Quick update for the end of the week: After receiving a lot of feedback here, we went back to look at the data used to make this decision and found that there were certain sources of Loyalty being included that we did not intend to include in our calculations, leading to some pretty inflated values.
We have been hard at work re-tuning the values and exploring our options here. We will have more information and a path forward to share with you all soon.
Still doesn’t address the issue of the purchase limit and I hope to god you are not just taking the 30k loyalty we get a week from compensation in to account because it’s actually almost a 100k value a week with the grey boosts, so put that into your calculator
And I don’t think you guys grasp the idea of what hard work is because this shouldn’t be hard to decide the balance of if you know your game
Sorry, to be clear, purchase limits are part of Tuning as well. We are aware and working on that.
If you plan on lowering the cost of AW potions, and making more available to purchase per day, you better also be increasing the amount of Loyalty earned. The amount of Loyalty we earn in the first place is an absolute joke.
Next question, what about the players that have gone and blown over 200k loyalty on AW potions at hugely inflated prices to try and prepare for next AW season, and got stuff all potions for that price? Hope this now comes into your calculations as well. Cheers
There’s literally only 5 sources of loyalty not including compensation, 2 of them are rng based in crystals and 1 is tied to actually winning wars, not to mention that a lot of alliances only play wars 66% percent of the time at full capacity.
Logically, every single one of the sources of loyalty you name would be reasonable to include in any data mining of average loyalty earning by players. Except one.
There’s literally only 5 sources of loyalty not including compensation, 2 of them are rng based in crystals and 1 is tied to actually winning wars, not to mention that a lot of alliances only play wars 66% percent of the time at full capacity.
Logically, every single one of the sources of loyalty you name would be reasonable to include in any data mining of average loyalty earning by players. Except one.
I don’t disagree with that but even at best the amount available per week would barley cover the 88k you need to buy all the potions and you would have to win all 3 war a week at tier 1 level, get lucky in crystals and play and win in the off season.
There’s literally only 5 sources of loyalty not including compensation, 2 of them are rng based in crystals and 1 is tied to actually winning wars, not to mention that a lot of alliances only play wars 66% percent of the time at full capacity.
Logically, every single one of the sources of loyalty you name would be reasonable to include in any data mining of average loyalty earning by players. Except one.
I don’t disagree with that but even at best the amount available per week would barley cover the 88k you need to buy all the potions and you would have to win all 3 war a week at tier 1 level, get lucky in crystals and play and win in the off season.
I'm not really addressing the costs directly here, I'm just saying since you were asking what they could have miscounted, there's only one thing they could have miscounted, and it is the one you said we shouldn't include.
This would throw off the numbers by enough that all bets are off as to what the intent of the prices actually was, because they would be nowhere near where they were intended to be by calculation.
There’s literally only 5 sources of loyalty not including compensation, 2 of them are rng based in crystals and 1 is tied to actually winning wars, not to mention that a lot of alliances only play wars 66% percent of the time at full capacity.
Logically, every single one of the sources of loyalty you name would be reasonable to include in any data mining of average loyalty earning by players. Except one.
I don’t disagree with that but even at best the amount available per week would barley cover the 88k you need to buy all the potions and you would have to win all 3 war a week at tier 1 level, get lucky in crystals and play and win in the off season.
I'm not really addressing the costs directly here, I'm just saying since you were asking what they could have miscounted, there's only one thing they could have miscounted, and it is the one you said we shouldn't include.
This would throw off the numbers by enough that all bets are off as to what the intent of the prices actually was, because they would be nowhere near where they were intended to be by calculation.
So basically you said the exact same thing I did..
There’s literally only 5 sources of loyalty not including compensation, 2 of them are rng based in crystals and 1 is tied to actually winning wars, not to mention that a lot of alliances only play wars 66% percent of the time at full capacity.
Logically, every single one of the sources of loyalty you name would be reasonable to include in any data mining of average loyalty earning by players. Except one.
I don’t disagree with that but even at best the amount available per week would barley cover the 88k you need to buy all the potions and you would have to win all 3 war a week at tier 1 level, get lucky in crystals and play and win in the off season.
I'm not really addressing the costs directly here, I'm just saying since you were asking what they could have miscounted, there's only one thing they could have miscounted, and it is the one you said we shouldn't include.
This would throw off the numbers by enough that all bets are off as to what the intent of the prices actually was, because they would be nowhere near where they were intended to be by calculation.
So basically you said the exact same thing I did..
I'm not sure how you could equate the answer to a question with the question.
Quick update for the end of the week: After receiving a lot of feedback here, we went back to look at the data used to make this decision and found that there were certain sources of Loyalty being included that we did not intend to include in our calculations, leading to some pretty inflated values.
We have been hard at work re-tuning the values and exploring our options here. We will have more information and a path forward to share with you all soon.
Still doesn’t address the issue of the purchase limit and I hope to god you are not just taking the 30k loyalty we get a week from compensation in to account because it’s actually almost a 100k value a week with the grey boosts, so put that into your calculator
And I don’t think you guys grasp the idea of what hard work is because this shouldn’t be hard to decide the balance of if you know your game
Sorry, to be clear, purchase limits are part of Tuning as well. We are aware and working on that.
Purchase limits AND cooldowns. Come on.
Also try and get more loyalty flowing. We don't get much outside of compensation as it is.
Replacement of Alliance potions with AQ potions is a major disaster. It's ridiculous now. Please revert back to before so thst they can be used in War.
We have at least 1/3 of the alliance considering quitting competitive wars if the announced changes to war potions system are going through as announced and compensation ends. And we are focusing on wars, even finished in Master last season. And yet this may be it despite the promise of better rewards.
Wars in expert tier are simply not sustainable without potions and you can only buy so many of them for units. No one can spend 800 units per war to heal their r4 Hercules or Apocalypse (they can probably do it once, they can MAYBE do it for 12 wars of the season, but two seasons like that? No way).
And if you are in a P1-2 / Master alliance you can't NOT heal, it's not even an option.
The consequence of proposed changes will be fewer alliances and fewer players doing competitive wars (those where you rank champs for attack and defense, boost, switch masteries). Less will be spent on champion crystals for attack and defense, on boosts, on rankup packages. Instead of spending more people will spend less. They simply won't need to spend because wars will be low pressure / itemless, they won't be in alliances that invest in wars.
So overall the spending will most likely go down if you consider everything (boosts / deals / crystals), and not up. And interest in wars will go down as well.
Do consider making wars available to everyone and not to select few. Otherwise even better rewards won't motivate people to play them. This change is very likely to kill or nearly kill the game mode for many.
Time for the start of a new War Season Summoners! Lots going on as this Season we’ve got a Rewards Update, some Loyalty Store changes, and Path Buff Updates along with our regularly scheduled Tactics rotations! So let’s get right into it!
Season 33, best of luck, and may your opponent's Specials always be easy to bait!
March 30th 2022: Loyalty and Glory Store, Node and Tactic Changes go live Season 33 commences on April 13th 2022: AW Rewards Changes go Live
Tactics Updates
New Tactics:
Defense Tactic - Miss-tic Dispersion Whenever a Buff expires or is removed on a Attacker, #Miss-tic Dispersion Defenders have a 100% chance to gain a Miss Passive causing all attacks to Miss for {2} seconds. Intercepting the opponent will remove this Miss Passive. This Miss Passive goes on cooldown for 20 seconds after it expires or is removed. Anytime an Attackers attacks Miss, the Defender gains a Protection Passive, reducing any incoming damage by {1}% for {0} seconds. Max Stacks 3.
Pool: Ebony Maw, Silver Surfer, Sorcerer Supreme, Dragon Man, Mangog, Sasquatch, Tigra, Man-Thing, Mysterio, Longshot, Guillotine 2099, Symbiote Supreme, Black Widow (Claire Voyant), Kitty Pryde, America Chavez, Mordo, Ghost, Vulture, Invisible Woman, Stryfe, Hood, Spider-Man (Miles Morales), Dormammu, Mojo, Super Skrull Tactics By Map New Tactics in Bold
Expert Map: Power Down replaces Slow Your Roll as the Attack Tactic
Attack: Defiance
Defense: Unstoppable Armor - 2
Challenger Map: Pick 1 of 3 (from Attack and Defense) *NEW* Unstoppable Armor replaces Regenerator
Hard Map: Pick 1 of 3 No change to Hard Map Tactics
Attack: Defiance, Power Down, Slow Your Roll
Loyalty Store Changes
We’re making a few changes to the Loyalty Store which are intended to go hand in hand with the Glory Store update coming with AQ Season 9.5. We’re looking to let players get more access to the AW specific potions,
We’re reducing the store reset from once every 2 weeks to once a week.
Introducing Level 4 Team and Single AW Health Potions to the Store.
Reduce the price of Level 2 and 3 AW Team Revives in the Store:
AW team revive level 2 45000 -> 25000
AW team revive level 3 90000 -> 45000
Season Rewards Update
Click or Tap to Enlarge
Node Changes
It’s about that time we are in for another two major path rework we’ve been wanting to do for a while. The first one that we are aiming to breathe some fresh life into is Path 1, the Healing Path. Prior to this, it hasn’t received the attention, and love it deserves. This time though, we are aiming to provide some new fresh defensive placements that focus specifically on how often a Defender can heal to create the threatening defensive placement we hoped for.
For Path 1, the new Nodes are as follows…
Reinvigorated (Fury) - 3 Every time a Regeneration Buff or Passive is activated, if the Defender is not Heal Blocked the Defender gains a dormant Vigor Charge. Once the Defender reaches 10 Vigor Charges they're consumed and the Defender gains a Passive Fury granting +100% Attack for 10 seconds.
Reinvigorated (Unblockable) - 3 Every time a Regeneration Buff or Passive is activated, if the Defender is not Heal Blocked they gain a dormant Vigor Charge. Once the Defender reaches 10 Vigor Charges they're consumed and the Defender gains a Passive Unblockable for 10 seconds.
Personal Space - Regeneration While the Attacker is close to the Defender, the Defender gains a Regeneration Buff every 3 seconds, Regenerating 0.5% of their Max Health each second. Staying far away from the Defender causes these Regeneration effects to gradually fall off.
Masochism Over Time - 3 Every 7 seconds the next Debuff triggered on this Champion is immediately Purified. Each time this effect triggers they gain Regeneration Buff granting 15% of their Max Health over 7 seconds.
Buffet Over Time - 3 Every 7 seconds the next Buff triggered by the Attacker is immediately Nullified. Each time this effect triggers, the Defender will gain a Regeneration Buff granting 15% of their Max Health over 7 seconds.
The nodes affected are the following…
As for the second rework, we wanted to retool the Path 8 to cater better to Cosmic Defenders and Cosmic Attackers specifically. So to help create that threat, we decided to lean into the buff “Rich Get Richer” and use that as the base for the entire lane. Combined with Mystic Ward means that traditional nullify champions will not be the core answer.
For Path 8, the new Nodes players will encounter are as follows…
Rich Get Richer (Fury) - 3 Whichever Champion has more Buffs gains a stacking Passive Fury every 1 second(s), each increasing Attack rating by 15%.
Underhanded Comment - 1 For each Buff on the Defender, the Attacker has their Defensive Ability Accuracy reduced by 10%.
Nodes affected are…
Glory Store Updates
As mentioned above, there's also a Glory Store update coming your way! We normally include this information with news on Alliance Quest Updates (there is one coming soon!), we wanted to get this out to you earlier, since there are changes to the way we're distributing Alliance Potions between the Glory and Loyalty stores.
These changes are going live today, March 30th.
All Stores
Replaced Alliance Healing Potions and Revives with Alliance Quest Healing potions and Revives. Prices remain the same as equivalent.
Reduced price of Gold Crystal
ThroneBreaker
Reduced price of T5CC and increased purchase limit to 2
Reduced price of T5B and increased purchase limit to 10
Reduced price of T4CC Crystals and increased purchase limit to 7
Reduced price of T4CC Class Fragments
Reduced Price of T2A, T4B, T1A
Uncollected + Cavalier
Reduced price of T5B and increased purchase limit to 10
Increased T2A per purchase from 40% to 50%. Prices remain the same
Reduced price of T4CC Crystals and increased purchase limit to 7
Reduced price of T4CC Class Fragments
Reduced Price of T4B, T1A
Pre-Uncollected
Reduced price of T2CC from 90 to 80
Reduced price of T3CC from 150 to 120
Reduced price of T1A and T4CC
Increased T2A per purchase from 10% to 30%. Prices remain the same
@Kabam Miike the gold crystal and the T1A are the same price. The update says reduced price for gold and T1A. Will the price still be reduced? For cavs T1A has been 160 and gold has been 40 units. Please look into this. Thank you
Even if the cost and buy limits are tweaked to be sustainable to the loyalty income(extremely low) we will still be forced to either heal or boost which is a direct downgrade to everyones quality of life in war.
Kabam i using the alliance team spirits to force gamers to spend units in aw. By reducing the glory and loyalty store players have to spend units to heal and revive their attack. Because players in an alliance dont want that the group will have a disadvantage they feel obligated to spend units. Thats what kabam is using so more units will be spend and makes more profit for kabam itself.
There is a solution. Make the heals and the revives with 10%, 25%, 50% 80% instead of 2500, 6500 or 9500 then it is equal for all players. Also make sure 5hat thesex are available in the glory and loyalty store so players can get it by playing the gamecand withnthe glory and loyalty rewards.
If kabam doesnt see this problem i would say lets all skip season 33 to make a statement to kabam that this is the wrong road kabam is taking. Just a thought.
Quick update for the end of the week: After receiving a lot of feedback here, we went back to look at the data used to make this decision and found that there were certain sources of Loyalty being included that we did not intend to include in our calculations, leading to some pretty inflated values.
We have been hard at work re-tuning the values and exploring our options here. We will have more information and a path forward to share with you all soon.
Unless there’s a drastic increase to the quantity of loyalty that players can easily earn - without doing AW initially - or unless loyalty potions are going to cost 50-100 loyalty each then this is going to fall flat.
Moving this to the loyalty store isn’t a problem in and of itself, the issue is how we accrue loyalty, the current price of grey boosts and the potency of potions that are currently on offer. If you’re healing a boosted R3 6*, even the compensation potions packages still take a bit of a hit, let alone if you have to heal a booster R4, which many of us, certainly in high tier AW are going to have to be doing next season.
Unless there’s a drastic increase to the quantity of loyalty that players can easily earn - without doing AW initially - or unless loyalty potions are going to cost 50-100 loyalty each then this is going to fall flat.
Moving this to the loyalty store isn’t a problem in and of itself, the issue is how we accrue loyalty, the current price of grey boosts and the potency of potions that are currently on offer. If you’re healing a boosted R3 6*, even the compensation potions packages still take a bit of a hit, let alone if you have to heal a booster R4, which many of us, certainly in high tier AW are going to have to be doing next season.
Yeah that's the biggest issue here, Kabam can't pretend like cutting the price let's say by 30% would change anything whatsoever, which is what worries us.
We don't have loyalty to buy boosts, let alone buy potions at exorbitant prices. Unless we start getting around 500k loyalty weekly (I'm not joking Here), that's roughly the equivalent of the glory cost for the 6k potions currently, 50k loyalty for 2 potions out 500k loyalty compared to 550 glory out of 5k glory u can get in the upper tiers of AQ for 2 daily 6k potions.
So any tune up Kabam does to the values simply won't be enough to what we had before. And we were pretty dissatisfied with what we had before, and Kabam chose to make it literally 10 times worse.
I simply cannot understand how they came to such a decision to ruin war for us given the energy and money we spend on it.
So you changed the potions in the glory store to alliance quest potions and then took them all out of the store? You can only buy 2 level 3 potions and 2 level 2 potions? That's ridiculous why remove all of them
@Kabam Miike Prices of gold and T1A did not decrease. Is that a typo error or was the gold and T1A actually supposed to be reduced price like post says?
Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt and just hope that this is an oversight of epic proportions rather than a cynical move to monetise high level war.
Ultimately there’s no issue separating the two stores by game mode, it does make sense after a fashion - a store for war and a store for quest.
The issue as I see it is that the only reliable source of loyalty is from arena help and war participation and both pale in comparison to the cost of the various items in the glory store. At present a T1 war win is 18k? Loyalty, a single grey boost costs 10k loyalty.
We’ve talked the issue of potion potency and quantity to death by now but obviously there’s a real need of a drastic overhaul in the potions available and their cost.
Comments
This would throw off the numbers by enough that all bets are off as to what the intent of the prices actually was, because they would be nowhere near where they were intended to be by calculation.
Also try and get more loyalty flowing. We don't get much outside of compensation as it is.
Wars in expert tier are simply not sustainable without potions and you can only buy so many of them for units. No one can spend 800 units per war to heal their r4 Hercules or Apocalypse (they can probably do it once, they can MAYBE do it for 12 wars of the season, but two seasons like that? No way).
And if you are in a P1-2 / Master alliance you can't NOT heal, it's not even an option.
The consequence of proposed changes will be fewer alliances and fewer players doing competitive wars (those where you rank champs for attack and defense, boost, switch masteries). Less will be spent on champion crystals for attack and defense, on boosts, on rankup packages. Instead of spending more people will spend less. They simply won't need to spend because wars will be low pressure / itemless, they won't be in alliances that invest in wars.
So overall the spending will most likely go down if you consider everything (boosts / deals / crystals), and not up. And interest in wars will go down as well.
Do consider making wars available to everyone and not to select few. Otherwise even better rewards won't motivate people to play them. This change is very likely to kill or nearly kill the game mode for many.
the gold crystal and the T1A are the same price. The update says reduced price for gold and T1A. Will the price still be reduced? For cavs T1A has been 160 and gold has been 40 units. Please look into this. Thank you
There is a solution. Make the heals and the revives with 10%, 25%, 50% 80% instead of 2500, 6500 or 9500 then it is equal for all players. Also make sure 5hat thesex are available in the glory and loyalty store so players can get it by playing the gamecand withnthe glory and loyalty rewards.
If kabam doesnt see this problem i would say lets all skip season 33 to make a statement to kabam that this is the wrong road kabam is taking. Just a thought.
Moving this to the loyalty store isn’t a problem in and of itself, the issue is how we accrue loyalty, the current price of grey boosts and the potency of potions that are currently on offer. If you’re healing a boosted R3 6*, even the compensation potions packages still take a bit of a hit, let alone if you have to heal a booster R4, which many of us, certainly in high tier AW are going to have to be doing next season.
Yeah that's the biggest issue here, Kabam can't pretend like cutting the price let's say by 30% would change anything whatsoever, which is what worries us.
We don't have loyalty to buy boosts, let alone buy potions at exorbitant prices. Unless we start getting around 500k loyalty weekly (I'm not joking Here), that's roughly the equivalent of the glory cost for the 6k potions currently, 50k loyalty for 2 potions out 500k loyalty compared to 550 glory out of 5k glory u can get in the upper tiers of AQ for 2 daily 6k potions.
So any tune up Kabam does to the values simply won't be enough to what we had before. And we were pretty dissatisfied with what we had before, and Kabam chose to make it literally 10 times worse.
I simply cannot understand how they came to such a decision to ruin war for us given the energy and money we spend on it.
@Kabam Miike
Prices of gold and T1A did not decrease. Is that a typo error or was the gold and T1A actually supposed to be reduced price like post says?
Ultimately there’s no issue separating the two stores by game mode, it does make sense after a fashion - a store for war and a store for quest.
The issue as I see it is that the only reliable source of loyalty is from arena help and war participation and both pale in comparison to the cost of the various items in the glory store. At present a T1 war win is 18k? Loyalty, a single grey boost costs 10k loyalty.
We’ve talked the issue of potion potency and quantity to death by now but obviously there’s a real need of a drastic overhaul in the potions available and their cost.