People are getting so caught up in getting the "candy" they forgot what a side quest is.
1. The candy store contains all the rewards one would normally get in a monthly side quest
2. The side quest is one path a day/7 per week. You would normally need to do all four difficulties ~24 or so paths a week for the same rewards as the candy store.
3. The RNG awards are among the best in the game. If you're lucky enough to get one then awesome, if not it is what it is. We are a long way from getting six star AGs as normal side quest rewards
4. The alternative is going back to regular side quest, with multiple paths per week with zero chance of top tier rewards.
It's like everyone is so caught up on not getting the AG that they forgot what a normal month is 🤦♂️
1. The rewards for candy store is literally meaningless at this time. Its designed for same old cavalier. 2. Normally need to do? Doing more difficultly means more rewards. Locking in one difficulty just means locking out lf rewards. 3. Just check the feedbacks past rift rewards got. RNG is already in every crystal in the game. Bringing RNG to RNG is pointless. 4. It atleast guarantees same rewards for the effort everyone puts! Effort is meaningless if everything is a lottery.
Honestly can't believe there is anyone who can make worse argument than the ones you made.
You realize the candy store is the exact same as every monthly side quest if you 100% all difficulties right?
People will complain about the RNG of rifts every month, but still do them exactly the same as any other month. Kabam are not listening to the relatively small sample of the vocal minority who hate rifts, they are listening to the data of how many people are doing the rifts. Those of you who are complaining about rifts, put your candy where your mouth is and don’t do them if you hate them so much. That’s the only thing that’ll stop kabam doing them.
If you complain about rifts, log off the forum grumbling and then go and do your rift, what message is that sending to Kabam?
And honestly this is poor logic you got here @BitterSteel . So I don't like the way Kabam chooses to reward people so I should just simply not do it? This isn't the only side quest or just quest in general that I hate but still do it, because there are still rewards that I do want/need.
I don't care if I walked away with 5 6* awakening gems. I'd still talk about how I hate the idea of the rewards people receive being based on RNG. Cause no matter what, there was the real chance i could have walked away with far far less. There will be people that walk away with far far less and it's not fair to them.
So I'll continue to collect my daily candy. Grab the things here and there in the terrible candy store that I can use or need. Continue to bash this side quest, and there's nothing anyone can say that will change my opinion on this.
A small minority complain every time rifts come up, if you think it’s going to change this time then there’s something that can be said for your persistence, if not for your effectiveness.
I’m not saying you have a moral duty not to do it if you don’t like it. I’m saying that 30-50 people on the forum complaining and 100 people “agree reacting” to posts that complain clearly is not changing Kabam’s mind when they have hundreds of thousands of players actually doing the event.
So it’s unfair that one player can come away with a 6* gem and others won’t, but it’s not unfair that one player can come away with a Hercules and one with drax?
It’s just odd how people draw the distinction here to suit their complaints. There is a hell of a lot of non-RNG things in the game, BGs store, Glory store, Loyalty store, awakening gems that you choose who to use them on - it’s Rng for which class, but once I have a science I can use on whoever I want, that aspect isn’t RNG (and generic ones aren’t either). But there is also a hell of a lot of RNG, almost the entire champion acquisition system, classes of items/cats etc etc.
There is also a whole heap of rewards that aren’t RNG in the candy store. Now, if your point was purely about the candy store I’d agree. It’s definitely time to have a TB and Paragon aspect to the store. That is the place that kabam are lagging behind on.
Not to mention, that if all of you guys got your way and rifts and RNG was done away with for side quests, the highest value rewards would go down. Instead of 6* gems, we’d see T5B and 6* shards as the top prizes. Why? Because when things are RNG you can control how many get them. You want 10k 6* shards to go out to the average player, make the top prize 50k with a 20% chance. You don’t want RNG? Ok, now it’s a guaranteed 10k.
You might think “yeah I’d prefer the guaranteed 10k” and yeah, personally I’d agree as I’m not that much of a gambler. But that’s not my point. Now imagine it with 6* gems, you can’t do X% of a 6* gem. So it’s either gonna be an RNG chance at it, or nothing. It’s replaced with something else less valuable.
My overarching point is this - a small minority complaining on the forum is not going to get rid of rifts, because they haven’t managed it the last 5 times, rifts work, I personally think they’re fun and I’m not alone. The forum twists perspective sometimes and makes it seem like 99% of the playerbase hate something, but it’s 99% of the 50 angriest players who hate it so much. Most will shrug and try their chance at a 6* gem, disappointed if they don’t but not furious. They understand that there is RNG in the game and it’s not just limited to crystals.
So just because Kabam isn't listening or caring about what some of the community says, I should just lay back, shut up, and fall in line? Am I understanding this right? I don't care how many times they've done or how many times they will do it. As a player of the game and a member of the community, I am allowed to let them know what my stance is on it. I will continue to fight this every time they introduce it.
Also, you seem incredibly supportive of RNG, even to a fault I'd say. Shoot why should Kabam stop here? Make the rewards RNG for Act 8.2. Maybe you'll get r4 mats? Maybe you'll get a 1-2 gem instead. Or maybe you'll get 2 T5bc. Who knows? Let's just go ahead and add it everywhere huh? EQ, maybe you'll get 6* shards or maybe you'll get 5* ones instead.
You seem quite aggressive about this. I'd probably just remind you that we simply have different opinions about the game that we play, it's really not that deep for you to be this angry. If the way I've said my points has offended you please let me know and I can apologise for any misunderstanding, I definitely didn't intend any offence. But if you're just offended by me having a different opinion, then I'd probably just take a step back and think about why you're so angry about someone having a different point of view. You aren't right just because you feel strongly about something.
No, you shouldn't just shut up, I think all feedback is really important which is why I try not to ever tell people to stop adding to conversations even if I disagree with them. My point is that rifts have been in the game for years and years and they keep coming back, if they were actually unpopular with the game at large enough to impact player retention and monthly usage stats then Kabam would change it, they haven't changed it and in fact consistently bring them back, so they are clearly successful. You don't need to twist my words and claim I'm tell you to not give feedback, it doesn't help the message you're trying to give to kabam. Maybe this is the year that the vocal minority persuade rifts not to come back, but something about the last 5 times being the exact same cycle of rift, a few complain and repeat makes me doubt it.
Also, that's a hell of a strawman you've got there, claiming that because I defend RNG in one place I would like it everywhere. It's a disingenuous way to argue and anyone with an IQ above room temperature can see that I haven't said what you're exaggerating my points to be.
If you'd like to address my points without strawmanning them into me saying you should shut up, or that I want the entire game to be RNG, then I'll be happy to respond, if not, I don't see much point continuing if you won't discuss it genuinely.
I'm just trying to make sure that when this conversation is said and done, that my point was heard and understood. In the end I'm sure we'll still have different opinions, and that's fine. I'm not trying to persuade you to agree with my outlook. Clearly your outlook is different from mine.
Yeah RNG is nearly everywhere else in this game. That is just the way the game is. Whether 6* crystals or catalysts, etc. And obviously those alone leave people with disappointment. Now the rewards themselves are going to be RNG based too? Just to continue feelings of disappointment when people can't get those rewards. That doesn't sit well with me, never has. The only thing that kept me from really getting fired up in the past was that we could aquire keys to at least target rewards we wanted a few times. Didn't like the design but the keys made it feel like it wasn't as big of a deal. Now having rewards waved in my face with little to no chances of aquiring it, whatsoever, really doesn't sit well with me.
Looking at people simply doing it, doesn't feel like a fair way to judge if people enjoy something or not. As I've said, there's been plenty of other things I have disliked in this game, but completed them nonetheless, cause I have a roster I'm continuously trying to expand. Just like everyone else.
And sorry, but the way things were worded, it gave me the impression that you think I shouldn't express my opinion, because Kabam is going to continue to do what they want anyways. I will always throw my opinion in. No matter if you, Kabam, or anyone else likes it or not. I'm not trying to strawman you with anything, I'm simply responding with the impression you have given me throughout your argument.
Rewards already have RNG factored into them. I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well. Plain and simple.
Part of the rewards are RNG. Same way in 8.1 you get some guaranteed rewards and some RNG, you get some RNG rewards from the rifts, and you get some guaranteed from the candy store. And I'll make a point in advance here, yes the store isn't quite up to scratch and needs a TB and Paragon level - but, we are talking about the concept of RNG here, not specifically about this one event, but about the principle of RNG. If the store had a TB/Paragon gate, then you would have better guaranteed rewards, but some RNG still available and that would be ok.
If you want to drag the conversation off and say the store is bad, then I'd agree it's not the best, but if we're giving feedback about the event for future, then it's not a valid point since the assumption is by next year when rifts come back, we will have better overall side event rewards - including TB and Paragon level rewards.
But your point is this: "I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well". In that case, ask to improve the guaranteed rewards from the store, don't ask for RNG to be taken out of it.
My point about the data is that if you look at the forum as your gauge for how things are received, it can easily point in the wrong direction. If you only look at this front page for example there's about 5 threads negative about the side quest. But people complain more than they praise, that's proven. And if people complain more than they praise, then it means the number of complaints may not be representative of how people in general feel about it. My alliance for example, don't really mind rifts, they don't love that there's a chance for nothing, but they are getting on with it.
Take this thread for example, one of my comments has 5 disagrees and 1 agree, wow I must be super wrong! But, that's 6 people, and if the people who are more likely to complain and feel strongly about it are on the forum, then you can't just say well, 5 out of 6 players hate this. I'm not saying categorically whether more hate the event than love it, or how many just tolerate it and play it. But my guess is that a small number of players hate it, come to the forum and post about it and disagree with any comments that don't agree with them, creating the environment that everyone hates rifts, whereas the vast, vast majority of the player base are at best indifferent - and indifferent people don't come to the forum and say how much they love or hate and event, or agree/disagree with comments. Indifferent people get on with the event and hope that they get a 6* gem, if not, ah well, because they're fine when they miss out on a good champion from a crystal too.
I believe people claim to hate RNG because often you're on the wrong side of it, but really as @DNA3000 has pointed out, it has the adrenaline rush that tempts people to do it more. Maybe not many will admit it, but that's what has people hooked into the lottery, opening Cavs etc.
Honestly, it just feels like you're arguing with me for the sake of just arguing. 8.1 rewards are GUARANTEED. What you get when you open them is RNG based. I'm not arguing that fact, and I'm not trying to change it. I want guaranteed rewards. I feel I have made that undeniably clear. You seem to be struggling to process that. Hopefully someone else here can make that more clear because I can't.
I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
People are getting so caught up in getting the "candy" they forgot what a side quest is.
1. The candy store contains all the rewards one would normally get in a monthly side quest
2. The side quest is one path a day/7 per week. You would normally need to do all four difficulties ~24 or so paths a week for the same rewards as the candy store.
3. The RNG awards are among the best in the game. If you're lucky enough to get one then awesome, if not it is what it is. We are a long way from getting six star AGs as normal side quest rewards
4. The alternative is going back to regular side quest, with multiple paths per week with zero chance of top tier rewards.
It's like everyone is so caught up on not getting the AG that they forgot what a normal month is 🤦♂️
1. The rewards for candy store is literally meaningless at this time. Its designed for same old cavalier. 2. Normally need to do? Doing more difficultly means more rewards. Locking in one difficulty just means locking out lf rewards. 3. Just check the feedbacks past rift rewards got. RNG is already in every crystal in the game. Bringing RNG to RNG is pointless. 4. It atleast guarantees same rewards for the effort everyone puts! Effort is meaningless if everything is a lottery.
Honestly can't believe there is anyone who can make worse argument than the ones you made.
You realize the candy store is the exact same as every monthly side quest if you 100% all difficulties right?
People will complain about the RNG of rifts every month, but still do them exactly the same as any other month. Kabam are not listening to the relatively small sample of the vocal minority who hate rifts, they are listening to the data of how many people are doing the rifts. Those of you who are complaining about rifts, put your candy where your mouth is and don’t do them if you hate them so much. That’s the only thing that’ll stop kabam doing them.
If you complain about rifts, log off the forum grumbling and then go and do your rift, what message is that sending to Kabam?
And honestly this is poor logic you got here @BitterSteel . So I don't like the way Kabam chooses to reward people so I should just simply not do it? This isn't the only side quest or just quest in general that I hate but still do it, because there are still rewards that I do want/need.
I don't care if I walked away with 5 6* awakening gems. I'd still talk about how I hate the idea of the rewards people receive being based on RNG. Cause no matter what, there was the real chance i could have walked away with far far less. There will be people that walk away with far far less and it's not fair to them.
So I'll continue to collect my daily candy. Grab the things here and there in the terrible candy store that I can use or need. Continue to bash this side quest, and there's nothing anyone can say that will change my opinion on this.
A small minority complain every time rifts come up, if you think it’s going to change this time then there’s something that can be said for your persistence, if not for your effectiveness.
I’m not saying you have a moral duty not to do it if you don’t like it. I’m saying that 30-50 people on the forum complaining and 100 people “agree reacting” to posts that complain clearly is not changing Kabam’s mind when they have hundreds of thousands of players actually doing the event.
So it’s unfair that one player can come away with a 6* gem and others won’t, but it’s not unfair that one player can come away with a Hercules and one with drax?
It’s just odd how people draw the distinction here to suit their complaints. There is a hell of a lot of non-RNG things in the game, BGs store, Glory store, Loyalty store, awakening gems that you choose who to use them on - it’s Rng for which class, but once I have a science I can use on whoever I want, that aspect isn’t RNG (and generic ones aren’t either). But there is also a hell of a lot of RNG, almost the entire champion acquisition system, classes of items/cats etc etc.
There is also a whole heap of rewards that aren’t RNG in the candy store. Now, if your point was purely about the candy store I’d agree. It’s definitely time to have a TB and Paragon aspect to the store. That is the place that kabam are lagging behind on.
Not to mention, that if all of you guys got your way and rifts and RNG was done away with for side quests, the highest value rewards would go down. Instead of 6* gems, we’d see T5B and 6* shards as the top prizes. Why? Because when things are RNG you can control how many get them. You want 10k 6* shards to go out to the average player, make the top prize 50k with a 20% chance. You don’t want RNG? Ok, now it’s a guaranteed 10k.
You might think “yeah I’d prefer the guaranteed 10k” and yeah, personally I’d agree as I’m not that much of a gambler. But that’s not my point. Now imagine it with 6* gems, you can’t do X% of a 6* gem. So it’s either gonna be an RNG chance at it, or nothing. It’s replaced with something else less valuable.
My overarching point is this - a small minority complaining on the forum is not going to get rid of rifts, because they haven’t managed it the last 5 times, rifts work, I personally think they’re fun and I’m not alone. The forum twists perspective sometimes and makes it seem like 99% of the playerbase hate something, but it’s 99% of the 50 angriest players who hate it so much. Most will shrug and try their chance at a 6* gem, disappointed if they don’t but not furious. They understand that there is RNG in the game and it’s not just limited to crystals.
So just because Kabam isn't listening or caring about what some of the community says, I should just lay back, shut up, and fall in line? Am I understanding this right? I don't care how many times they've done or how many times they will do it. As a player of the game and a member of the community, I am allowed to let them know what my stance is on it. I will continue to fight this every time they introduce it.
Also, you seem incredibly supportive of RNG, even to a fault I'd say. Shoot why should Kabam stop here? Make the rewards RNG for Act 8.2. Maybe you'll get r4 mats? Maybe you'll get a 1-2 gem instead. Or maybe you'll get 2 T5bc. Who knows? Let's just go ahead and add it everywhere huh? EQ, maybe you'll get 6* shards or maybe you'll get 5* ones instead.
You seem quite aggressive about this. I'd probably just remind you that we simply have different opinions about the game that we play, it's really not that deep for you to be this angry. If the way I've said my points has offended you please let me know and I can apologise for any misunderstanding, I definitely didn't intend any offence. But if you're just offended by me having a different opinion, then I'd probably just take a step back and think about why you're so angry about someone having a different point of view. You aren't right just because you feel strongly about something.
No, you shouldn't just shut up, I think all feedback is really important which is why I try not to ever tell people to stop adding to conversations even if I disagree with them. My point is that rifts have been in the game for years and years and they keep coming back, if they were actually unpopular with the game at large enough to impact player retention and monthly usage stats then Kabam would change it, they haven't changed it and in fact consistently bring them back, so they are clearly successful. You don't need to twist my words and claim I'm tell you to not give feedback, it doesn't help the message you're trying to give to kabam. Maybe this is the year that the vocal minority persuade rifts not to come back, but something about the last 5 times being the exact same cycle of rift, a few complain and repeat makes me doubt it.
Also, that's a hell of a strawman you've got there, claiming that because I defend RNG in one place I would like it everywhere. It's a disingenuous way to argue and anyone with an IQ above room temperature can see that I haven't said what you're exaggerating my points to be.
If you'd like to address my points without strawmanning them into me saying you should shut up, or that I want the entire game to be RNG, then I'll be happy to respond, if not, I don't see much point continuing if you won't discuss it genuinely.
I'm just trying to make sure that when this conversation is said and done, that my point was heard and understood. In the end I'm sure we'll still have different opinions, and that's fine. I'm not trying to persuade you to agree with my outlook. Clearly your outlook is different from mine.
Yeah RNG is nearly everywhere else in this game. That is just the way the game is. Whether 6* crystals or catalysts, etc. And obviously those alone leave people with disappointment. Now the rewards themselves are going to be RNG based too? Just to continue feelings of disappointment when people can't get those rewards. That doesn't sit well with me, never has. The only thing that kept me from really getting fired up in the past was that we could aquire keys to at least target rewards we wanted a few times. Didn't like the design but the keys made it feel like it wasn't as big of a deal. Now having rewards waved in my face with little to no chances of aquiring it, whatsoever, really doesn't sit well with me.
Looking at people simply doing it, doesn't feel like a fair way to judge if people enjoy something or not. As I've said, there's been plenty of other things I have disliked in this game, but completed them nonetheless, cause I have a roster I'm continuously trying to expand. Just like everyone else.
And sorry, but the way things were worded, it gave me the impression that you think I shouldn't express my opinion, because Kabam is going to continue to do what they want anyways. I will always throw my opinion in. No matter if you, Kabam, or anyone else likes it or not. I'm not trying to strawman you with anything, I'm simply responding with the impression you have given me throughout your argument.
Rewards already have RNG factored into them. I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well. Plain and simple.
Part of the rewards are RNG. Same way in 8.1 you get some guaranteed rewards and some RNG, you get some RNG rewards from the rifts, and you get some guaranteed from the candy store. And I'll make a point in advance here, yes the store isn't quite up to scratch and needs a TB and Paragon level - but, we are talking about the concept of RNG here, not specifically about this one event, but about the principle of RNG. If the store had a TB/Paragon gate, then you would have better guaranteed rewards, but some RNG still available and that would be ok.
If you want to drag the conversation off and say the store is bad, then I'd agree it's not the best, but if we're giving feedback about the event for future, then it's not a valid point since the assumption is by next year when rifts come back, we will have better overall side event rewards - including TB and Paragon level rewards.
But your point is this: "I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well". In that case, ask to improve the guaranteed rewards from the store, don't ask for RNG to be taken out of it.
My point about the data is that if you look at the forum as your gauge for how things are received, it can easily point in the wrong direction. If you only look at this front page for example there's about 5 threads negative about the side quest. But people complain more than they praise, that's proven. And if people complain more than they praise, then it means the number of complaints may not be representative of how people in general feel about it. My alliance for example, don't really mind rifts, they don't love that there's a chance for nothing, but they are getting on with it.
Take this thread for example, one of my comments has 5 disagrees and 1 agree, wow I must be super wrong! But, that's 6 people, and if the people who are more likely to complain and feel strongly about it are on the forum, then you can't just say well, 5 out of 6 players hate this. I'm not saying categorically whether more hate the event than love it, or how many just tolerate it and play it. But my guess is that a small number of players hate it, come to the forum and post about it and disagree with any comments that don't agree with them, creating the environment that everyone hates rifts, whereas the vast, vast majority of the player base are at best indifferent - and indifferent people don't come to the forum and say how much they love or hate and event, or agree/disagree with comments. Indifferent people get on with the event and hope that they get a 6* gem, if not, ah well, because they're fine when they miss out on a good champion from a crystal too.
I believe people claim to hate RNG because often you're on the wrong side of it, but really as @DNA3000 has pointed out, it has the adrenaline rush that tempts people to do it more. Maybe not many will admit it, but that's what has people hooked into the lottery, opening Cavs etc.
Honestly, it just feels like you're arguing with me for the sake of just arguing. 8.1 rewards are GUARANTEED. What you get when you open them is RNG based. I'm not arguing that fact, and I'm not trying to change it. I want guaranteed rewards. I feel I have made that undeniably clear. You seem to be struggling to process that. Hopefully someone else here can make that more clear because I can't.
I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
Again, you seem very aggressive so I don't see much point trying to put my side across. I'm not arguing for the sake of it, I just don't see the distinction you seem hellbent on between RNG rewards that are RNG before you get them and ones that are RNG after you get them - one player could get a 6* drax and another gets Herc from 8.1, someone gets candy, someone gets a gem from rifts. You're drawing a distinction to suit your argument without actually giving a reason why one is ok and one isn't other than "I don't like it".
I'm not sure why you're quite so angry, but I'll let this one go here. I have my point of view and you have yours; it seems only one of us actually respects the others.
People are getting so caught up in getting the "candy" they forgot what a side quest is.
1. The candy store contains all the rewards one would normally get in a monthly side quest
2. The side quest is one path a day/7 per week. You would normally need to do all four difficulties ~24 or so paths a week for the same rewards as the candy store.
3. The RNG awards are among the best in the game. If you're lucky enough to get one then awesome, if not it is what it is. We are a long way from getting six star AGs as normal side quest rewards
4. The alternative is going back to regular side quest, with multiple paths per week with zero chance of top tier rewards.
It's like everyone is so caught up on not getting the AG that they forgot what a normal month is 🤦♂️
1. The rewards for candy store is literally meaningless at this time. Its designed for same old cavalier. 2. Normally need to do? Doing more difficultly means more rewards. Locking in one difficulty just means locking out lf rewards. 3. Just check the feedbacks past rift rewards got. RNG is already in every crystal in the game. Bringing RNG to RNG is pointless. 4. It atleast guarantees same rewards for the effort everyone puts! Effort is meaningless if everything is a lottery.
Honestly can't believe there is anyone who can make worse argument than the ones you made.
You realize the candy store is the exact same as every monthly side quest if you 100% all difficulties right?
People will complain about the RNG of rifts every month, but still do them exactly the same as any other month. Kabam are not listening to the relatively small sample of the vocal minority who hate rifts, they are listening to the data of how many people are doing the rifts. Those of you who are complaining about rifts, put your candy where your mouth is and don’t do them if you hate them so much. That’s the only thing that’ll stop kabam doing them.
If you complain about rifts, log off the forum grumbling and then go and do your rift, what message is that sending to Kabam?
And honestly this is poor logic you got here @BitterSteel . So I don't like the way Kabam chooses to reward people so I should just simply not do it? This isn't the only side quest or just quest in general that I hate but still do it, because there are still rewards that I do want/need.
I don't care if I walked away with 5 6* awakening gems. I'd still talk about how I hate the idea of the rewards people receive being based on RNG. Cause no matter what, there was the real chance i could have walked away with far far less. There will be people that walk away with far far less and it's not fair to them.
So I'll continue to collect my daily candy. Grab the things here and there in the terrible candy store that I can use or need. Continue to bash this side quest, and there's nothing anyone can say that will change my opinion on this.
A small minority complain every time rifts come up, if you think it’s going to change this time then there’s something that can be said for your persistence, if not for your effectiveness.
I’m not saying you have a moral duty not to do it if you don’t like it. I’m saying that 30-50 people on the forum complaining and 100 people “agree reacting” to posts that complain clearly is not changing Kabam’s mind when they have hundreds of thousands of players actually doing the event.
So it’s unfair that one player can come away with a 6* gem and others won’t, but it’s not unfair that one player can come away with a Hercules and one with drax?
It’s just odd how people draw the distinction here to suit their complaints. There is a hell of a lot of non-RNG things in the game, BGs store, Glory store, Loyalty store, awakening gems that you choose who to use them on - it’s Rng for which class, but once I have a science I can use on whoever I want, that aspect isn’t RNG (and generic ones aren’t either). But there is also a hell of a lot of RNG, almost the entire champion acquisition system, classes of items/cats etc etc.
There is also a whole heap of rewards that aren’t RNG in the candy store. Now, if your point was purely about the candy store I’d agree. It’s definitely time to have a TB and Paragon aspect to the store. That is the place that kabam are lagging behind on.
Not to mention, that if all of you guys got your way and rifts and RNG was done away with for side quests, the highest value rewards would go down. Instead of 6* gems, we’d see T5B and 6* shards as the top prizes. Why? Because when things are RNG you can control how many get them. You want 10k 6* shards to go out to the average player, make the top prize 50k with a 20% chance. You don’t want RNG? Ok, now it’s a guaranteed 10k.
You might think “yeah I’d prefer the guaranteed 10k” and yeah, personally I’d agree as I’m not that much of a gambler. But that’s not my point. Now imagine it with 6* gems, you can’t do X% of a 6* gem. So it’s either gonna be an RNG chance at it, or nothing. It’s replaced with something else less valuable.
My overarching point is this - a small minority complaining on the forum is not going to get rid of rifts, because they haven’t managed it the last 5 times, rifts work, I personally think they’re fun and I’m not alone. The forum twists perspective sometimes and makes it seem like 99% of the playerbase hate something, but it’s 99% of the 50 angriest players who hate it so much. Most will shrug and try their chance at a 6* gem, disappointed if they don’t but not furious. They understand that there is RNG in the game and it’s not just limited to crystals.
So just because Kabam isn't listening or caring about what some of the community says, I should just lay back, shut up, and fall in line? Am I understanding this right? I don't care how many times they've done or how many times they will do it. As a player of the game and a member of the community, I am allowed to let them know what my stance is on it. I will continue to fight this every time they introduce it.
Also, you seem incredibly supportive of RNG, even to a fault I'd say. Shoot why should Kabam stop here? Make the rewards RNG for Act 8.2. Maybe you'll get r4 mats? Maybe you'll get a 1-2 gem instead. Or maybe you'll get 2 T5bc. Who knows? Let's just go ahead and add it everywhere huh? EQ, maybe you'll get 6* shards or maybe you'll get 5* ones instead.
You seem quite aggressive about this. I'd probably just remind you that we simply have different opinions about the game that we play, it's really not that deep for you to be this angry. If the way I've said my points has offended you please let me know and I can apologise for any misunderstanding, I definitely didn't intend any offence. But if you're just offended by me having a different opinion, then I'd probably just take a step back and think about why you're so angry about someone having a different point of view. You aren't right just because you feel strongly about something.
No, you shouldn't just shut up, I think all feedback is really important which is why I try not to ever tell people to stop adding to conversations even if I disagree with them. My point is that rifts have been in the game for years and years and they keep coming back, if they were actually unpopular with the game at large enough to impact player retention and monthly usage stats then Kabam would change it, they haven't changed it and in fact consistently bring them back, so they are clearly successful. You don't need to twist my words and claim I'm tell you to not give feedback, it doesn't help the message you're trying to give to kabam. Maybe this is the year that the vocal minority persuade rifts not to come back, but something about the last 5 times being the exact same cycle of rift, a few complain and repeat makes me doubt it.
Also, that's a hell of a strawman you've got there, claiming that because I defend RNG in one place I would like it everywhere. It's a disingenuous way to argue and anyone with an IQ above room temperature can see that I haven't said what you're exaggerating my points to be.
If you'd like to address my points without strawmanning them into me saying you should shut up, or that I want the entire game to be RNG, then I'll be happy to respond, if not, I don't see much point continuing if you won't discuss it genuinely.
I'm just trying to make sure that when this conversation is said and done, that my point was heard and understood. In the end I'm sure we'll still have different opinions, and that's fine. I'm not trying to persuade you to agree with my outlook. Clearly your outlook is different from mine.
Yeah RNG is nearly everywhere else in this game. That is just the way the game is. Whether 6* crystals or catalysts, etc. And obviously those alone leave people with disappointment. Now the rewards themselves are going to be RNG based too? Just to continue feelings of disappointment when people can't get those rewards. That doesn't sit well with me, never has. The only thing that kept me from really getting fired up in the past was that we could aquire keys to at least target rewards we wanted a few times. Didn't like the design but the keys made it feel like it wasn't as big of a deal. Now having rewards waved in my face with little to no chances of aquiring it, whatsoever, really doesn't sit well with me.
Looking at people simply doing it, doesn't feel like a fair way to judge if people enjoy something or not. As I've said, there's been plenty of other things I have disliked in this game, but completed them nonetheless, cause I have a roster I'm continuously trying to expand. Just like everyone else.
And sorry, but the way things were worded, it gave me the impression that you think I shouldn't express my opinion, because Kabam is going to continue to do what they want anyways. I will always throw my opinion in. No matter if you, Kabam, or anyone else likes it or not. I'm not trying to strawman you with anything, I'm simply responding with the impression you have given me throughout your argument.
Rewards already have RNG factored into them. I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well. Plain and simple.
Part of the rewards are RNG. Same way in 8.1 you get some guaranteed rewards and some RNG, you get some RNG rewards from the rifts, and you get some guaranteed from the candy store. And I'll make a point in advance here, yes the store isn't quite up to scratch and needs a TB and Paragon level - but, we are talking about the concept of RNG here, not specifically about this one event, but about the principle of RNG. If the store had a TB/Paragon gate, then you would have better guaranteed rewards, but some RNG still available and that would be ok.
If you want to drag the conversation off and say the store is bad, then I'd agree it's not the best, but if we're giving feedback about the event for future, then it's not a valid point since the assumption is by next year when rifts come back, we will have better overall side event rewards - including TB and Paragon level rewards.
But your point is this: "I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well". In that case, ask to improve the guaranteed rewards from the store, don't ask for RNG to be taken out of it.
My point about the data is that if you look at the forum as your gauge for how things are received, it can easily point in the wrong direction. If you only look at this front page for example there's about 5 threads negative about the side quest. But people complain more than they praise, that's proven. And if people complain more than they praise, then it means the number of complaints may not be representative of how people in general feel about it. My alliance for example, don't really mind rifts, they don't love that there's a chance for nothing, but they are getting on with it.
Take this thread for example, one of my comments has 5 disagrees and 1 agree, wow I must be super wrong! But, that's 6 people, and if the people who are more likely to complain and feel strongly about it are on the forum, then you can't just say well, 5 out of 6 players hate this. I'm not saying categorically whether more hate the event than love it, or how many just tolerate it and play it. But my guess is that a small number of players hate it, come to the forum and post about it and disagree with any comments that don't agree with them, creating the environment that everyone hates rifts, whereas the vast, vast majority of the player base are at best indifferent - and indifferent people don't come to the forum and say how much they love or hate and event, or agree/disagree with comments. Indifferent people get on with the event and hope that they get a 6* gem, if not, ah well, because they're fine when they miss out on a good champion from a crystal too.
I believe people claim to hate RNG because often you're on the wrong side of it, but really as @DNA3000 has pointed out, it has the adrenaline rush that tempts people to do it more. Maybe not many will admit it, but that's what has people hooked into the lottery, opening Cavs etc.
Honestly, it just feels like you're arguing with me for the sake of just arguing. 8.1 rewards are GUARANTEED. What you get when you open them is RNG based. I'm not arguing that fact, and I'm not trying to change it. I want guaranteed rewards. I feel I have made that undeniably clear. You seem to be struggling to process that. Hopefully someone else here can make that more clear because I can't.
I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
Again, you seem very aggressive so I don't see much point trying to put my side across. I'm not arguing for the sake of it, I just don't see the distinction you seem hellbent on between RNG rewards that are RNG before you get them and ones that are RNG after you get them - one player could get a 6* drax and another gets Herc from 8.1, someone gets candy, someone gets a gem from rifts. You're drawing a distinction to suit your argument without actually giving a reason why one is ok and one isn't other than "I don't like it".
I'm not sure why you're quite so angry, but I'll let this one go here. I have my point of view and you have yours; it seems only one of us actually respects the others.
Because of how unbelievably dense you are. Difference between candy and 6* awakening gem are so far apart, on levels of a good reward. Like comparing a rusty broken down buick to a brand new Ferrari. But the difference between a drax and a herc is simply how good the champs are themselves. Both still a 6* champ. One is just better. But trying to argue that candy and a 6* gem is some sort of similiar comparison is just a garbage way of looking at things.
People are getting so caught up in getting the "candy" they forgot what a side quest is.
1. The candy store contains all the rewards one would normally get in a monthly side quest
2. The side quest is one path a day/7 per week. You would normally need to do all four difficulties ~24 or so paths a week for the same rewards as the candy store.
3. The RNG awards are among the best in the game. If you're lucky enough to get one then awesome, if not it is what it is. We are a long way from getting six star AGs as normal side quest rewards
4. The alternative is going back to regular side quest, with multiple paths per week with zero chance of top tier rewards.
It's like everyone is so caught up on not getting the AG that they forgot what a normal month is 🤦♂️
1. The rewards for candy store is literally meaningless at this time. Its designed for same old cavalier. 2. Normally need to do? Doing more difficultly means more rewards. Locking in one difficulty just means locking out lf rewards. 3. Just check the feedbacks past rift rewards got. RNG is already in every crystal in the game. Bringing RNG to RNG is pointless. 4. It atleast guarantees same rewards for the effort everyone puts! Effort is meaningless if everything is a lottery.
Honestly can't believe there is anyone who can make worse argument than the ones you made.
You realize the candy store is the exact same as every monthly side quest if you 100% all difficulties right?
People will complain about the RNG of rifts every month, but still do them exactly the same as any other month. Kabam are not listening to the relatively small sample of the vocal minority who hate rifts, they are listening to the data of how many people are doing the rifts. Those of you who are complaining about rifts, put your candy where your mouth is and don’t do them if you hate them so much. That’s the only thing that’ll stop kabam doing them.
If you complain about rifts, log off the forum grumbling and then go and do your rift, what message is that sending to Kabam?
And honestly this is poor logic you got here @BitterSteel . So I don't like the way Kabam chooses to reward people so I should just simply not do it? This isn't the only side quest or just quest in general that I hate but still do it, because there are still rewards that I do want/need.
I don't care if I walked away with 5 6* awakening gems. I'd still talk about how I hate the idea of the rewards people receive being based on RNG. Cause no matter what, there was the real chance i could have walked away with far far less. There will be people that walk away with far far less and it's not fair to them.
So I'll continue to collect my daily candy. Grab the things here and there in the terrible candy store that I can use or need. Continue to bash this side quest, and there's nothing anyone can say that will change my opinion on this.
A small minority complain every time rifts come up, if you think it’s going to change this time then there’s something that can be said for your persistence, if not for your effectiveness.
I’m not saying you have a moral duty not to do it if you don’t like it. I’m saying that 30-50 people on the forum complaining and 100 people “agree reacting” to posts that complain clearly is not changing Kabam’s mind when they have hundreds of thousands of players actually doing the event.
So it’s unfair that one player can come away with a 6* gem and others won’t, but it’s not unfair that one player can come away with a Hercules and one with drax?
It’s just odd how people draw the distinction here to suit their complaints. There is a hell of a lot of non-RNG things in the game, BGs store, Glory store, Loyalty store, awakening gems that you choose who to use them on - it’s Rng for which class, but once I have a science I can use on whoever I want, that aspect isn’t RNG (and generic ones aren’t either). But there is also a hell of a lot of RNG, almost the entire champion acquisition system, classes of items/cats etc etc.
There is also a whole heap of rewards that aren’t RNG in the candy store. Now, if your point was purely about the candy store I’d agree. It’s definitely time to have a TB and Paragon aspect to the store. That is the place that kabam are lagging behind on.
Not to mention, that if all of you guys got your way and rifts and RNG was done away with for side quests, the highest value rewards would go down. Instead of 6* gems, we’d see T5B and 6* shards as the top prizes. Why? Because when things are RNG you can control how many get them. You want 10k 6* shards to go out to the average player, make the top prize 50k with a 20% chance. You don’t want RNG? Ok, now it’s a guaranteed 10k.
You might think “yeah I’d prefer the guaranteed 10k” and yeah, personally I’d agree as I’m not that much of a gambler. But that’s not my point. Now imagine it with 6* gems, you can’t do X% of a 6* gem. So it’s either gonna be an RNG chance at it, or nothing. It’s replaced with something else less valuable.
My overarching point is this - a small minority complaining on the forum is not going to get rid of rifts, because they haven’t managed it the last 5 times, rifts work, I personally think they’re fun and I’m not alone. The forum twists perspective sometimes and makes it seem like 99% of the playerbase hate something, but it’s 99% of the 50 angriest players who hate it so much. Most will shrug and try their chance at a 6* gem, disappointed if they don’t but not furious. They understand that there is RNG in the game and it’s not just limited to crystals.
So just because Kabam isn't listening or caring about what some of the community says, I should just lay back, shut up, and fall in line? Am I understanding this right? I don't care how many times they've done or how many times they will do it. As a player of the game and a member of the community, I am allowed to let them know what my stance is on it. I will continue to fight this every time they introduce it.
Also, you seem incredibly supportive of RNG, even to a fault I'd say. Shoot why should Kabam stop here? Make the rewards RNG for Act 8.2. Maybe you'll get r4 mats? Maybe you'll get a 1-2 gem instead. Or maybe you'll get 2 T5bc. Who knows? Let's just go ahead and add it everywhere huh? EQ, maybe you'll get 6* shards or maybe you'll get 5* ones instead.
You seem quite aggressive about this. I'd probably just remind you that we simply have different opinions about the game that we play, it's really not that deep for you to be this angry. If the way I've said my points has offended you please let me know and I can apologise for any misunderstanding, I definitely didn't intend any offence. But if you're just offended by me having a different opinion, then I'd probably just take a step back and think about why you're so angry about someone having a different point of view. You aren't right just because you feel strongly about something.
No, you shouldn't just shut up, I think all feedback is really important which is why I try not to ever tell people to stop adding to conversations even if I disagree with them. My point is that rifts have been in the game for years and years and they keep coming back, if they were actually unpopular with the game at large enough to impact player retention and monthly usage stats then Kabam would change it, they haven't changed it and in fact consistently bring them back, so they are clearly successful. You don't need to twist my words and claim I'm tell you to not give feedback, it doesn't help the message you're trying to give to kabam. Maybe this is the year that the vocal minority persuade rifts not to come back, but something about the last 5 times being the exact same cycle of rift, a few complain and repeat makes me doubt it.
Also, that's a hell of a strawman you've got there, claiming that because I defend RNG in one place I would like it everywhere. It's a disingenuous way to argue and anyone with an IQ above room temperature can see that I haven't said what you're exaggerating my points to be.
If you'd like to address my points without strawmanning them into me saying you should shut up, or that I want the entire game to be RNG, then I'll be happy to respond, if not, I don't see much point continuing if you won't discuss it genuinely.
I'm just trying to make sure that when this conversation is said and done, that my point was heard and understood. In the end I'm sure we'll still have different opinions, and that's fine. I'm not trying to persuade you to agree with my outlook. Clearly your outlook is different from mine.
Yeah RNG is nearly everywhere else in this game. That is just the way the game is. Whether 6* crystals or catalysts, etc. And obviously those alone leave people with disappointment. Now the rewards themselves are going to be RNG based too? Just to continue feelings of disappointment when people can't get those rewards. That doesn't sit well with me, never has. The only thing that kept me from really getting fired up in the past was that we could aquire keys to at least target rewards we wanted a few times. Didn't like the design but the keys made it feel like it wasn't as big of a deal. Now having rewards waved in my face with little to no chances of aquiring it, whatsoever, really doesn't sit well with me.
Looking at people simply doing it, doesn't feel like a fair way to judge if people enjoy something or not. As I've said, there's been plenty of other things I have disliked in this game, but completed them nonetheless, cause I have a roster I'm continuously trying to expand. Just like everyone else.
And sorry, but the way things were worded, it gave me the impression that you think I shouldn't express my opinion, because Kabam is going to continue to do what they want anyways. I will always throw my opinion in. No matter if you, Kabam, or anyone else likes it or not. I'm not trying to strawman you with anything, I'm simply responding with the impression you have given me throughout your argument.
Rewards already have RNG factored into them. I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well. Plain and simple.
Part of the rewards are RNG. Same way in 8.1 you get some guaranteed rewards and some RNG, you get some RNG rewards from the rifts, and you get some guaranteed from the candy store. And I'll make a point in advance here, yes the store isn't quite up to scratch and needs a TB and Paragon level - but, we are talking about the concept of RNG here, not specifically about this one event, but about the principle of RNG. If the store had a TB/Paragon gate, then you would have better guaranteed rewards, but some RNG still available and that would be ok.
If you want to drag the conversation off and say the store is bad, then I'd agree it's not the best, but if we're giving feedback about the event for future, then it's not a valid point since the assumption is by next year when rifts come back, we will have better overall side event rewards - including TB and Paragon level rewards.
But your point is this: "I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well". In that case, ask to improve the guaranteed rewards from the store, don't ask for RNG to be taken out of it.
My point about the data is that if you look at the forum as your gauge for how things are received, it can easily point in the wrong direction. If you only look at this front page for example there's about 5 threads negative about the side quest. But people complain more than they praise, that's proven. And if people complain more than they praise, then it means the number of complaints may not be representative of how people in general feel about it. My alliance for example, don't really mind rifts, they don't love that there's a chance for nothing, but they are getting on with it.
Take this thread for example, one of my comments has 5 disagrees and 1 agree, wow I must be super wrong! But, that's 6 people, and if the people who are more likely to complain and feel strongly about it are on the forum, then you can't just say well, 5 out of 6 players hate this. I'm not saying categorically whether more hate the event than love it, or how many just tolerate it and play it. But my guess is that a small number of players hate it, come to the forum and post about it and disagree with any comments that don't agree with them, creating the environment that everyone hates rifts, whereas the vast, vast majority of the player base are at best indifferent - and indifferent people don't come to the forum and say how much they love or hate and event, or agree/disagree with comments. Indifferent people get on with the event and hope that they get a 6* gem, if not, ah well, because they're fine when they miss out on a good champion from a crystal too.
I believe people claim to hate RNG because often you're on the wrong side of it, but really as @DNA3000 has pointed out, it has the adrenaline rush that tempts people to do it more. Maybe not many will admit it, but that's what has people hooked into the lottery, opening Cavs etc.
Honestly, it just feels like you're arguing with me for the sake of just arguing. 8.1 rewards are GUARANTEED. What you get when you open them is RNG based. I'm not arguing that fact, and I'm not trying to change it. I want guaranteed rewards. I feel I have made that undeniably clear. You seem to be struggling to process that. Hopefully someone else here can make that more clear because I can't.
I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
Again, you seem very aggressive so I don't see much point trying to put my side across. I'm not arguing for the sake of it, I just don't see the distinction you seem hellbent on between RNG rewards that are RNG before you get them and ones that are RNG after you get them - one player could get a 6* drax and another gets Herc from 8.1, someone gets candy, someone gets a gem from rifts. You're drawing a distinction to suit your argument without actually giving a reason why one is ok and one isn't other than "I don't like it".
I'm not sure why you're quite so angry, but I'll let this one go here. I have my point of view and you have yours; it seems only one of us actually respects the others.
Because of how unbelievably dense you are. Difference between candy and 6* awakening gem are so far apart, on levels of a good reward. Like comparing a rusty broken down buick to a brand new Ferrari. But the difference between a drax and a herc is simply how good the champs are themselves. Both still a 6* champ. One is just better. But trying to argue that candy and a 6* gem is some sort of similiar comparison is just a garbage way of looking at things.
Thanks for proving my point, weak distinctions to limp forwards on an argument you won’t win. No point arguing with angry people. If you were less insulting and took a breath I’d probably continue the conversation that i find interesting.
I have no issues with rifts. so far I only got Candy... but its only 6 runs in. Maybe I'll be part of the 30% who won't get something.
Given though that the game is OK with some people having more runs through than others just out of RNG... then I suppose the game should also be OK if some people say... run the gauntlet more than others.
Oh wait... we aren't OK with that? That's odd... as I fail to see why one is OK and the other isn't. Either both should be OK, or both shouldn't.
I have no issues with rifts. so far I only got Candy... but its only 6 runs in. Maybe I'll be part of the 30% who won't get something.
Given though that the game is OK with some people having more runs through than others just out of RNG... then I suppose the game should also be OK if some people say... run the gauntlet more than others.
Oh wait... we aren't OK with that? That's odd... as I fail to see why one is OK and the other isn't. Either both should be OK, or both shouldn't.
98% of people will get something other than candy over the month.
30% of people will get a 6* awakening gem.
On average people will get 3.5 pulls that aren’t candy.
Your point on the gauntlet isn’t really accurate I’m afraid. One is an exploit of a bug, one is a designed RNG side quest.
People are getting so caught up in getting the "candy" they forgot what a side quest is.
1. The candy store contains all the rewards one would normally get in a monthly side quest
2. The side quest is one path a day/7 per week. You would normally need to do all four difficulties ~24 or so paths a week for the same rewards as the candy store.
3. The RNG awards are among the best in the game. If you're lucky enough to get one then awesome, if not it is what it is. We are a long way from getting six star AGs as normal side quest rewards
4. The alternative is going back to regular side quest, with multiple paths per week with zero chance of top tier rewards.
It's like everyone is so caught up on not getting the AG that they forgot what a normal month is 🤦♂️
1. The rewards for candy store is literally meaningless at this time. Its designed for same old cavalier. 2. Normally need to do? Doing more difficultly means more rewards. Locking in one difficulty just means locking out lf rewards. 3. Just check the feedbacks past rift rewards got. RNG is already in every crystal in the game. Bringing RNG to RNG is pointless. 4. It atleast guarantees same rewards for the effort everyone puts! Effort is meaningless if everything is a lottery.
Honestly can't believe there is anyone who can make worse argument than the ones you made.
You realize the candy store is the exact same as every monthly side quest if you 100% all difficulties right?
People will complain about the RNG of rifts every month, but still do them exactly the same as any other month. Kabam are not listening to the relatively small sample of the vocal minority who hate rifts, they are listening to the data of how many people are doing the rifts. Those of you who are complaining about rifts, put your candy where your mouth is and don’t do them if you hate them so much. That’s the only thing that’ll stop kabam doing them.
If you complain about rifts, log off the forum grumbling and then go and do your rift, what message is that sending to Kabam?
And honestly this is poor logic you got here @BitterSteel . So I don't like the way Kabam chooses to reward people so I should just simply not do it? This isn't the only side quest or just quest in general that I hate but still do it, because there are still rewards that I do want/need.
I don't care if I walked away with 5 6* awakening gems. I'd still talk about how I hate the idea of the rewards people receive being based on RNG. Cause no matter what, there was the real chance i could have walked away with far far less. There will be people that walk away with far far less and it's not fair to them.
So I'll continue to collect my daily candy. Grab the things here and there in the terrible candy store that I can use or need. Continue to bash this side quest, and there's nothing anyone can say that will change my opinion on this.
A small minority complain every time rifts come up, if you think it’s going to change this time then there’s something that can be said for your persistence, if not for your effectiveness.
I’m not saying you have a moral duty not to do it if you don’t like it. I’m saying that 30-50 people on the forum complaining and 100 people “agree reacting” to posts that complain clearly is not changing Kabam’s mind when they have hundreds of thousands of players actually doing the event.
So it’s unfair that one player can come away with a 6* gem and others won’t, but it’s not unfair that one player can come away with a Hercules and one with drax?
It’s just odd how people draw the distinction here to suit their complaints. There is a hell of a lot of non-RNG things in the game, BGs store, Glory store, Loyalty store, awakening gems that you choose who to use them on - it’s Rng for which class, but once I have a science I can use on whoever I want, that aspect isn’t RNG (and generic ones aren’t either). But there is also a hell of a lot of RNG, almost the entire champion acquisition system, classes of items/cats etc etc.
There is also a whole heap of rewards that aren’t RNG in the candy store. Now, if your point was purely about the candy store I’d agree. It’s definitely time to have a TB and Paragon aspect to the store. That is the place that kabam are lagging behind on.
Not to mention, that if all of you guys got your way and rifts and RNG was done away with for side quests, the highest value rewards would go down. Instead of 6* gems, we’d see T5B and 6* shards as the top prizes. Why? Because when things are RNG you can control how many get them. You want 10k 6* shards to go out to the average player, make the top prize 50k with a 20% chance. You don’t want RNG? Ok, now it’s a guaranteed 10k.
You might think “yeah I’d prefer the guaranteed 10k” and yeah, personally I’d agree as I’m not that much of a gambler. But that’s not my point. Now imagine it with 6* gems, you can’t do X% of a 6* gem. So it’s either gonna be an RNG chance at it, or nothing. It’s replaced with something else less valuable.
My overarching point is this - a small minority complaining on the forum is not going to get rid of rifts, because they haven’t managed it the last 5 times, rifts work, I personally think they’re fun and I’m not alone. The forum twists perspective sometimes and makes it seem like 99% of the playerbase hate something, but it’s 99% of the 50 angriest players who hate it so much. Most will shrug and try their chance at a 6* gem, disappointed if they don’t but not furious. They understand that there is RNG in the game and it’s not just limited to crystals.
So just because Kabam isn't listening or caring about what some of the community says, I should just lay back, shut up, and fall in line? Am I understanding this right? I don't care how many times they've done or how many times they will do it. As a player of the game and a member of the community, I am allowed to let them know what my stance is on it. I will continue to fight this every time they introduce it.
Also, you seem incredibly supportive of RNG, even to a fault I'd say. Shoot why should Kabam stop here? Make the rewards RNG for Act 8.2. Maybe you'll get r4 mats? Maybe you'll get a 1-2 gem instead. Or maybe you'll get 2 T5bc. Who knows? Let's just go ahead and add it everywhere huh? EQ, maybe you'll get 6* shards or maybe you'll get 5* ones instead.
You seem quite aggressive about this. I'd probably just remind you that we simply have different opinions about the game that we play, it's really not that deep for you to be this angry. If the way I've said my points has offended you please let me know and I can apologise for any misunderstanding, I definitely didn't intend any offence. But if you're just offended by me having a different opinion, then I'd probably just take a step back and think about why you're so angry about someone having a different point of view. You aren't right just because you feel strongly about something.
No, you shouldn't just shut up, I think all feedback is really important which is why I try not to ever tell people to stop adding to conversations even if I disagree with them. My point is that rifts have been in the game for years and years and they keep coming back, if they were actually unpopular with the game at large enough to impact player retention and monthly usage stats then Kabam would change it, they haven't changed it and in fact consistently bring them back, so they are clearly successful. You don't need to twist my words and claim I'm tell you to not give feedback, it doesn't help the message you're trying to give to kabam. Maybe this is the year that the vocal minority persuade rifts not to come back, but something about the last 5 times being the exact same cycle of rift, a few complain and repeat makes me doubt it.
Also, that's a hell of a strawman you've got there, claiming that because I defend RNG in one place I would like it everywhere. It's a disingenuous way to argue and anyone with an IQ above room temperature can see that I haven't said what you're exaggerating my points to be.
If you'd like to address my points without strawmanning them into me saying you should shut up, or that I want the entire game to be RNG, then I'll be happy to respond, if not, I don't see much point continuing if you won't discuss it genuinely.
I'm just trying to make sure that when this conversation is said and done, that my point was heard and understood. In the end I'm sure we'll still have different opinions, and that's fine. I'm not trying to persuade you to agree with my outlook. Clearly your outlook is different from mine.
Yeah RNG is nearly everywhere else in this game. That is just the way the game is. Whether 6* crystals or catalysts, etc. And obviously those alone leave people with disappointment. Now the rewards themselves are going to be RNG based too? Just to continue feelings of disappointment when people can't get those rewards. That doesn't sit well with me, never has. The only thing that kept me from really getting fired up in the past was that we could aquire keys to at least target rewards we wanted a few times. Didn't like the design but the keys made it feel like it wasn't as big of a deal. Now having rewards waved in my face with little to no chances of aquiring it, whatsoever, really doesn't sit well with me.
Looking at people simply doing it, doesn't feel like a fair way to judge if people enjoy something or not. As I've said, there's been plenty of other things I have disliked in this game, but completed them nonetheless, cause I have a roster I'm continuously trying to expand. Just like everyone else.
And sorry, but the way things were worded, it gave me the impression that you think I shouldn't express my opinion, because Kabam is going to continue to do what they want anyways. I will always throw my opinion in. No matter if you, Kabam, or anyone else likes it or not. I'm not trying to strawman you with anything, I'm simply responding with the impression you have given me throughout your argument.
Rewards already have RNG factored into them. I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well. Plain and simple.
Part of the rewards are RNG. Same way in 8.1 you get some guaranteed rewards and some RNG, you get some RNG rewards from the rifts, and you get some guaranteed from the candy store. And I'll make a point in advance here, yes the store isn't quite up to scratch and needs a TB and Paragon level - but, we are talking about the concept of RNG here, not specifically about this one event, but about the principle of RNG. If the store had a TB/Paragon gate, then you would have better guaranteed rewards, but some RNG still available and that would be ok.
If you want to drag the conversation off and say the store is bad, then I'd agree it's not the best, but if we're giving feedback about the event for future, then it's not a valid point since the assumption is by next year when rifts come back, we will have better overall side event rewards - including TB and Paragon level rewards.
But your point is this: "I don't want what rewards I get to be RNG based as well". In that case, ask to improve the guaranteed rewards from the store, don't ask for RNG to be taken out of it.
My point about the data is that if you look at the forum as your gauge for how things are received, it can easily point in the wrong direction. If you only look at this front page for example there's about 5 threads negative about the side quest. But people complain more than they praise, that's proven. And if people complain more than they praise, then it means the number of complaints may not be representative of how people in general feel about it. My alliance for example, don't really mind rifts, they don't love that there's a chance for nothing, but they are getting on with it.
Take this thread for example, one of my comments has 5 disagrees and 1 agree, wow I must be super wrong! But, that's 6 people, and if the people who are more likely to complain and feel strongly about it are on the forum, then you can't just say well, 5 out of 6 players hate this. I'm not saying categorically whether more hate the event than love it, or how many just tolerate it and play it. But my guess is that a small number of players hate it, come to the forum and post about it and disagree with any comments that don't agree with them, creating the environment that everyone hates rifts, whereas the vast, vast majority of the player base are at best indifferent - and indifferent people don't come to the forum and say how much they love or hate and event, or agree/disagree with comments. Indifferent people get on with the event and hope that they get a 6* gem, if not, ah well, because they're fine when they miss out on a good champion from a crystal too.
I believe people claim to hate RNG because often you're on the wrong side of it, but really as @DNA3000 has pointed out, it has the adrenaline rush that tempts people to do it more. Maybe not many will admit it, but that's what has people hooked into the lottery, opening Cavs etc.
Honestly, it just feels like you're arguing with me for the sake of just arguing. 8.1 rewards are GUARANTEED. What you get when you open them is RNG based. I'm not arguing that fact, and I'm not trying to change it. I want guaranteed rewards. I feel I have made that undeniably clear. You seem to be struggling to process that. Hopefully someone else here can make that more clear because I can't.
I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
Again, you seem very aggressive so I don't see much point trying to put my side across. I'm not arguing for the sake of it, I just don't see the distinction you seem hellbent on between RNG rewards that are RNG before you get them and ones that are RNG after you get them - one player could get a 6* drax and another gets Herc from 8.1, someone gets candy, someone gets a gem from rifts. You're drawing a distinction to suit your argument without actually giving a reason why one is ok and one isn't other than "I don't like it".
I'm not sure why you're quite so angry, but I'll let this one go here. I have my point of view and you have yours; it seems only one of us actually respects the others.
Because of how unbelievably dense you are. Difference between candy and 6* awakening gem are so far apart, on levels of a good reward. Like comparing a rusty broken down buick to a brand new Ferrari. But the difference between a drax and a herc is simply how good the champs are themselves. Both still a 6* champ. One is just better. But trying to argue that candy and a 6* gem is some sort of similiar comparison is just a garbage way of looking at things.
Thanks for proving my point, weak distinctions to limp forwards on an argument you won’t win. No point arguing with angry people. If you were less insulting and took a breath I’d probably continue the conversation that i find interesting.
Fair enough. I've made my point several times. Absolutely crystal clear. If you don't want to stop for a moment and actually take in what I'm saying, that's on you.
The only TOP TIER prize is the awakening gem, stop acting like these are some OMG AMAZING rewards.
T5CC is easily obtainable T5 Basic: Glory / Loyalty Store T2 Alpha: 👆🏿 2M Gold: save gold or open crystals Sig. Stone: EOP / Story Quest, etc
Yes, I’m gone complain about this weak 🤬 side quest, and the stupid odds. I’m tired of getting damn CANDY everyday!!!
Awakening gems. Yawn.
Not everyone is overflowing with T5CC or T2A. Those are amazing rewards for some players, and not so amazing rewards for other players. Anything you think is boring other people think is amazing, and equally important just because you think is amazing, doesn't mean it universally is.
I quite like rifts. Only thing I'm not keen on with them is lack of fairness where one player can get more/better loot than another for the same effort but I'm still doing them and will continue to do so.
Sadly not been luckily enough to get anything other than candy thus far but I remain hopeful
I quite like rifts. Only thing I'm not keen on with them is lack of fairness where one player can get more/better loot than another for the same effort but I'm still doing them and will continue to do so.
Sadly not been luckily enough to get anything other than candy thus far but I remain hopeful
My issue with that is that TB and Paragon players can hardly consider the 2 minutes it takes as effort. I like this version of rifts. It's what I'm looking to have in a side quest: little effort, good base rewards with the excitement on landing on something very good. Having said that, players will always complain about RNG. It's always been like that and it will always be.
I’m not sure I’d categories it as complaining, rather giving feedback. The game is customer focused so surely they would want feedback from customers?
At the start of the event I wasn’t overly enamoured with it. But honestly I have 2 generic and 2 skill 6* Awakening Gem. I’ve only gotten candy so far and as much as I’d like ana awakening gem, it’s not the end of the world not to get one. I think there’s a general feeling of unfairness if other people gain super high end resources for no effort whilst others don’t. I get why this would be an issue.
I’ll have gotten 32 Cav Crystals, 11k of 6* shards and T5B from them so it’s not all bad.
I’m not sure I’d categories it as complaining, rather giving feedback. The game is customer focused so surely they would want feedback from customers?
At the start of the event I wasn’t overly enamoured with it. But honestly I have 2 generic and 2 skill 6* Awakening Gem. I’ve only gotten candy so far and as much as I’d like ana awakening gem, it’s not the end of the world not to get one. I think there’s a general feeling of unfairness if other people gain super high end resources for no effort whilst others don’t. I get why this would be an issue.
I’ll have gotten 32 Cav Crystals, 11k of 6* shards and T5B from them so it’s not all bad.
Would that not be an issue with the whole game? RNG is not fair or unfair, it's just random. If two people open a cavalier crystal gifted by Kabam as part as some celebration and one of them gets a 3* (50% chance) and the other gets a 6*, is that unfair?
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I agree with you 100% about the candy store. I agree you can't solely use the forums for peoples opinions as whole, for the community, but you also can't just use data that says people are doing it. I've dont plenty of quests I didn't like. Something i think would be useful is those surveys kabam sends out from time to time. I haven't seen one in awhile. I think those should be sent out some more.
I'm sure the rifts will return somewhere done the road, see you then for another argument!
I'm not sure why you're quite so angry, but I'll let this one go here. I have my point of view and you have yours; it seems only one of us actually respects the others.
Given though that the game is OK with some people having more runs through than others just out of RNG... then I suppose the game should also be OK if some people say... run the gauntlet more than others.
Oh wait... we aren't OK with that? That's odd... as I fail to see why one is OK and the other isn't. Either both should be OK, or both shouldn't.
I'll definitely have some of whatever you are smoking.
30% of people will get a 6* awakening gem.
On average people will get 3.5 pulls that aren’t candy.
Your point on the gauntlet isn’t really accurate I’m afraid. One is an exploit of a bug, one is a designed RNG side quest.
I've also heard
STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE COMPLAINTS IF THEY AREN'T STOPPING YOU TO COMPLAIN!
Great, looking forward for a month full of candies, who cares about gold or 6* ags, or t5cc
And anyways that seems to be a 100% to me
T5CC is easily obtainable
T5 Basic: Glory / Loyalty Store
T2 Alpha: 👆🏿
2M Gold: save gold or open crystals
Sig. Stone: EOP / Story Quest, etc
Yes, I’m gone complain about this weak 🤬 side quest, and the stupid odds. I’m tired of getting damn CANDY everyday!!!
Not everyone is overflowing with T5CC or T2A. Those are amazing rewards for some players, and not so amazing rewards for other players. Anything you think is boring other people think is amazing, and equally important just because you think is amazing, doesn't mean it universally is.
Sadly not been luckily enough to get anything other than candy thus far but I remain hopeful
Having said that, players will always complain about RNG. It's always been like that and it will always be.
At the start of the event I wasn’t overly enamoured with it. But honestly I have 2 generic and 2 skill 6* Awakening Gem. I’ve only gotten candy so far and as much as I’d like ana awakening gem, it’s not the end of the world not to get one. I think there’s a general feeling of unfairness if other people gain super high end resources for no effort whilst others don’t. I get why this would be an issue.
I’ll have gotten 32 Cav Crystals, 11k of 6* shards and T5B from them so it’s not all bad.
If two people open a cavalier crystal gifted by Kabam as part as some celebration and one of them gets a 3* (50% chance) and the other gets a 6*, is that unfair?