War Matchmaking is busted

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  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Lormif said:

    ABOMB said:

    ABOMB said:

    ^This guy lol..just keep taking advantage of the smaller allys and getting your easy wins.
    Makes ya feel tuff I guess 🤣

    My mini mini account is facing such "high level folks" in silver1, One bg war. We have 6k prestige. Maybe 1, max 2 r5 per person. We faced an ally with only maxed 5* and r2 6* in war. We won. Nothing "easy". We were just better. 15million ally vs 35 million. We won. In the end, it is who is better, nothing more.
    "My mini" there you go man..you obviously have been playing a while and have good skill. Were talking about the lower allies that are still developing skill getting matched with such lopsided opponents..
    Soooo.... you dont have the skill? Then why cry for the rewards? Higher alliances used skill to get there, you want a hall pass?
    So because they used skill, they should be allowed to take advantage of Alliances much weaker and less developed? Doesn't sound like skill to me at all.
    How long does it last? A few bad wars here and there, and everything is okay when the dust settles.
    Yes i have faced "both" sides of the coin, and my mini has faced bad matches. We won some, we lose some.
    EVERYONE faces bad matches, no matter how high you go. Unless you are the top 40 big big account alliances, you are gonna face terrible matches at some point. Then it is your decision how you want to proceed.
    Even then, "bad matches" may be offset by the fact that the opposite ally flat out doesnt take war seriously. My main ally is 10.6k prestige, we faced a 11.4k prestige ally, and won. They didnt push war like us, and we won rather easily.
    There are a lot of factors at play here. Those who constantly complain here just havent faced "bad" matches long enough. One lost war does nothing unless you are seriously getting into the competition, and when that does happen, you have to be ready to tough it out.
    We're not talking about a few bad Matches, and it's not just a natural byproduct of going as high as you can and plateauing. Some of these Matches are pretty extreme, and it's a result of switching without something regulating it. That's the point. There's nothing in place to keep the competition in the spirit of fairness.
    1) you have not showed any extreme matchups, only extreme alliance ratings,
    2) this season there has been like 5 posts for it, and one was about a team who lost despite having higher rating.
    Extreme Alliance Ratings ARE extreme matchups. No idea why you keep asserting it doesn't matter, but that's just not the same game that everyone else is playing.
    So you are saying it matters if the alliance has 8 r5 5*s that they use for war or 8 5* r5s they use for war and 30 r5 5*s they dont? That is what alliance ratings shows. Again you can only use 8 champions, 5 on defense 3 on offense, what does it matter what all the other champions he has ranked up on his account to get around content? Please enlighten us all.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    edited September 2020
    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★
    edited September 2020

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    I have 2 mini accounts rated around 400-450k. Both can place a 5 champion defence of maxed out 5* and still take max 5* on offence.

    If an alliance which had 30 members in the same position, the alliance rating would be around 13m.

    If I were then in a war against an alliance with a rating of 25m, other than the occasional rank 2 6*, they will also be placing maxed 5*, should I feel like I’m going to lose just because they’re almost double the size?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Shamir51 said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    I have 2 mini accounts rated around 400-450k. Both can place a 5 champion defence of maxed out 5* and still take max 5* on offence.

    If an alliance which had 30 members in the same position, the alliance rating would be around 13m.

    If I were then in a war against an alliance with a rating of 25m, other than the occasional rank 2 6*, they will also be placing maxed 5*, should I feel like I’m going to lose just because they’re almost double the size?
    You honestly think your mini is an accurate representation of what an unfair Match is?
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Shamir51 said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    I have 2 mini accounts rated around 400-450k. Both can place a 5 champion defence of maxed out 5* and still take max 5* on offence.

    If an alliance which had 30 members in the same position, the alliance rating would be around 13m.

    If I were then in a war against an alliance with a rating of 25m, other than the occasional rank 2 6*, they will also be placing maxed 5*, should I feel like I’m going to lose just because they’re almost double the size?
    You honestly think your mini is an accurate representation of what an unfair Match is?
    why isnt it? you are all about the rating, the rating. And you dont know how may on these alliances you are going to bat for are mini accounts.....
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★

    Shamir51 said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    I have 2 mini accounts rated around 400-450k. Both can place a 5 champion defence of maxed out 5* and still take max 5* on offence.

    If an alliance which had 30 members in the same position, the alliance rating would be around 13m.

    If I were then in a war against an alliance with a rating of 25m, other than the occasional rank 2 6*, they will also be placing maxed 5*, should I feel like I’m going to lose just because they’re almost double the size?
    You honestly think your mini is an accurate representation of what an unfair Match is?
    Why not? A few people can’t seem to see past alliance ratings and prestige.

    Now you’re wanting to take other factors into consideration?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.

    I don’t sell champions so that’s not why the ratings on the alts are lower. I don’t have a single maxed out 3* and a only a handful of maxed 4*.

    I’m not riding any leaderboards on as many fronts as I can- for my 2 main accounts, I do war casually on 1 (Silver 2 by the way) and no war at all on the other. On the 2 minis, I don’t do any war at all (but that alliance finished Silver 3).

    All of your arguments to this point are that it is unfair for a small (15m or lower) alliance to be matched with a large (25m and up) alliance. You haven’t taken anything into account other than the numbers and you’ve used that to say the system is broken.

    All I have tried to do is highlight that you need to look past the numbers.

    @Lormif has stated multiple times, just because the opposition alliance is bigger than yours, it is not a guaranteed loss! Well except for the people whinging, like OP, in which case the war is over and they’ve lost before a single person has joined attack.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    youre right they dont, but by the time they get to 300k rating they tend to have a decent number of them at this point in the game. People just starting out now get 6*s really early (equivalent to a rank4 5*). If thgis was 3 years ago the argument would be differnt, but this is now and getting champs and ranking them up is VERY easy now.

    So again, what stops them, it is not "progression", because progression is cake and you can skip most of story content.
  • TheTalentsTheTalents Posts: 1,665 ★★★★★
    ABOMB said:

    I never said that..
    I'm just trying to prove a point that to small allys that are still developing better skill, prestige matters in war. They should not be facing allys with 3K more prestige.
    But to many who think skill is the end all..its clearly not because nobody wants to put their money where their mouth is cuz they know they would be proven wrong.

    The people that play higher wars have more skill. Just because someone spends on the game doesn't automatically mean they have no skill. Have you tried to join a high level alliance? Most of the guys you're talking about don't even play map 7 and map 7 is a cake walk for players that are gold 1 and above majority of the time.
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    You’re right- it’s incredibly hard to get 5* these days as opposed to, say 2 years ago?

    I mean it’s not like all anyone has to do is log on for 87 days and they’ll have a 5* whether they’ve completed act 1 or not.
  • Ebony_NawEbony_Naw Posts: 1,267 ★★★★

    ABOMB said:

    ABOMB said:

    ^This guy lol..just keep taking advantage of the smaller allys and getting your easy wins.
    Makes ya feel tuff I guess 🤣

    My mini mini account is facing such "high level folks" in silver1, One bg war. We have 6k prestige. Maybe 1, max 2 r5 per person. We faced an ally with only maxed 5* and r2 6* in war. We won. Nothing "easy". We were just better. 15million ally vs 35 million. We won. In the end, it is who is better, nothing more.
    "My mini" there you go man..you obviously have been playing a while and have good skill. Were talking about the lower allies that are still developing skill getting matched with such lopsided opponents..
    Soooo.... you dont have the skill? Then why cry for the rewards? Higher alliances used skill to get there, you want a hall pass?
    So because they used skill, they should be allowed to take advantage of Alliances much weaker and less developed? Doesn't sound like skill to me at all.
    Lololol. So size discrepancies should be limited in matches so that skill could play a deciding factor... but then, it's not fair if you're TOO skilled? What do we match based on then? This is too funny
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★
    Case in point- hasn’t completed act 1, has a 5* Elsa.


  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    edited September 2020
    Shamir51 said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    You’re right- it’s incredibly hard to get 5* these days as opposed to, say 2 years ago?

    I mean it’s not like all anyone has to do is log on for 87 days and they’ll have a 5* whether they’ve completed act 1 or not.
    He said 300k Rating, with 8 MAXED 5*s. That doesn't just happen. Someone who is a Vet with a main and some alts is not a representation of what we're talking about. They're not starting out, or trying to grow and develop in the same way. That person is a more skilled person, running multiple Accounts.
  • Shamir51Shamir51 Posts: 612 ★★★

    Shamir51 said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    You’re right- it’s incredibly hard to get 5* these days as opposed to, say 2 years ago?

    I mean it’s not like all anyone has to do is log on for 87 days and they’ll have a 5* whether they’ve completed act 1 or not.
    He said 300k Rating, with 8 MAXED 5*s. That doesn't just happen. Someone who is a Vet with a main and some alts is not a representation of what we're talking about. They're not starting out, or trying to grow and develop in the same way. That person is a more skilled person, running multiple Accounts.
    I’m sorry but with the way that rewards and resources are basically given away by Kabam, it’s entirely possible for a new player to be in that position.

    I’ve seen a level 42 Cav with a hero rating under 300k. Not a mini. Not a returning player. Just someone that honed his skills.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★

    Shamir51 said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    You’re right- it’s incredibly hard to get 5* these days as opposed to, say 2 years ago?

    I mean it’s not like all anyone has to do is log on for 87 days and they’ll have a 5* whether they’ve completed act 1 or not.
    He said 300k Rating, with 8 MAXED 5*s. That doesn't just happen. Someone who is a Vet with a main and some alts is not a representation of what we're talking about. They're not starting out, or trying to grow and develop in the same way. That person is a more skilled person, running multiple Accounts.
    what do you mean that just does not happen? particularly when you can delete your 4*s and below to artificially lower your rating? The answer to my question btw is nothing but luck. You can have 300k and have the best 8 war champions in the game, or you can have a 1.5m rating and have none of the best 8, because of your luck. And alliance rating cannot measure luck.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★
    Lormif said:

    Shamir51 said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    What stops them, answer the question, dont deflect.
    Natural progression. That's what.
    what progression prevents you from getting the exact same 8 champs as someone who has 1.5m rating?
    People don't just start the game out and go from
    0 to 300k with 8 Max 5*s. Not unless they're not new. Natural progression.
    You’re right- it’s incredibly hard to get 5* these days as opposed to, say 2 years ago?

    I mean it’s not like all anyone has to do is log on for 87 days and they’ll have a 5* whether they’ve completed act 1 or not.
    He said 300k Rating, with 8 MAXED 5*s. That doesn't just happen. Someone who is a Vet with a main and some alts is not a representation of what we're talking about. They're not starting out, or trying to grow and develop in the same way. That person is a more skilled person, running multiple Accounts.
    what do you mean that just does not happen? particularly when you can delete your 4*s and below to artificially lower your rating? The answer to my question btw is nothing but luck. You can have 300k and have the best 8 war champions in the game, or you can have a 1.5m rating and have none of the best 8, because of your luck. And alliance rating cannot measure luck.
    It doesn't. I've worked with people starting out since my third month playing. I know how fast people grow. I know the Alliance requirements for higher Rewards to Rank. It just doesn't happen unless they're not new.
  • pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 697 ★★★★

    ABOMB said:

    ABOMB said:

    ^This guy lol..just keep taking advantage of the smaller allys and getting your easy wins.
    Makes ya feel tuff I guess 🤣

    My mini mini account is facing such "high level folks" in silver1, One bg war. We have 6k prestige. Maybe 1, max 2 r5 per person. We faced an ally with only maxed 5* and r2 6* in war. We won. Nothing "easy". We were just better. 15million ally vs 35 million. We won. In the end, it is who is better, nothing more.
    "My mini" there you go man..you obviously have been playing a while and have good skill. Were talking about the lower allies that are still developing skill getting matched with such lopsided opponents..
    Soooo.... you dont have the skill? Then why cry for the rewards? Higher alliances used skill to get there, you want a hall pass?
    So because they used skill, they should be allowed to take advantage of Alliances much weaker and less developed? Doesn't sound like skill to me at all.
    How long does it last? A few bad wars here and there, and everything is okay when the dust settles.
    Yes i have faced "both" sides of the coin, and my mini has faced bad matches. We won some, we lose some.
    EVERYONE faces bad matches, no matter how high you go. Unless you are the top 40 big big account alliances, you are gonna face terrible matches at some point. Then it is your decision how you want to proceed.
    Even then, "bad matches" may be offset by the fact that the opposite ally flat out doesnt take war seriously. My main ally is 10.6k prestige, we faced a 11.4k prestige ally, and won. They didnt push war like us, and we won rather easily.
    There are a lot of factors at play here. Those who constantly complain here just havent faced "bad" matches long enough. One lost war does nothing unless you are seriously getting into the competition, and when that does happen, you have to be ready to tough it out.
    We're not talking about a few bad Matches, and it's not just a natural byproduct of going as high as you can and plateauing. Some of these Matches are pretty extreme, and it's a result of switching without something regulating it. That's the point. There's nothing in place to keep the competition in the spirit of fairness.
    Have you faced it? I have, I am not complaining. Why complain for the sake of creating an unnecessary ruckus?
  • NuclekerrNuclekerr Posts: 139
    Y’all complainers need to suck it up buttercups.
  • winterthurwinterthur Posts: 4,947 ★★★★
    Shamir51 said:

    Lormif said:

    Lormif said:

    I'm not going over it and over it. We all know how War works. I'm not pretending a mismatch isn't a thing. The fact that people justify taking advantage of weaker Alliances and use skill in the same breath is really telling. That's what this has encouraged. In any event, the argument is futile. We know full well the Champs you place in Defense are what the opposing Alliance has to come up against.

    you cannot answer it. This is like a salary cap, it evens everything out. Alliance rating shows nothing but massive amount of champions that are never used for war, which is why it is terrible to take into consideration.
    You're not that naive. These Matches aren't just because the Rating is different but the Defense is the same. These Posts are because the variation in both sides is so extreme that people can't compete reasonably.
    Oh so now it is not about the ratings? what stops 300k rated player from having the exact same 8 rank 5 5* as a 1.5m rated player?
    These people are still trying to grow and come up. They're not playing multiple Accounts and selling their Champs along the way. They're not riding the Leaderboard on as many fronts as they can. Honestly, some people reach a certain point, and they think they can speak for everyone else's skill and points of growth because they have a main that's killing everything, some minis that are optimized with their own current skill and knowledge level, and they have all the answers.
    All of your arguments to this point are that it is unfair for a small (15m or lower) alliance to be matched with a large (25m and up) alliance. You haven’t taken anything into account other than the numbers and you’ve used that to say the system is broken.
    If I understand correctly, his point was
    i/ before the change in match making using a single war rating criteria, "smaller" alliance (whatever that means), earned they way up fighting "similar" size alliances.

    However, this "smaller" alliance because of the match making criteria (before the current one), was not matched against "stronger" alliances.

    "Stronger" alliances cannot progress up because they are matched against "similar" size alliances which leads to point ii/.

    ii/ The change in match making criteria shifted the "rules" of match making and the consequence is this "smaller" alliance now "consistently" gets matched against "stronger" alliances and keeps losing or rather lose before even making the first move and there is no end in sight for these "mis-matches".

    This is very discouraging to this "smaller" alliance who had earned their way up through the previous match-making rules.

    So, he is against this single war rating match making criteria because it was change from the previous method.

    I don't know whether he has anything to say if from day 1 of Seasons, the match-making criteria was just using war rating. Maybe a lot still, I have no idea.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 26,733 ★★★★★

    ABOMB said:

    ABOMB said:

    ^This guy lol..just keep taking advantage of the smaller allys and getting your easy wins.
    Makes ya feel tuff I guess 🤣

    My mini mini account is facing such "high level folks" in silver1, One bg war. We have 6k prestige. Maybe 1, max 2 r5 per person. We faced an ally with only maxed 5* and r2 6* in war. We won. Nothing "easy". We were just better. 15million ally vs 35 million. We won. In the end, it is who is better, nothing more.
    "My mini" there you go man..you obviously have been playing a while and have good skill. Were talking about the lower allies that are still developing skill getting matched with such lopsided opponents..
    Soooo.... you dont have the skill? Then why cry for the rewards? Higher alliances used skill to get there, you want a hall pass?
    So because they used skill, they should be allowed to take advantage of Alliances much weaker and less developed? Doesn't sound like skill to me at all.
    How long does it last? A few bad wars here and there, and everything is okay when the dust settles.
    Yes i have faced "both" sides of the coin, and my mini has faced bad matches. We won some, we lose some.
    EVERYONE faces bad matches, no matter how high you go. Unless you are the top 40 big big account alliances, you are gonna face terrible matches at some point. Then it is your decision how you want to proceed.
    Even then, "bad matches" may be offset by the fact that the opposite ally flat out doesnt take war seriously. My main ally is 10.6k prestige, we faced a 11.4k prestige ally, and won. They didnt push war like us, and we won rather easily.
    There are a lot of factors at play here. Those who constantly complain here just havent faced "bad" matches long enough. One lost war does nothing unless you are seriously getting into the competition, and when that does happen, you have to be ready to tough it out.
    We're not talking about a few bad Matches, and it's not just a natural byproduct of going as high as you can and plateauing. Some of these Matches are pretty extreme, and it's a result of switching without something regulating it. That's the point. There's nothing in place to keep the competition in the spirit of fairness.
    Have you faced it? I have, I am not complaining. Why complain for the sake of creating an unnecessary ruckus?
    I predicted it before they implemented the change. I spoke up for the people affected by this all long the way. I fought against the people affected by this. It's anything but unnecessary. No one wins with a system that imbalanced. It's anything but unnecessary, and the only people arguing everything is as it should be are the ones who are benefitting on the backs of people in these Matches.
This discussion has been closed.