You should make that your sig and save everyone some time.
Ability Awakened: Independent Thought Process
Three errors in five words is probably a record.
It was suggested that disagreeing should be my Sig to save people trouble. I don't disagree for the sake of disagreeing, or to be contrary. However, if I have a different view, I am not swayed by a majority. I look at things from a perspective that is not dependent on popular vote or opinion. Thus, I made a joke out of a joke. Pretty sure there is not much error in that.
You should make that your sig and save everyone some time.
Ability Awakened: Independent Thought Process
Three errors in five words is probably a record.
It was suggested that disagreeing should be my Sig to save people trouble. I don't disagree for the sake of disagreeing, or to be contrary. However, if I have a different view, I am not swayed by a majority. I look at things from a perspective that is not dependent on popular vote or opinion. Thus, I made a joke out of a joke. Pretty sure there is not much error in that.
No, you look at things from an exclusively pro-Kabam perspective.
'Independent thought'? Don't make us all LOL
Node 24 a little too hard in tier 1 expert, especially for being one of the first nodes. It’s harder than the mini bosses or even the boss. Green goblin and classic ultron are some examples who are nearly impossible to beat. Especially dexterity triggering regen.
Node 24 a little too hard in tier 1 expert, especially for being one of the first nodes. It’s harder than the mini bosses or even the boss. Green goblin and classic ultron are some examples who are nearly impossible to beat. Especially dexterity triggering regen.
Just don’t trigger dexterity and also take a champ that doesn’t gain buffs.
We have defender kills. Defenders are killing things quite efficiently in 16.0.
I think it is worth reminding everyone that there were people who liked 15.0 AW. It was totally non-competitive, but there were people who liked the fact that AW was easier, cheaper, and less stressful. It was a mockery of competition, but not everyone likes strong competition. For such people, removing defender kill points and reducing the strength of the node buffs destroyed competition, but did make AW something easier to participate in. We even saw many such people post in the original thread that they liked the easier war.
Don't see those guys any more. Because no one who liked 15.0 could have liked 15.1 or 16.0. War is still less focused on attacker competition than 14.0, but it is now much harder than 15.0 and even harder than 14.0. I would argue that with defenders like Ultron being placed again, its potentially harder in some ways than 11.0 when scaled healing was in effect. If you want strong attacker-focused competition, 16.0 is still inferior to 14.0. But if you don't want strong competition and preferred an easier cheaper AW to participate in, 16.0 is the stuff of nightmares.
This isn't just about defender kills. Its about AW ceasing to be about what *any* players want or could possibly want.
Disagreeing that Defender Kills are necessary does not make someone a troll. It means they don't agree with that point of view.
No, but being a troll does make you a troll. You never answered me, by the way. Is there a single post of yours against defender kills before Kabam scrapped them? I suspect not, which is why you get accused of taking whatever position Kabam serves up rather than the independent thought you profess. Most of us are in favor of some things kabam has done and are against other things. I was in favor of the willpower nerf and the death of the block team. I was in favor of the SW/Strange nerf and very much opposed to the way it was executed, particularly with strange. They promised he would still be a top champ albeit closer to the pack but they lied apparently. @GroundedWisdom can you provide a link to one post you wrote in which you were staunchly opposed to something Kabam was doing?
Disagreeing that Defender Kills are necessary does not make someone a troll. It means they don't agree with that point of view.
No, but being a troll does make you a troll. You never answered me, by the way. Is there a single post of yours against defender kills before Kabam scrapped them? I suspect not, which is why you get accused of taking whatever position Kabam serves up rather than the independent thought you profess. Most of us are in favor of some things kabam has done and are against other things. I was in favor of the willpower nerf and the death of the block team. I was in favor of the SW/Strange nerf and very much opposed to the way it was executed, particularly with strange. They promised he would still be a top champ albeit closer to the pack but they lied apparently. @GroundedWisdom can you provide a link to one post you wrote in which you were staunchly opposed to something Kabam was doing?
I didn't respond because of the nature of the question. It's also redundant to say I haven't posted against them being removed because I pointed that fact out myself. I am not a troll. Sorry.
Bring back the defender kills and give me all the rewards we lost because of this stupidity you call “more fun war game mode” for us. More fun for who? You?
Who was the better team at this war?? The other alliance who placed defense with higher PI by a tiny bit, yet they had to die more to achieve the same results in attack as my alliance???
GO SCREW YOURSELVES!!!!!!!
You’re still working on fixing it??? You’re pathetic bunch of incompetent amateurs if you need this long to figure out...
Placing higher pi defense is not a skill the same way your game mode development is not called development. ,,|,.
You’re still working on fixing it??? You’re pathetic bunch of incompetent amateurs if you need this long to figure out...
I'm pretty sure they are not working on it, or thinking about it. They are in iteration mode. In iteration mode MMO developers have a set of metrics they are looking at which someone decided were the important ones that determine if their current iterative loop is done. They have some kind of target they are trying to hit. When they hit it they are done. I don't know what those metrics are or what they could possibly be, but I'm reasonably certain all they are doing now is letting AW roll and collecting numbers.
And I'm reasonably sure the next AW iteration, if there is a next AW iteration, will be more node tweaks that Kabam will say is bringing AW closer to what we all want, even though we're all asking them to stop tweaking the nodes and directly address the fact that there is no replacement metric for alliances to compete on attacking performance except for the most coarsest ones possible.
Bottom line: if alliance A and alliance B both accomplish the same amount during war, the one that did so with the best offensive performance should in general win. The current system doesn't do that, or even try. We want a direct fix for that problem. That is *the* singular problem with the competitive aspects of AW. Tweaking the nodes is an indirect and very clumsy way of addressing this that has bad side effects almost no one wants.
Disagreeing that Defender Kills are necessary does not make someone a troll. It means they don't agree with that point of view.
No, but being a troll does make you a troll. You never answered me, by the way. Is there a single post of yours against defender kills before Kabam scrapped them? I suspect not, which is why you get accused of taking whatever position Kabam serves up rather than the independent thought you profess. Most of us are in favor of some things kabam has done and are against other things. I was in favor of the willpower nerf and the death of the block team. I was in favor of the SW/Strange nerf and very much opposed to the way it was executed, particularly with strange. They promised he would still be a top champ albeit closer to the pack but they lied apparently. @GroundedWisdom can you provide a link to one post you wrote in which you were staunchly opposed to something Kabam was doing?
I didn't respond because of the nature of the question. It's also redundant to say I haven't posted against them being removed because I pointed that fact out myself. I am not a troll. Sorry.
Sorry. Must've missed when you pointed out that you were never against defender kills before Kabam removed them. And it sounds like you are agreeing that there are no posts you've written in which you have been strongly opposed to the Kabam position? Surely even Kabam doesn't believe that they are always right... You may not be a troll in the traditional sense, but being the self appointed Kabam defender kind of makes you a troll...
You explicitly stated that you took out defender kill points because it discouraged players from attacking and instilled feelings of defeat.
What kind of feeling do you think 20k heals every 6 seconds gives to players other than contempt for having to spend units on a largely unbeatable node?
We lost war cause we gave up on this node. It "discouraged us from continuing our assault on the opposing alliance". What do you have to say about this?
Spamming "Defender Kills" and calling me out in every Thread you comment on about Wars (GW) is not going to provoke a reaction out of me. Trust me, I noticed. I just don't care. Arguing with me and calling me out won't bring Kills back either. I've said I was against them. I said if they added them again, I would still be against them. It's not about Kabam vs. Players vs. GW vs. anyone. It's a topic that I have views on, and that's not going to change. I am for the removal of Defender Kills. I've stated my own views on that. It is not my sole responsibility that they are gone, and that's why I pointed out that I haven't commented on them until their removal. There are a great many things I have views on that I don't petition for because I have restraint. The fact that they were removed was an opportunity to express how I felt and what I thought. That's the extent of the conversation because I am not responding to being baited, and this Thread is not about me or what I do and do not support. Feel free to continue because frankly, it doesn't bother me.
Disagreeing that Defender Kills are necessary does not make someone a troll. It means they don't agree with that point of view.
No, but being a troll does make you a troll. You never answered me, by the way. Is there a single post of yours against defender kills before Kabam scrapped them? I suspect not, which is why you get accused of taking whatever position Kabam serves up rather than the independent thought you profess. Most of us are in favor of some things kabam has done and are against other things. I was in favor of the willpower nerf and the death of the block team. I was in favor of the SW/Strange nerf and very much opposed to the way it was executed, particularly with strange. They promised he would still be a top champ albeit closer to the pack but they lied apparently. @GroundedWisdom can you provide a link to one post you wrote in which you were staunchly opposed to something Kabam was doing?
I didn't respond because of the nature of the question. It's also redundant to say I haven't posted against them being removed because I pointed that fact out myself. I am not a troll. Sorry.
Sorry. Must've missed when you pointed out that you were never against defender kills before Kabam removed them. And it sounds like you are agreeing that there are no posts you've written in which you have been strongly opposed to the Kabam position? Surely even Kabam doesn't believe that they are always right... You may not be a troll in the traditional sense, but being the self appointed Kabam defender kind of makes you a troll...
Well that would be interesting @GroundedWisdom because if they do bring defender kills back it sounds like you will be against something Kabam has done for the first time ever, albeit they will have forced your hand. Seriously though, just asking for one post ever in the 4,328 things you've posted in which you have been opposed to the kabam position. I'm happy this doesn't bother you as I have no interest in bothering people. I am interested in calling out people who claim to be about independent thought when they appear to be about taking the party line. Prove me wrong. I'd like to be wrong on this but I don't think I am.
Feel free to continue because frankly, it doesn't bother me.
Or you have literally nothing with which to refute me and you have never disagreed with the kabam position even one time. Since you won't respond we can let people decide for themselves what seems plausible lol.
All it would take is one counter example. But there aren't any. You aren't taking the bait because there is no reply you can make. But you still feel the need to reply lol.
You explicitly stated that you took out defender kill points because it discouraged players from attacking and instilled feelings of defeat.
What kind of feeling do you think 20k heals every 6 seconds gives to players other than contempt for having to spend units on a largely unbeatable node?
We lost war cause we gave up on this node. It "discouraged us from continuing our assault on the opposing alliance". What do you have to say about this?
Just wanted to repost the "picture is worth a 1000 words" screenshots and highlight the importance and urgency of getting a valid response from Kabam regarding this and all other similar type of scenarios created by the current iterations.
Also as stated in a recently closed thread by KabamMiike, "more changes planned that will bring Alliance Wars closer to what our goals for the mode were, and to make Alliance Wars into the mode that you all want it to be", when exactly are we going to see changes to AW that are in line with "you all want it to be"(I'm assuming he meant us players)?
Up to now since the intial revamp of AW, every iteration I'm aware of had not a single change that has been suggested by the player base(yes, there were plenty which did not include D kills). Just curious, are the iterations released and planned for the future split up to not include Kabams and the players suggestions simultaneously maybe?
And I believe it has been close to 2 months if not longer since the start of "iterations mode", so how much longer approx. is it going to take where threads like this can finally be put to rest?
I'm pretty confident if just 1 or 2 actual player suggestions were seriously considered and implemented, we could save a lot of "electronic paper".
Can't belive we still discuss this horrible war situation while never getting feed back from the devolpers. As for grounded wisdom..... there's no keeping him quiet. His info is just as horrible as kabams lack of communication.
It's gone on this long so nothing will change in our favor anytime soon. Wars just are flat out not fun and have no competitive engagement since you can't compare skill after all the organization prior to war has been done.
You explicitly stated that you took out defender kill points because it discouraged players from attacking and instilled feelings of defeat.
What kind of feeling do you think 20k heals every 6 seconds gives to players other than contempt for having to spend units on a largely unbeatable node?
We lost war cause we gave up on this node. It "discouraged us from continuing our assault on the opposing alliance". What do you have to say about this?
This should be reposted 1000x until they give a meaningful responses. Totally absurd that this is "working as intended" and is harder than some mini boss nodes.
Just wanted to repost the "picture is worth a 1000 words" screenshots and highlight the importance and urgency of getting a valid response from Kabam regarding this and all other similar type of scenarios created by the current iterations.
Kabam's position on this node appears to be that it is working correctly (it does appear to work exactly the way I calculate it should, so it does work "correctly" in that sense) and that the point of the node is to require the attacker to bring the right champion on attack and play skillfully to defeat it. There are counters for that node: you could heal block it, you could fight it without dexterity, you could weaken it somehow, you could kill it quickly with huge offense.
That's a legitimate position to take by itself, except it is contrary to the position Kabam used to wreck AW by prioritizing player "exhaustion" fighting unbeatable nodes and the rationale for removing nodes like thorns.
I'm the first one to say that sometimes a game designer must do two different things that seem contradictory because they have to arrive at a compromise between disparate game requirements. However, this is not that. This is literally people who don't know what they want and don't know how to get it randomly messing up a part of the game and then trying to spackle it over with tweaks that look like they were assigned to an intern to teach them how the design spreadsheets work for maps.
You explicitly stated that you took out defender kill points because it discouraged players from attacking and instilled feelings of defeat.
What kind of feeling do you think 20k heals every 6 seconds gives to players other than contempt for having to spend units on a largely unbeatable node?
We lost war cause we gave up on this node. It "discouraged us from continuing our assault on the opposing alliance". What do you have to say about this?
Comments
Three errors in five words is probably a record.
It was suggested that disagreeing should be my Sig to save people trouble. I don't disagree for the sake of disagreeing, or to be contrary. However, if I have a different view, I am not swayed by a majority. I look at things from a perspective that is not dependent on popular vote or opinion. Thus, I made a joke out of a joke. Pretty sure there is not much error in that.
There I fixed it for you
'Independent thought'? Don't make us all LOL
Just don’t trigger dexterity and also take a champ that doesn’t gain buffs.
We have defender kills. Defenders are killing things quite efficiently in 16.0.
I think it is worth reminding everyone that there were people who liked 15.0 AW. It was totally non-competitive, but there were people who liked the fact that AW was easier, cheaper, and less stressful. It was a mockery of competition, but not everyone likes strong competition. For such people, removing defender kill points and reducing the strength of the node buffs destroyed competition, but did make AW something easier to participate in. We even saw many such people post in the original thread that they liked the easier war.
Don't see those guys any more. Because no one who liked 15.0 could have liked 15.1 or 16.0. War is still less focused on attacker competition than 14.0, but it is now much harder than 15.0 and even harder than 14.0. I would argue that with defenders like Ultron being placed again, its potentially harder in some ways than 11.0 when scaled healing was in effect. If you want strong attacker-focused competition, 16.0 is still inferior to 14.0. But if you don't want strong competition and preferred an easier cheaper AW to participate in, 16.0 is the stuff of nightmares.
This isn't just about defender kills. Its about AW ceasing to be about what *any* players want or could possibly want.
No, but being a troll does make you a troll. You never answered me, by the way. Is there a single post of yours against defender kills before Kabam scrapped them? I suspect not, which is why you get accused of taking whatever position Kabam serves up rather than the independent thought you profess. Most of us are in favor of some things kabam has done and are against other things. I was in favor of the willpower nerf and the death of the block team. I was in favor of the SW/Strange nerf and very much opposed to the way it was executed, particularly with strange. They promised he would still be a top champ albeit closer to the pack but they lied apparently. @GroundedWisdom can you provide a link to one post you wrote in which you were staunchly opposed to something Kabam was doing?
I didn't respond because of the nature of the question. It's also redundant to say I haven't posted against them being removed because I pointed that fact out myself. I am not a troll. Sorry.
1) When are we going back to hidden champs?
2) Defender Kills. Bring them back..
Bring back the defender kills and give me all the rewards we lost because of this stupidity you call “more fun war game mode” for us. More fun for who? You?
Who was the better team at this war?? The other alliance who placed defense with higher PI by a tiny bit, yet they had to die more to achieve the same results in attack as my alliance???
GO SCREW YOURSELVES!!!!!!!
You’re still working on fixing it??? You’re pathetic bunch of incompetent amateurs if you need this long to figure out...
Placing higher pi defense is not a skill the same way your game mode development is not called development. ,,|,.
I'm pretty sure they are not working on it, or thinking about it. They are in iteration mode. In iteration mode MMO developers have a set of metrics they are looking at which someone decided were the important ones that determine if their current iterative loop is done. They have some kind of target they are trying to hit. When they hit it they are done. I don't know what those metrics are or what they could possibly be, but I'm reasonably certain all they are doing now is letting AW roll and collecting numbers.
And I'm reasonably sure the next AW iteration, if there is a next AW iteration, will be more node tweaks that Kabam will say is bringing AW closer to what we all want, even though we're all asking them to stop tweaking the nodes and directly address the fact that there is no replacement metric for alliances to compete on attacking performance except for the most coarsest ones possible.
Bottom line: if alliance A and alliance B both accomplish the same amount during war, the one that did so with the best offensive performance should in general win. The current system doesn't do that, or even try. We want a direct fix for that problem. That is *the* singular problem with the competitive aspects of AW. Tweaking the nodes is an indirect and very clumsy way of addressing this that has bad side effects almost no one wants.
Sorry. Must've missed when you pointed out that you were never against defender kills before Kabam removed them. And it sounds like you are agreeing that there are no posts you've written in which you have been strongly opposed to the Kabam position? Surely even Kabam doesn't believe that they are always right... You may not be a troll in the traditional sense, but being the self appointed Kabam defender kind of makes you a troll...
Exactly what kind of planning would we need here?
You explicitly stated that you took out defender kill points because it discouraged players from attacking and instilled feelings of defeat.
What kind of feeling do you think 20k heals every 6 seconds gives to players other than contempt for having to spend units on a largely unbeatable node?
We lost war cause we gave up on this node. It "discouraged us from continuing our assault on the opposing alliance". What do you have to say about this?
Or you have literally nothing with which to refute me and you have never disagreed with the kabam position even one time. Since you won't respond we can let people decide for themselves what seems plausible lol.
Just wanted to repost the "picture is worth a 1000 words" screenshots and highlight the importance and urgency of getting a valid response from Kabam regarding this and all other similar type of scenarios created by the current iterations.
Also as stated in a recently closed thread by KabamMiike, "more changes planned that will bring Alliance Wars closer to what our goals for the mode were, and to make Alliance Wars into the mode that you all want it to be", when exactly are we going to see changes to AW that are in line with "you all want it to be"(I'm assuming he meant us players)?
Up to now since the intial revamp of AW, every iteration I'm aware of had not a single change that has been suggested by the player base(yes, there were plenty which did not include D kills). Just curious, are the iterations released and planned for the future split up to not include Kabams and the players suggestions simultaneously maybe?
And I believe it has been close to 2 months if not longer since the start of "iterations mode", so how much longer approx. is it going to take where threads like this can finally be put to rest?
I'm pretty confident if just 1 or 2 actual player suggestions were seriously considered and implemented, we could save a lot of "electronic paper".
It's gone on this long so nothing will change in our favor anytime soon. Wars just are flat out not fun and have no competitive engagement since you can't compare skill after all the organization prior to war has been done.
This should be reposted 1000x until they give a meaningful responses. Totally absurd that this is "working as intended" and is harder than some mini boss nodes.
AW is a total wreck right now.
Kabam's position on this node appears to be that it is working correctly (it does appear to work exactly the way I calculate it should, so it does work "correctly" in that sense) and that the point of the node is to require the attacker to bring the right champion on attack and play skillfully to defeat it. There are counters for that node: you could heal block it, you could fight it without dexterity, you could weaken it somehow, you could kill it quickly with huge offense.
That's a legitimate position to take by itself, except it is contrary to the position Kabam used to wreck AW by prioritizing player "exhaustion" fighting unbeatable nodes and the rationale for removing nodes like thorns.
I'm the first one to say that sometimes a game designer must do two different things that seem contradictory because they have to arrive at a compromise between disparate game requirements. However, this is not that. This is literally people who don't know what they want and don't know how to get it randomly messing up a part of the game and then trying to spackle it over with tweaks that look like they were assigned to an intern to teach them how the design spreadsheets work for maps.