Summoner Sigil - Discussion Thread

Luckylefty01 · July 2019

Worknprogress said:

Luckylefty01 said:
One thing Kabam should change their collective mind on is the added inventory space. No one should have to pay to keep important resources from expiring. I've watched 3 mystic t4cc just disappear due to being capped and not being able to sell them for t5cc or gold. I'm not F2P but I respect those that are and there grind. However, I will not be subscribing to this upcoming change after the free trial we all get on Aug 6. And to those that will stay with the subscription cool to you folks no hate from me keep doing what you do.
You can trade in those t4cc for a crystal to get one of the other classes. Even if you're capped on those classes, no one said you have to open that crystal right away

I have stopped opening AQ crystals due to being maxed out on all but 2 classes for some time now. And I honestly forgot about the trade-in. That does not mean that we should have to pay for an inventory upgrade that we all have been asking Kabam to put in the game for the last 2 years.

Demonzfyre · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?

Begging for something doesn't mean its going to come to you for free. Tell me why we shouldn't have to pay for them. And give a good reason. Just saying "because we asked for it" or "it's digital content that doesn't cost anything" isn't a good reason.

Worknprogress · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?

Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?

digital-SOB · July 2019

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
And all 3 of those things are ALREADY perks to things in game.. Why is it so hard to understand this. You haev a perk of inventory that increased to your current limit, you already have energy, you already have ways to trade in for everything in the black market, the sub just makes it better.

The problem is you want a cut of the new service. Its like having 80% but not liking the game offering 90% of something for a fee unless they bump the free up to 85%.

Um, no. None of these are standard in game wtf
1 Inventory cap have been same for years, not standard in game.
2 Market is not available in game as standard.
3 Energy timer is not 5 mins.

Pgal · July 2019

So let me get this straight:

Kabam introduced item inventory caps because of performance issues, but we can have increased item inventory cap if we pay?

Will you invest that money in new servers?

Tireck20 · July 2019

Ok kabam, sigil summoner is like all another games call "elite pass/ elite royale/ battle pass and more games...
The point is, i know is a bussiness but you really are don't thinking in your F2P players, and i know they are more % than your P2W, the game is support for the players who buy offers, etc i know it too, but to be more famous and attract more people you need the massive players (F2P) so if you want be fair with all your players you need to add one important thing about "sigil" is the way to buy the offer every month, make posible to the people buy it with real money like you said or with units like 1k or 1.2k every month if you want, the rewards are ok, but be fair with all players,
With $10 you can buy it yes and make some challenger to the F2P can buy it too like saving units only for buy the "sigil" pass every month, i know if you make it many players will can buy and promove the game more, but if you make a new distance between F2P and P2W will be a bad idea in the long time.
So the point is the rewards are ok, you will be able to listen your players and maybe change some rewards or some requirements to get it, but the important point is make the offer for all, if you haven't units you will recharge for buy it with $10, or you will buy it with units like many games have the optión, be fair with all of us please and thank you

Sorry for my english.

Lormif · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
And all 3 of those things are ALREADY perks to things in game.. Why is it so hard to understand this. You haev a perk of inventory that increased to your current limit, you already have energy, you already have ways to trade in for everything in the black market, the sub just makes it better.

The problem is you want a cut of the new service. Its like having 80% but not liking the game offering 90% of something for a fee unless they bump the free up to 85%.
Um, no. None of these are standard in game wtf
1 Inventory cap have been same for years, not standard in game.
2 Market is not available in game as standard.
3 Energy timer is not 5 mins.

Huh?
You have an inventory it is capped at X for a subscription you get it for x+20%
Everything in the market you already have the ability to trade in for now, just at an increased cost.
The energy timer is 6m, for an additional perk you get it for 5m

You seem to want to get X+20 and the perk to be x+30. Just because that is what you want does not mean that you currently are missing the baseline of the perk.

Worknprogress · July 2019

Luckylefty01 said:

Worknprogress said:

Luckylefty01 said:
One thing Kabam should change their collective mind on is the added inventory space. No one should have to pay to keep important resources from expiring. I've watched 3 mystic t4cc just disappear due to being capped and not being able to sell them for t5cc or gold. I'm not F2P but I respect those that are and there grind. However, I will not be subscribing to this upcoming change after the free trial we all get on Aug 6. And to those that will stay with the subscription cool to you folks no hate from me keep doing what you do.
You can trade in those t4cc for a crystal to get one of the other classes. Even if you're capped on those classes, no one said you have to open that crystal right away
I have stopped opening AQ crystals due to being maxed out on all but 2 classes for some time now. And I honestly forgot about the trade-in. That does not mean that we should have to pay for an inventory upgrade that we all have been asking Kabam to put in the game for the last 2 years.

I'm not saying that anyone SHOULD have to pay for an inventory increase but the fact is that currently if they want one they will.

Wanting something and it being owed to you are vastly different. It's something that people have wanted for a long time. They've now been given an avenue to obtain it. If they aren't willing to use that avenue, they obviously didn't want it that bad or need it as much as they thought.

digital-SOB · July 2019

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?

You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

Werewrym · July 2019

xNig said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
Tbf using energy wisely is part of the game. As of last week, I’ve spent 0 units on energy refills (all were banked from in the previous month), done EQ from beginner to Uncollected, finished Heroic Masters and Epic side quests. So energy is definitely not an issue with monthly quests. Lowering the energy costs does nothing as most players tend to finish their quests early.

Anyway, back to the topic, lowering energy refresh timers just means giving people more 16.7% more energy per month, which translates to a couple of energy refills. Isn’t it the exact same thing?

Similarly, by allowing players to purchase 1 Featured 5* for 11k instead of 15k saves them 4k shards.

If you couple this with the conversion of 4* shards that converts 2k 4* shards to 1k 5* Shards 3x monthly (it’s actually only a net increase of 1000 - 255x2 = 490 per conversion), its an increase of availability of 490 x 3 = Approx 1500 5* shards.

So in effect, paying for the subscription either saves you 5.5k 5* shards monthly, or gives you 5.5k shards monthly, depending on how you view it.

Neither of these is “game changing” per se.

I'd agree that nothing here is really "game changing." I am of the opinion that the method by which the end goal is reached is just as important as the end goal itself. I don't believe that reducing the cost of crystals or reducing energy refresh times should be behind a paywall. If they want to give players more shards and energy on a weekly basis from a subscription, fine, but I'm not a fan of reducing the purchasing price of crystals or reducing energy refresh times for people who want to spend.

And obviously this is just my opinion, so I'm not asking anyone to agree, I just don't like this new route.

Lormif · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.

Worknprogress · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If they're not going before 5pm they aren't actually a customer.

Worknprogress · July 2019

They would be a potential customer and you as that business owner would have to weigh the costs of being open for additional time vs the potential increased revenue.

Kabam is weighing how much additional revenue they can get from people already spending or those that don't typically spend but might for this against losing people that get irrationally upset

Werewrym · July 2019

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
what is the difference between purchasing shards and reducing the cost in a limited way? If I can buy a 5* crystal for 1500 units, what the the difference between that and lowering the cost of a 5* crystal to no shards for 1500 units one time? The end result is the exact same.

Now if it was unlimited reduction I would agree with you, but it is once every 2 weeks for the featured crystal.

There is a difference between reducing crystal cost as part of a subscription and offering more shards in an offer. I'll grant that the end goal is essentially the same, but the method by which that is obtained IS different.

Rampageur · July 2019

Dangle a carrot to a Donkey and it will do anything for you. Kabam now definitely inspired by Marvel Future Fight's Tony Stark's monthly package of $3.49. The only thing they're going to lose is the player satisfaction

Lormif · July 2019

Haji_Saab said:

LeNoirFaineant said:

Haji_Saab said:
My only problem with this is that the QoL improvements should just be added to the game regardless.

Isn't that kind of the point of the subscription though? No one would get this for a few shards and they aren't about to offer significant items like 6*s and T5 Basics for $10. So if it weren't QoL improvements, what should be in the subscription?

Of course you can monetise everything. For example, reduce t2a stash to 6 and pay to have a limit of 8 - 12. All of these are subjective limits.

Its a spectrum between Being grateful to Kabam for letting us play the game for free to being absolutely incensed that anything cost anything. What I see is a shift on that spectrum towards the former where more common sense changes are / will be placed in premium category rather than F2P category.

Except they are not reducing anything to sell it back to you. If they did that you would rightfully be upset, here is just an "I want more for free" attitude.

Lormif · July 2019

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
what is the difference between purchasing shards and reducing the cost in a limited way? If I can buy a 5* crystal for 1500 units, what the the difference between that and lowering the cost of a 5* crystal to no shards for 1500 units one time? The end result is the exact same.

Now if it was unlimited reduction I would agree with you, but it is once every 2 weeks for the featured crystal.
There is a difference between reducing crystal cost as part of a subscription and offering more shards in an offer. I'll grant that the end goal is essentially the same, but the method by which that is obtained IS different.

Sure the method is but the end effect is what matters, not the method.

Werewrym · July 2019

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
what is the difference between purchasing shards and reducing the cost in a limited way? If I can buy a 5* crystal for 1500 units, what the the difference between that and lowering the cost of a 5* crystal to no shards for 1500 units one time? The end result is the exact same.

Now if it was unlimited reduction I would agree with you, but it is once every 2 weeks for the featured crystal.
There is a difference between reducing crystal cost as part of a subscription and offering more shards in an offer. I'll grant that the end goal is essentially the same, but the method by which that is obtained IS different.
Sure the method is but the end effect is what matters, not the method.

I don't think that most people would agree with this statement.

digital-SOB · July 2019

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.

Everyone who has downloaded the game is a customer, maybe not a spender. See my earlier post explaining that F2P are as important if not more than spenders. F2P people make up most of this game and since how many downloads an app has directly effects App Store presence and income they are def customers.

Demonzfyre · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

Lol actually this would make complete sense. Staying open longer means costs of running a business goes up. In fact this is a standard business practice pretty much anywhere you go.

Lormif · July 2019

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.
Everyone who has downloaded the game is a customer, maybe not a spender. See my earlier post explaining that F2P are as important if not more than spenders. F2P people make up most of this game and since how many downloads an app has directly effects App Store presence and income they are def customers.

How many downloads has no impact on income. app store presence sure, but trying to claim that F2P are more important or equal to the spenders makes no sense. and no they are not customers:

cus·tom·er
/ˈkəstəmər/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person or organization that buys goods or services from a store or business.

Onmix · July 2019

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.

Alright I’ve seen that many times in this thread.
So let me get this straight. You’re saying since someone is f2p they are not a costumer. So their opinions matter less? They don’t have the right to post their opinions? The right to request changes?

P2W do have those rights? So all it takes for you to accept someone’s comments as valid is a receipt ?

Stop looking down on F2P as if they have lesser value.
Nobody here, wether they are spending or not, have any rights, since we don’t own anything. So if we’re going to talk about not being entitled better include everybody.

Lormif · July 2019

Onmix said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.
Alright I’ve seen that many times in this thread.
So let me get this straight. You’re saying since someone is f2p they are not a costumer. So their opinions matter less? They don’t have the right to post their opinions? The right to request changes?

P2W do have those rights? So all it takes for you to accept someone’s comments as valid is a receipt ?

Stop looking down on F2P as if they have lesser value.
Nobody here, wether they are spending or not, have any rights, since we don’t own anything. So if we’re going to talk about not being entitled better include everybody.

Where did I say their opinions matter less? But yes from a business sense yes they do, they do have less value from a monetization stand point.

Lormif · July 2019

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
what is the difference between purchasing shards and reducing the cost in a limited way? If I can buy a 5* crystal for 1500 units, what the the difference between that and lowering the cost of a 5* crystal to no shards for 1500 units one time? The end result is the exact same.

Now if it was unlimited reduction I would agree with you, but it is once every 2 weeks for the featured crystal.
There is a difference between reducing crystal cost as part of a subscription and offering more shards in an offer. I'll grant that the end goal is essentially the same, but the method by which that is obtained IS different.
Sure the method is but the end effect is what matters, not the method.
I don't think that most people would agree with this statement.

Not in all things, but in this it does.

Werewrym · July 2019

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

Lormif said:

Werewrym said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Market = Free things due to lower costs
Energy = Free energy refills

Out of the 3 things you mentioned, 2 are free stuffs and inventory perk is NOT a QoL change.

If you’re sitting at maxed inventory, even doubling it will cause you to max it out eventually. Then it’s the same story all over again. It’s a resource management problem that people can’t seem to balance.

Players who are unwilling to pay for it just want a piece of the pie that they can see but can’t touch.
I think the question is more whether should these types of things exist behind a paywall. The way I see it energy refills vs reducing energy refresh time are two very different things. One of them I'm okay with in a package the other I'm not. Same goes for the market, more shards vs reducing the purchasing price of crystals are two very different things. One of them I'm fine being in an offer, the other I'm not.

The same goal may be achieved in the end, but the method by which they achieve that goal is what I do not like.
what is the difference between purchasing shards and reducing the cost in a limited way? If I can buy a 5* crystal for 1500 units, what the the difference between that and lowering the cost of a 5* crystal to no shards for 1500 units one time? The end result is the exact same.

Now if it was unlimited reduction I would agree with you, but it is once every 2 weeks for the featured crystal.
There is a difference between reducing crystal cost as part of a subscription and offering more shards in an offer. I'll grant that the end goal is essentially the same, but the method by which that is obtained IS different.
Sure the method is but the end effect is what matters, not the method.
I don't think that most people would agree with this statement.
Not in all things, but in this it does.

And that is where we disagree.

Onmix · July 2019

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.
Everyone who has downloaded the game is a customer, maybe not a spender. See my earlier post explaining that F2P are as important if not more than spenders. F2P people make up most of this game and since how many downloads an app has directly effects App Store presence and income they are def customers.
How many downloads has no impact on income. app store presence sure, but trying to claim that F2P are more important or equal to the spenders makes no sense. and no they are not customers:

cus·tom·er
/ˈkəstəmər/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person or organization that buys goods or services from a store or business.

It came after mine but here you said it.
I’m not trying to pick a fight but I don’t think attacking someone for being f2p is wise.

In the end even if you spend Kabam doesn’t owe you anything. And nothing you buy is actually yours.

They need both sides of the player base so it’s in their best interest to try and get both happy.

There are a few that say they have spent and don’t think the sigil is 100% right.

Of course I’d like to get everything there for free but I understand it’s not possible and they need to charge. It’d be great though if they read some of the comments and gave 1 or 2 of this perks for free and expanded them for the subscription.

Will everybody be happy? No
Will most be happy? Probably not.

But they will have a much more solid argument to why they are doing it (although they of course don’t need it).

TheTalents · July 2019

@TheVyrus

TheTalents said:
Most people that are complaining are not F2p so stop with the narrative that everyone complaining doesn't spend on the game. Its disingenuous to get your point out and shame people for not spending. All we're saying is that specifically more inventory space, less energy, and gold should be offered for free in our opinion. I don't understand the contempt for people wanting that. I'm not f2P at all but have been wanting this added as they have done so in the past.

The problem is that all of those things requires software engineers to create and implement. I can promise you those engineers do not work for free, they require compensation. The testers also require compensation. Moderators require compensation. Bandwidth costs money. Licensing costs money. I can go on but I think the point is made.
While Kabam is making money already, they are spending a tremendous amount for these changes. As a business they need to recover that cost and gain a profit or they go out of business. They are not forcing the purchase, just offering it. If you really want this QOL change you spend if not, let it go.

Learn how to read bro, I'm a spender. This offer isn't good enough for my 10 bucks every month. Also, I really just want the inventory space for everyone. My problem is people directly getting mad about f2p players wanting life convenience changes added to the game. People jumping on the bandwagon because they spend do not see the bigger picture at all. Hence why they didn't see Kabam's 6 star gates coming for 6.2 because they allowed to 4 star gates to ride. Understand the precedent you are setting by paying for things that should be added naturally with game progression.

Lormif · July 2019

Onmix said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Worknprogress said:

digital-SOB said:

xNig said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:

Lormif said:

digital-SOB said:
Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?

We’ve begged for these changes for years to be standard parts of the game.
Now tell me why should we have to pay for them?
Tell us why you shouldn't besides that you don't want to. If you go to the store and beg them for a new playstation for years, do you feel there's a period of time that once it passes you are now owed a playstation?
You just want to argue, it’s cool I love debates. Let’s say I run a business, my customers have complained that since I close at 5pm and they don’t get of work til 5pm, it would really be great for me to stay open til 6pm. Then I said “ok I’ll do it but you have to pay a monthly subscription of 9.99”
My customers would flip me the bird.

If you are free to play you are not the customer... The customer are those paying..... In your example if those "customers" didnt generate any revenue them fliping you the bird would not matter.
Everyone who has downloaded the game is a customer, maybe not a spender. See my earlier post explaining that F2P are as important if not more than spenders. F2P people make up most of this game and since how many downloads an app has directly effects App Store presence and income they are def customers.
How many downloads has no impact on income. app store presence sure, but trying to claim that F2P are more important or equal to the spenders makes no sense. and no they are not customers:

cus·tom·er
/ˈkəstəmər/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person or organization that buys goods or services from a store or business.
It came after mine but here you said it.
I’m not trying to pick a fight but I don’t think attacking someone for being f2p is wise.

In the end even if you spend Kabam doesn’t owe you anything. And nothing you buy is actually yours.

They need both sides of the player base so it’s in their best interest to try and get both happy.

There are a few that say they have spent and don’t think the sigil is 100% right.

Of course I’d like to get everything there for free but I understand it’s not possible and they need to charge. It’d be great though if they read some of the comments and gave 1 or 2 of this perks for free and expanded them for the subscription.

Will everybody be happy? No
Will most be happy? Probably not.

But they will have a much more solid argument to why they are doing it (although they of course don’t need it).

They do give things for free all the time. Dungeons is a great example of something they gave to everyone for free that allows people to gain champs faster. I never once said they should not give f2p players anything, never once. I stated that from a money standpoint their opinion means less.

here is a question. You have a group of customers and non customers. The customers want you to sell them a stake, ribeye. The non customers want you to give them the ribeye for free and give the paying customers filet for the same price. Is the free peoples opinion going to matter to you as much as the paying customers? no, because at the end of the day it comes down to the money.

TheVyrus · July 2019

TheTalents said:
@TheVyrus

TheTalents said:
Most people that are complaining are not F2p so stop with the narrative that everyone complaining doesn't spend on the game. Its disingenuous to get your point out and shame people for not spending. All we're saying is that specifically more inventory space, less energy, and gold should be offered for free in our opinion. I don't understand the contempt for people wanting that. I'm not f2P at all but have been wanting this added as they have done so in the past.

The problem is that all of those things requires software engineers to create and implement. I can promise you those engineers do not work for free, they require compensation. The testers also require compensation. Moderators require compensation. Bandwidth costs money. Licensing costs money. I can go on but I think the point is made.
While Kabam is making money already, they are spending a tremendous amount for these changes. As a business they need to recover that cost and gain a profit or they go out of business. They are not forcing the purchase, just offering it. If you really want this QOL change you spend if not, let it go.

Learn how to read bro, I'm a spender. This offer isn't good enough for my 10 bucks every month. Also, I really just want the inventory space for everyone. My problem is people directly getting mad about f2p players wanting life convenience changes added to the game. People jumping on the bandwagon because they spend do not see the bigger picture at all. Hence why they didn't see Kabam's 6 star gates coming for 6.2 because they allowed to 4 star gates to ride. Understand the precedent you are setting by paying for things that should be added naturally with game progression.

You miss my point. My point is that the changes require Kabam to spend, therefor they will be looking to recover the money spent and turn a profit. Therefor the changes are not free for the community, period. I have no issue with people choosing to pay for it or not, but the communities sense of entitlement is incorrect. Things cost money, even simple QOL changes, and when a business places a value on those things the consumer chooses if the value is worth their money or not. F2P or not the choice is there for everyone.

I am sorry you disagree, but I do not think that anyone is entitled to these items. There is a cost and value associated with them.

Summoner Sigil - Discussion Thread

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