack of communication in the first place. But as I said in the podcast, while there's fault on both sides there, it is really only Kabam that can change it. They have to find ways to create opportunities for dialog, and they have to commit to doing it no matter where it goes. Because if there's an implicit understanding that if a conversation is not going to go your way you will stop participating, then the other side isn't going to feel like the conversation is a real conversation.

    It has to get worse before it gets better. It is like the player community and the company have to go into therapy. Both sides have to get past the barriers to communication before it can happen productively.

    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I actually have a crazy idea here, but right now it is a little too vague. As soon as it crystallizes I'll post it. But the question I've been thinking about since the podcast is: if I were Kabam, how would I try to engage the playerbase in a dialog where there was an opportunity to do serious back and forth on various issues, without running into the problem of having to promise things I couldn't necessarily deliver. It is a Big Idea, and thus probably not likely to happen. But the more I think about it, the more I think there's something there.
    ^^^^^Exactly^^^^ Kabam's communication is horrid. The community is thrown a bone by Kabam (insert employee name) about how something will change, sometime in the future, and by someone down the road. Being vague is nothing new with Kabam.

    I understand that trying to find the fixes take time, but not letting the community know what issues are being discussed on Kabam's end isn't the answer. There needs to be open dialog between the consumer base and Kabam, not just the select few.

    BTW, great podcast!!
    Podcast link?
    Rich's that DNA was on?

    This is great. First off, it's nice to put a voice to the comments. Secondly, I understand his thought process in the breakdown. It's a very logical comparative analysis.
  • KDSuperFlash10KDSuperFlash10 Posts: 5,860 ★★★★★

    I just want to drop my personal feelings about how I feel tomorrow will go down right down and how us forum users should act. I am very worried about how Kabam has been handling this situation and I am not exactly faithful that Kabam will do something that will result in the community being happy. I just wanted to post this as a thanks to Kabam for all the great years of MCoC. This is very just in case but it seems as if Kabam is trapped into a corner and in no way will be able to address all of the problems listed at an “adequate” or “acceptable” rate from the community. I am very worried about a possible explosion on the forums tomorrow that have never been seen by the likes of anyone. I want to ask all forum users to discuss things as people like @DNA3000 do so well, or at least attempt to. Him and people like @BrianGrant both have a passion for the game but also understand the bad situation that the game is in and look to fix the base problems that many other problems in the game stem from. If something goes down in the game/forums tomorrow please do civilly discuss with others and try to speak to Kabam (hopefully they will have someone that the community can actually question instead of ponder what Kabam is possibly thinking right now) and create dialogue and discussion as DNA3000 suggested on the Contest Realm Podcast. If you are unhappy with changes made to the contest tomorrow, digest it for a day or two and make a long post on a thread of your own or another's, describing
    1. How you feel about the possible decision(s).
    2. (Optional) ask others how they feel about the situation and listen to their input (everyone in the game is different which surprisingly leads to different thoughts *mind blown*)
    3. Realistic fixes or changes you would make to Kabam’s decision(s).
    4. Continue to discuss the topic civilly in your own thread

    I am hoping that if everyone uses some sort of similar discussion format it will be easier for Kabam and others to join in instead of the usual “This game sucks, I hate it, die Kabam” threads that are seemingly being made and take time to be closed by Kabam and do nothing to further discussions of improvements. In case the situation goes to “DefCon 1” we especially need to bring the same amount of maturity that Kabam gives to us. Don’t act childish as it only worsens Kabam’s view of the community and we don’t want that.



    *Serious (I guess)*
    If the community wholly believes that Kabam is not working to the standards that we believe and are certain are reasonable then there could be a reason to Boycott the game. I did not want to drop that but I believe a successful gathering of the community to peacefully protest the game could show how much we care. If this hypothetical Boycott would be done WE NEED A SET OF THINGS THAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS AND KEEP IT THE SAME. Seatin had attempted a boycott in 2018 and it was quickly conflicted when people were asking and demanding different things during the boycott creating a sense of division between the community and confusion of what the community needed. I am in no way able to fulfill this second requirement but the community would require some(one/people) to organize this. I am completely honest in saying I don’t want it to come to that point but it seems like we are very close to a major community outcry, and to successfully do that we need to work as a strong community.

    What exactly is being released tomorrow by Kabam?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 27,533 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:


    I enjoyed Dave's interview, but if I have one critique of it, it is that Dave approached it as a Q&A, where he tried to ask as many important questions as he could so he could get as many responses to those questions as he could. Maybe that format was dictated by Kabam itself, or maybe that was Dave trying to serve as many questions from as many players as possible. But I think while this serves the issues, it doesn't serve the greater problem of dialog. If Dave had picked one topic and tried to deep dive it, the back and forth dialog could have served as a template of how to engage the players in more than just statements. I'm not saying there was none of that in Dave's interview, but it was sparse relative to the more Q&A structure.

    I think Dave was mostly trying to get through as many questions as he could, but when he tried to deep dive into questions like the gold one, Kabam side stepped repeatedly. They refused to really answer it. That showed exactly why there is a big disconnect between us and the developers. Dave brought up crystals and they were basically like, "Yeah, you can do that" before moving on. They didn't want to say that if you wanted to get more gold you should just spend more. It looked like even Dave got slightly annoyed by that.
    This opens a completely different can of worms, but I will just say that the whole point of having a more focused dialog is that when the only thing you're scheduled to do is discuss a single topic, both sides are compelled to do better to clarify their points. But more importantly, a lot of apparently simple issues are actually way more complex than they seem, and the "gold issue" is one of those. There are a lot of different aspects of how gold functions as in-game currency that would take a very long time to lay out and untangle. You're not going to get a satisfactory answer in four minutes.
    I agree with you in principal, but unfortunately with the history of poor at best communication, I doubt that Kabam would have answered completely even if the interviewer went in and said "We're going to talk strictly for 20 minutes about the gold issue." I also want to make it clear I'm not faulting the forum moderators here, they can only do so much. I know they are waiting on the producers to give them something to respond with.
    Maybe, but if you want communication to improve, you have to at least try to create the circumstances where it can improve. If you believe the other party can improve, if you're wrong you've lost nothing; if you're right you've gained a lot. But if you believe the other party will never improve, that tends to be a self-fulfilling prophesy.

    Perhaps this is just the way I'm wired, but I've been writing about stuff like this for maybe four years now. I don't usually get any more feedback from Kabam on my posts than anyone else does. I don't have access to the CCP program because frankly I don't have the time to build a platform like the content creators do (which is a highly underappreciated amount of effort, by the way). All I have are messages in a bottle, and generally I have to have faith that they are landing somewhere and getting read (granted, sometimes I have hints). Or maybe faith is the wrong word. I behave as if they are listening, because if they are I want them to hear something useful, and if they aren't then it doesn't matter anyway.

    I can only control one side of the situation, and part of that control is making sure communication doesn't fail because I assumed it would fail and acted accordingly. If it fails, I want to be certain I didn't contribute to that failure. So I have to assume Kabam acts in good faith, not because I would bet they always act in good faith but because that's the only way to ensure I'm not part of the problem.
    I agree with this. Contrary to some of the reactions I've received here, and even been responsible for myself, I know a great deal about communication. The goal of communication is for both sides to be heard, and ideally come to an understanding. From the perspective that knowledge is shared, that can occur. Agreement is ideal, but not necessary. Then it goes into negotiation territory, and for true communication to occur, there has to be as objective a point of view as possible. Meaning neither side is trying to bring the other to see things their way, or trying to get some outcome from the practice. Communication takes a mutual respect between all parties involved in the process. The last thing that would be productive would be to force one side into divulging what they don't want, or disrespecting the other side that way. In terms of interviews, as cliché as it sounds, Oprah is one of the best examples of this process. She's also done it long enough to have the experience to back it up. She's said that her job as an interviewer is to facilitate whatever the other side wants people to know out of it. Not to put them on the spot. She's a facilitator, and she's asked guests many times, what it is they want to get across, before they go on camera. Simply put, you can ask the questions people want to know, but you also have to respect whatever they share because the process of communication itself is more important than getting the answers you want.
  • Hera1d_of_Ga1actusHera1d_of_Ga1actus Posts: 1,933 ★★★★★

    I just want to drop my personal feelings about how I feel tomorrow will go down right down and how us forum users should act. I am very worried about how Kabam has been handling this situation and I am not exactly faithful that Kabam will do something that will result in the community being happy. I just wanted to post this as a thanks to Kabam for all the great years of MCoC. This is very just in case but it seems as if Kabam is trapped into a corner and in no way will be able to address all of the problems listed at an “adequate” or “acceptable” rate from the community. I am very worried about a possible explosion on the forums tomorrow that have never been seen by the likes of anyone. I want to ask all forum users to discuss things as people like @DNA3000 do so well, or at least attempt to. Him and people like @BrianGrant both have a passion for the game but also understand the bad situation that the game is in and look to fix the base problems that many other problems in the game stem from. If something goes down in the game/forums tomorrow please do civilly discuss with others and try to speak to Kabam (hopefully they will have someone that the community can actually question instead of ponder what Kabam is possibly thinking right now) and create dialogue and discussion as DNA3000 suggested on the Contest Realm Podcast. If you are unhappy with changes made to the contest tomorrow, digest it for a day or two and make a long post on a thread of your own or another's, describing
    1. How you feel about the possible decision(s).
    2. (Optional) ask others how they feel about the situation and listen to their input (everyone in the game is different which surprisingly leads to different thoughts *mind blown*)
    3. Realistic fixes or changes you would make to Kabam’s decision(s).
    4. Continue to discuss the topic civilly in your own thread

    I am hoping that if everyone uses some sort of similar discussion format it will be easier for Kabam and others to join in instead of the usual “This game sucks, I hate it, die Kabam” threads that are seemingly being made and take time to be closed by Kabam and do nothing to further discussions of improvements. In case the situation goes to “DefCon 1” we especially need to bring the same amount of maturity that Kabam gives to us. Don’t act childish as it only worsens Kabam’s view of the community and we don’t want that.



    *Serious (I guess)*
    If the community wholly believes that Kabam is not working to the standards that we believe and are certain are reasonable then there could be a reason to Boycott the game. I did not want to drop that but I believe a successful gathering of the community to peacefully protest the game could show how much we care. If this hypothetical Boycott would be done WE NEED A SET OF THINGS THAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS AND KEEP IT THE SAME. Seatin had attempted a boycott in 2018 and it was quickly conflicted when people were asking and demanding different things during the boycott creating a sense of division between the community and confusion of what the community needed. I am in no way able to fulfill this second requirement but the community would require some(one/people) to organize this. I am completely honest in saying I don’t want it to come to that point but it seems like we are very close to a major community outcry, and to successfully do that we need to work as a strong community.

    What exactly is being released tomorrow by Kabam?
    Yesterday I was very certain that something would be released today about changes (possibly major) and that it could cause a possible outcry. I just wanted to post something to maybe set a precedent of how the community should act when, or if, Kabam ever drops the info.
  • KDSuperFlash10KDSuperFlash10 Posts: 5,860 ★★★★★

    I just want to drop my personal feelings about how I feel tomorrow will go down right down and how us forum users should act. I am very worried about how Kabam has been handling this situation and I am not exactly faithful that Kabam will do something that will result in the community being happy. I just wanted to post this as a thanks to Kabam for all the great years of MCoC. This is very just in case but it seems as if Kabam is trapped into a corner and in no way will be able to address all of the problems listed at an “adequate” or “acceptable” rate from the community. I am very worried about a possible explosion on the forums tomorrow that have never been seen by the likes of anyone. I want to ask all forum users to discuss things as people like @DNA3000 do so well, or at least attempt to. Him and people like @BrianGrant both have a passion for the game but also understand the bad situation that the game is in and look to fix the base problems that many other problems in the game stem from. If something goes down in the game/forums tomorrow please do civilly discuss with others and try to speak to Kabam (hopefully they will have someone that the community can actually question instead of ponder what Kabam is possibly thinking right now) and create dialogue and discussion as DNA3000 suggested on the Contest Realm Podcast. If you are unhappy with changes made to the contest tomorrow, digest it for a day or two and make a long post on a thread of your own or another's, describing
    1. How you feel about the possible decision(s).
    2. (Optional) ask others how they feel about the situation and listen to their input (everyone in the game is different which surprisingly leads to different thoughts *mind blown*)
    3. Realistic fixes or changes you would make to Kabam’s decision(s).
    4. Continue to discuss the topic civilly in your own thread

    I am hoping that if everyone uses some sort of similar discussion format it will be easier for Kabam and others to join in instead of the usual “This game sucks, I hate it, die Kabam” threads that are seemingly being made and take time to be closed by Kabam and do nothing to further discussions of improvements. In case the situation goes to “DefCon 1” we especially need to bring the same amount of maturity that Kabam gives to us. Don’t act childish as it only worsens Kabam’s view of the community and we don’t want that.



    *Serious (I guess)*
    If the community wholly believes that Kabam is not working to the standards that we believe and are certain are reasonable then there could be a reason to Boycott the game. I did not want to drop that but I believe a successful gathering of the community to peacefully protest the game could show how much we care. If this hypothetical Boycott would be done WE NEED A SET OF THINGS THAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS AND KEEP IT THE SAME. Seatin had attempted a boycott in 2018 and it was quickly conflicted when people were asking and demanding different things during the boycott creating a sense of division between the community and confusion of what the community needed. I am in no way able to fulfill this second requirement but the community would require some(one/people) to organize this. I am completely honest in saying I don’t want it to come to that point but it seems like we are very close to a major community outcry, and to successfully do that we need to work as a strong community.

    What exactly is being released tomorrow by Kabam?
    Yesterday I was very certain that something would be released today about changes (possibly major) and that it could cause a possible outcry. I just wanted to post something to maybe set a precedent of how the community should act when, or if, Kabam ever drops the info.
    Oh ok
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