Class and Rarity Gates - Discussion Thread

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Comments

  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 7,910 Guardian

    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting.

    First of all, I would bet you're wrong there. The vast majority of mobile game players are casual players: they aren't as focused on combat skills as, say, the majority of players on the forums.

    But second, eliminating the issue of how common this is, this doesn't directly contradict what I said. What I said was that this game is primarily about collecting champions, and the combat is there to give them value (beyond, of course, the Marvel IP). In other words, the combat is the incentive to pursue certain champs. That doesn't make the incentive unimportant, the incentive has to work for the pursuit to work. But the pursuit is the thing, not the incentive.

    If the combat was the thing and the collection was incidental, the game developers would spend more time expanding and layering the actual combat itself, and less time creating new champions. Instead, most of the changes to combat come from new champions with new complexities to their abilities, rather than changes to the fundamental mechanics of combat. That doesn't mean no one cares about the combat, rather the reverse. It is in Kabam's best interests to make people care about the combat, because that's how they get people to pursue champions. But they don't tend to evolve combat by expanding how combat works, they tend to evolve combat by adding more champions players have to pursue that have newer more interesting features.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★
    (Sorry if I gave someone a brain hemorrhage with that ^^^, didn’t mean to sound confusing 😂)
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★
    *Waiting for my comment to get approved*

    Honestly, am I the only one finds that annoying as heck?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
  • SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 456 ★★★

    Roster Size is mostly dependent on your wallet when it comes to the endgame. Skills & achievements are based on the players. What would you want your game to focus on?

    So explain Brian Grant and his F2P account.
    He’s ONE example
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★
    Siliyo said:

    Roster Size is mostly dependent on your wallet when it comes to the endgame. Skills & achievements are based on the players. What would you want your game to focus on?

    So explain Brian Grant and his F2P account.
    He’s ONE example
    Also worth noting that you can buy all the Champs you want, but you don't get to the End-Game level unless you have the skills to use them.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 5,640 ★★★★★
    Siliyo said:

    Roster Size is mostly dependent on your wallet when it comes to the endgame. Skills & achievements are based on the players. What would you want your game to focus on?

    So explain Brian Grant and his F2P account.
    He’s ONE example
    And? Theres still plenty out there.
  • LongtimegamerLongtimegamer Posts: 179 ★★★
    So all you people not resisting or even liking these gates just love shelving your best champs for trashy 6*s, right? The fortune you spend on getting god tiers and taking them to rank 5 and sig 200 means nothing to you, right? You just can't wait to take your 6* iron fist against an 80k PI Magik on a bleed node in 6.2 am I right?
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 7,910 Guardian

    *Waiting for my comment to get approved*

    Honestly, am I the only one finds that annoying as heck?

    I still haven't figured out why it happens. Sometimes a post will go to the auto-mod, and then I post something that is almost exactly identical with literally one sentence reworded and it posts fine. Sometimes it captures the short post then lets go the long one, and sometimes it is vice versa. I have noticed that sometimes if there is a high density of links relative to paragraphs it is more likely to happen, but then sometimes it lets go posts that have basically nothing but links. Even the mods don't seem to be able to explain the behavior.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★
    For one or two Paths in one Quest? What about the children? Shouldn't someone be saying we should please think about the children? Lol.
    Just because you can't take them into a Path in 6.2 doesn't mean those Champs are shelved.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    *Waiting for my comment to get approved*

    Honestly, am I the only one finds that annoying as heck?

    I still haven't figured out why it happens. Sometimes a post will go to the auto-mod, and then I post something that is almost exactly identical with literally one sentence reworded and it posts fine. Sometimes it captures the short post then lets go the long one, and sometimes it is vice versa. I have noticed that sometimes if there is a high density of links relative to paragraphs it is more likely to happen, but then sometimes it lets go posts that have basically nothing but links. Even the mods don't seem to be able to explain the behavior.
    From what I understand, it's a glitch. Apparently it defaults from time to time. That's the explanation I was given when this Forum opened.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    Being on leader boards, or getting High prestige, Hero Rating or whatever isn’t the goal for most players. It’s to trek through content, like Story, EQ, AW...etc. But in a sense, I do agree with you. I stated how, but my comment is still waiting for Mod Approval 🙄
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    Being on leader boards, or getting High prestige, Hero Rating or whatever isn’t the goal for most players. It’s to trek through content, like Story, EQ, AW...etc. But in a sense, I do agree with you. I stated how, but my comment is still waiting for Mod Approval 🙄
    The goals of Players change from individual to individual, but the driving force behind the game is collecting. That's the whole point of fighting, to collect the Rewards. Those Rewards center around acquiring Champs and Ranking them so we can fight better. It's the crux of the game.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    I’ll rewrite.

    Funny, what you said actually hit me to partly agree with you. Why?

    I personally collect Champions to fight with them, therefore my goal is fighting. But why do I fight? To collect rewards, & collect more Champions. But why do I want to collect more rewards & Champions? Because I want to fight with them. And why do I want to fight with them? To collect more champs. And why do I want Champions? To fight with them. See a pattern? It’s an endless circle really. In a sense, we’re both right.

    I guess whatever your goal is, fighting or collecting... it’s just an endless circle of doing both.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    Being on leader boards, or getting High prestige, Hero Rating or whatever isn’t the goal for most players. It’s to trek through content, like Story, EQ, AW...etc. But in a sense, I do agree with you. I stated how, but my comment is still waiting for Mod Approval 🙄
    The goals of Players change from individual to individual, but the driving force behind the game is collecting. That's the whole point of fighting, to collect the Rewards. Those Rewards center around acquiring Champs and Ranking them so we can fight better. It's the crux of the game.
    That’s what I’m saying... it’s just a circle of Fighting to Collect, & Collecting to Fight. It’s just a matter of perspective.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    I’ll rewrite.

    Funny, what you said actually hit me to partly agree with you. Why?

    I personally collect Champions to fight with them, therefore my goal is fighting. But why do I fight? To collect rewards, & collect more Champions. But why do I want to collect more rewards & Champions? Because I want to fight with them. And why do I want to fight with them? To collect more champs. And why do I want Champions? To fight with them. See a pattern? It’s an endless circle really. In a sense, we’re both right.

    I guess whatever your goal is, fighting or collecting... it’s just an endless circle of doing both.
    Well, yes. Both are part of the game, and it's cyclical. Some focus on just fighting, and some focus on collecting. However, you're not going to progress if you focus on fighting alone. That comes from collecting as well, and one of the various ways to determine progress is what you've collected.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    I’ll rewrite.

    Funny, what you said actually hit me to partly agree with you. Why?

    I personally collect Champions to fight with them, therefore my goal is fighting. But why do I fight? To collect rewards, & collect more Champions. But why do I want to collect more rewards & Champions? Because I want to fight with them. And why do I want to fight with them? To collect more champs. And why do I want Champions? To fight with them. See a pattern? It’s an endless circle really. In a sense, we’re both right.

    I guess whatever your goal is, fighting or collecting... it’s just an endless circle of doing both.
    Well, yes. Both are part of the game, and it's cyclical. Some focus on just fighting, and some focus on collecting. However, you're not going to progress if you focus on fighting alone. That comes from collecting as well, and one of the various ways to determine progress is what you've collected.
    I wouldn’t say it’s a little of both, I’d say it’s both of each going hand in hand. Collect to Fight... & Fighting to Collect. It’s pretty much the drive of the game
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 19,304 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    I’ll rewrite.

    Funny, what you said actually hit me to partly agree with you. Why?

    I personally collect Champions to fight with them, therefore my goal is fighting. But why do I fight? To collect rewards, & collect more Champions. But why do I want to collect more rewards & Champions? Because I want to fight with them. And why do I want to fight with them? To collect more champs. And why do I want Champions? To fight with them. See a pattern? It’s an endless circle really. In a sense, we’re both right.

    I guess whatever your goal is, fighting or collecting... it’s just an endless circle of doing both.
    Well, yes. Both are part of the game, and it's cyclical. Some focus on just fighting, and some focus on collecting. However, you're not going to progress if you focus on fighting alone. That comes from collecting as well, and one of the various ways to determine progress is what you've collected.
    I wouldn’t say it’s a little of both, I’d say it’s both of each going hand in hand. Collect to Fight... & Fighting to Collect. It’s pretty much the drive of the game
    Yes, that's what I meant by cyclical. I just pointed out that if the only focus was fighting, there would be no progress. It's entirely possible to play that way, you just wouldn't make it far past the Arena.
  • May_The_WayMay_The_Way Posts: 493 ★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    I probably said it wrong in my 1st statement, my apologies. Roster Size... Champion collection... however you put it, is a form of progression, but it’s a progression that is mostly based on Cavalier Crystals & GMC’s when it comes to the endgame of MCOC.

    I actually get most of my 5* champs from arena grinding, not either of those two sources.


    And one more thing...

    DNA3000 said:

    This game is first and foremost a champion collecting game. All of the fighting elements of it are ways to value champions.

    This statement is 100% false. This game is first & foremost a fighting game, NOT a collection game. Not sure where you got that strange idea, but it’s advertised as a fighting game, talked about as a fighting game... & widely known as a fighting game. Even Wikipedia classes it as a fighting game...

    Collecting Champions is an element within this “Fighting Game” that many people enjoy... but it’s definitely not what the game is all about.
    I'm commenting on the game as it is designed and implemented, not how it is marketed. It is obviously a progressional game as that term is used in the games industry, but it isn't marketed as such because almost no progressional game is marketed as such. That doesn't change how the game itself works. If you think this game is designed and implemented as a fighting game that just happens to have some champion collecting in it, almost every design or monetization decision Kabam makes will seem mystifying to you.

    How a game is designed and implemented, and how it is "skinned" and marketed are two completely different things. Take Arkham Asylum for example. Is that game in the same genre as Dance Dance Revolution, a rhythm dance game? Of course not. Except, under the hood, that's how it was originally conceived and designed. How the mechanics work and how they are presented to the player are different. Similarly, how the priorities of content creation and monetization work for a game and how the game is marketed to players doesn't have to be the same.

    But if you believe authoritative sources above the game development, then here's how Kabam itself presents the game on its own website: https://playcontestofchampions.com/

    The page highlights three things: building alliances of players to challenge other alliances, creating teams of champions, and collecting Marvel champions. Some of those things implicitly refer to combat, but the actual combat of the game is not highlighted on MCOC's landing page.

    But aside from all of the Advertising & what the Devs claim the game to be, this game is far from Collection Oriented.
    Even when people do want collect champs, it’s almost always only to help progress in they’re fighting. When the “Blade era” was around, people didn’t want him to simply collect him, they wanted to fight with him & win. Blade was (& still is) a powerful weapon within the contest... as are many Champions, & that’s why people want them. Not just for a collection, but as a piece of utility to help them fight within the contest. That’s like saying a Gladiator doesn’t want to swords to fight, but swords to collect. Or a Cowboy wants pistols to collect, & not shoot.
    It’s absurd. Why do you think players don’t want Champions like Colossus, Kamala, IP, DPXF & many others? Do they not make good collectibles? 😂. No, it’s because this game is about fighting, not collecting... & those champs are terrible for fighting with.
    The game is first and foremost about collecting. Progress is measured by our Rating, and Prestige via Rating, we even have a Leaderboard that Ranks us based on it. The fact that some people cherry pick for the "best" ones makes it no less about collecting. The drive from month to month is the new Champs added. For some that means collecting as many as possible. For others, that means waiting for the next God Tier. Entire game modes revolve around acquiring Champs as well as the means to Rank them, modes like War, AQ, EQ, Story....we are either collecting Champs, or collecting Resources. How far someone has advanced is shown by what they've collected.
    I’ll rewrite.

    Funny, what you said actually hit me to partly agree with you. Why?

    I personally collect Champions to fight with them, therefore my goal is fighting. But why do I fight? To collect rewards, & collect more Champions. But why do I want to collect more rewards & Champions? Because I want to fight with them. And why do I want to fight with them? To collect more champs. And why do I want Champions? To fight with them. See a pattern? It’s an endless circle really. In a sense, we’re both right.

    I guess whatever your goal is, fighting or collecting... it’s just an endless circle of doing both.
    Well, yes. Both are part of the game, and it's cyclical. Some focus on just fighting, and some focus on collecting. However, you're not going to progress if you focus on fighting alone. That comes from collecting as well, and one of the various ways to determine progress is what you've collected.
    I wouldn’t say it’s a little of both, I’d say it’s both of each going hand in hand. Collect to Fight... & Fighting to Collect. It’s pretty much the drive of the game
    Yes, that's what I meant by cyclical. I just pointed out that if the only focus was fighting, there would be no progress. It's entirely possible to play that way, you just wouldn't make it far past the Arena.
    True, very true.
  • TehsigzorzTehsigzorz Posts: 335 ★★

    heirDEZ said:

    Where do these guys get off? And what brand of crack ya smoking .. lemme guess my credit card info lmao absurd

    Don't do the content until you are ready. Pretty simple.
    Isnt this the whole argument tho? People dont like it because to get ready you need to be lucky unless there is a new way to obtain 6 stars that I aint aware of yet
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 7,910 Guardian
    heirDEZ said:

    Where do these guys get off? And what brand of crack ya smoking .. lemme guess my credit card info lmao absurd

    What I find most absurd is the notion that Kabam is only trying to get everyone's money, and their strategy for doing this is to make a free game, make 99.99% of everything achievable without spending, and offering extremely little value for cash purchases most of the time. And this is what I'm supposed to believe is evidence that a company is trying as hard as possible to get as much of my money as possible.

    A company trying to make as much money as possible would making nothing free, and everything cost a small amount of money. That way everyone has to pay, and everyone would be paying a small enough amount with every purchase to have as small a barrier to purchase as possible. And since nothing actually costs Kabam to sell per unit (that ignores dev costs which are fixed regardless of how many they sell), they would offer as much stuff as possible in every purchase. This would then force everyone else to also buy those offers, or else fall hopelessly behind.

    This is the obvious strategy for extracting as much money out of your customers as possible, and it is a strategy that some online games have taken. MCOC does the literal exact opposite of the optimum revenue generation strategy.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 5,640 ★★★★★

    heirDEZ said:

    Where do these guys get off? And what brand of crack ya smoking .. lemme guess my credit card info lmao absurd

    Don't do the content until you are ready. Pretty simple.
    Isnt this the whole argument tho? People dont like it because to get ready you need to be lucky unless there is a new way to obtain 6 stars that I aint aware of yet
    People quickly forget how hard 5*'s were to get when first introduced. Now they are abundant and shards are everywhere. 6*'s will be the same way and they'll start having more ways to get them. Progress in this game is a long haul scope unless you have a ton of money to drop much like COWhale. Act 6 isn't going anywhere and you have time to grow into it. We can't even R3 a 6* yet and you all want them to be all over the place. We couldn't even R5 a 5* until the end of act 5. Let the game progress or win the lottery and dump it all into Cavalier crystals.
  • LeNoirFaineantLeNoirFaineant Posts: 4,686 ★★★★★
    DrZola said:

    Well...

    ...have to change my tune on the Cull crystals a bit.



    Only fair to post the winners along with the bums. Decent 5*’s are available...once per annum with decent unit burn.

    Dr. Zola

    Congrats! She is amazing.
  • rohitbhati110rohitbhati110 Posts: 22
    I really think, it was bad move adding rarity in 6.2.
    Because Community doesn't have luck for good champions for specific class.
    Even if summoners have luck on champions, they are stuggling on gold to rank up.

    For Kabam, If you guys are focusing on increasing difficulty of content, Either reduce upgrade cost of 5* and 6* champions OR start gold realms quest for specific days of every weekend.
    During dungeons, Summoners still have less issues with Gold but other 15 days are nightmare.

    PS: People playing arena, don't comment saying start playing arena. Arena is too time consuming, Not everyone have time to play arena.
  • TyEdgeTyEdge Posts: 213
    @DrZola Great point. That's been my main complaint with this month's event. In many respects, I won the big prizes - a quarter of a t2a and a 5-star skill awakening gem (no one to use it on - Blade is awakened, no Aegon or other new champs). It still feels bad to open the other crystals and get 10,000 gold, half a 4-star, or part of a t4cc that's going to overflow. In past events, Kabam did a slightly better job delineating between categories of player. It feels like we should've had a tier of crystal with 5-star shards, 6-star shards, t2a frags, t5b frags, and a rare 5-star awakening gem. With higher costs to obtain, summoners wouldn't get too many spins, but would almost certainly get something usable. It'd also help the miserable crystal bottleneck this month compared to last month. I know the bounties were excessive, but I was grateful for the opportunity, and I earned lots of arena fodder with those weekly crystal pulls.

    The control over outcomes manifests in crystals too. When I get in a rut of bad champs, a real malaise sets in. The two things that pull me out are pulling a great champ that I want to rank, or having a target that I'm working towards in terms of progress (like grinding the t2a to take a specific champ to r4). Luckily, my last pull was amazing (my first since the Blade crystals) and it gave me some new opportunities.
  • PP85PP85 Posts: 5
    with 13 pages of comments here, forgive me if i've missed this question being asked/answered previously. but with the requirements designed to make the gated paths easier, how does this work with the 4 x 6* gates? and indeed 6* gates in general
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