At this point i agree on making a poll with the details of the change and say keep the poll up for a month then close it and what ever side has the most is what happens to quake
In-game though, it's really important that it's in-game cause the forum people have already made up their minds clearly. They want to feel special because they used pre-nerf Quake SUCH a big deal and an honor... Lmao
At this point i agree on making a poll with the details of the change and say keep the poll up for a month then close it and what ever side has the most is what happens to quake
In-game though, it's really important that it's in-game cause the forum people have already made up their minds clearly. They want to feel special because they used pre-nerf Quake SUCH a big deal and an honor... Lmao
Just any poll anywhere use twitter all i care lol just something as what ever happens is ill always be on side of nerf as i want to play her again i want her relevant as at her broken stage due to being only a 5 shes just useless
No way so many people said to just phase them out. What’s wrong with making them great but not broken so everyone can use them as 6* and above? Stg this community sometimes. 5* ascended quake and magik are already much behind the meta and when 8* come, they’ll be completely obsolete
Because "me play Quake back in 2016, me special, don't take this away from me Kabam" 💀
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
I think because if not all change content will be done with that lower star than buffed due to they can use a broken stuff so all has to change really
The 5* is irrelevant for most game content nowadays though, healthpools in story content alone are over 600k now, she can't dish out that much.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
I think because if not all change content will be done with that lower star than buffed due to they can use a broken stuff so all has to change really
The 5* is irrelevant for most game content nowadays though, healthpools in story content alone are over 600k now, she can't dish out that much.
People will though i quaked most gauntlet fights with a 5 quake when we had the keys for it so really all rarity needs to change to prevent people playing that rarity unless its a challenge heck if only 6 and 7 had new kit id probs still pick the 5 over the buffed if i need concussion for something
So, I can across this comment on the direction of Quake from @Kabam Miike:
And I couldn’t disagree more with it.
In my opinion, it makes a lot more sense to adjust (nerf) Quake such that she can be reintroduced into the game, rather than phase her out.
I just think that this is such a bad direction to take with any champion.
But what do you think? Would you rather see Quake adjusted and have her become relevant in today’s meta? Or do you agree with Kabam?
I'm not a Quake-r, but she deserves to be a 6 and 7* champ just like all of the champs do. Makes no sense to add her to the game, then make her eventually irrelevant when Kabam can make her a 6* since they're introducing strong and powerful champs to the game anyway. If Herc is a 6*, then Quake should at least be available as a 6* too. After that, they can just add a new tier called "Broken" 😆 and have Quake and Herc up there by themselves lol.
Only adjustment she needs is to have 0 affect on flying champs lol. If they're not touching the ground when her aftershocks hit, then they shouldn't be affected. This might be too much to program, but relax people, it's just a thought.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
I think because if not all change content will be done with that lower star than buffed due to they can use a broken stuff so all has to change really
The 5* is irrelevant for most game content nowadays though, healthpools in story content alone are over 600k now, she can't dish out that much.
People will though i quaked most gauntlet fights with a 5 quake when we had the keys for it so really all rarity needs to change to prevent people playing that rarity unless its a challenge heck if only 6 and 7 had new kit id probs still pick the 5 over the buffed if i need concussion for something
Yeah but let's be real, if you have to sit there for 20 minutes quaking your way through a single fight that isn't really that detrimental for the game's health. This is why almost nobody uses her anymore and why they haven't been desperate about nerfing her.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
I think because if not all change content will be done with that lower star than buffed due to they can use a broken stuff so all has to change really
The 5* is irrelevant for most game content nowadays though, healthpools in story content alone are over 600k now, she can't dish out that much.
People will though i quaked most gauntlet fights with a 5 quake when we had the keys for it so really all rarity needs to change to prevent people playing that rarity unless its a challenge heck if only 6 and 7 had new kit id probs still pick the 5 over the buffed if i need concussion for something
Yeah but let's be real, if you have to sit there for 20 minutes quaking your way through a single fight that isn't really that detrimental for the game's health. This is why almost nobody uses her anymore and why they haven't been desperate about nerfing her.
Yeah for sure but think if people want concussion they will use it even if longer so best to have all versions of quake have physical vuln than just 6 and 7
To be fair, I don't even agree with our POV necessarily. I think that it would be much better for players to have a small adjustment made to Quake so that we can release her, but I have been through enough of these situations to know that my mental health is better off by not making any changes at this time.
This change is pretty small, but it would allow the game team to actually be able to counter Quake in certain content, and allows players to start using her again. IMO, it just makes sense, but I made it clear to the team that unless we have a majority of players saying that they are open to a change, then Quake stays as a 5 Star forever.
Is there any chance of just giving her a different skin (similar to deathless) and being released as a 6 or 7* while the 5* remains unchanged?
No offense but why does that matter so much? Genuine question cause I don't understand what the big deal is with just nerfing the current Quake. She's pretty much useless for most game content nowadays and she's not exactly a trophy champ or anything like that.
IMO, the only effect felt from nerfing Quake would be felt on the business side of things, and Miike alluded to this by mentioning his mental health. While it realistically shouldn't be an issue to nerf her, you also can't deny a non-insignificant portion of the community will be seething at this idea. They'll claim it's just another thing Kabam has done against the players. Seeing this from Kabams perspective, the easiest path by far is to just leave Quake alone and not release her at higher tier rarities.
The alternate solution of only releasing an adjusted Quake at higher levels removes all of the negativity that would be associated with a nerf, while still maintaining the ability to use Quake again at higher tiers. There could be an argument for it being more confusing, but with Deathless Champs, and multiple other characters with multiple versions, I don't see that being a problem.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
To be fair, I don't even agree with our POV necessarily. I think that it would be much better for players to have a small adjustment made to Quake so that we can release her, but I have been through enough of these situations to know that my mental health is better off by not making any changes at this time.
This change is pretty small, but it would allow the game team to actually be able to counter Quake in certain content, and allows players to start using her again. IMO, it just makes sense, but I made it clear to the team that unless we have a majority of players saying that they are open to a change, then Quake stays as a 5 Star forever.
Is there any chance of just giving her a different skin (similar to deathless) and being released as a 6 or 7* while the 5* remains unchanged?
No offense but why does that matter so much? Genuine question cause I don't understand what the big deal is with just nerfing the current Quake. She's pretty much useless for most game content nowadays and she's not exactly a trophy champ or anything like that.
IMO, the only effect felt from nerfing Quake would be felt on the business side of things, and Miike alluded to this by mentioning his mental health. While it realistically shouldn't be an issue to nerf her, you also can't deny a non-insignificant portion of the community will be seething at this idea. They'll claim it's just another thing Kabam has done against the players. Seeing this from Kabams perspective, the easiest path by far is to just leave Quake alone and not release her at higher tier rarities.
The alternate solution of only releasing an adjusted Quake at higher levels removes all of the negativity that would be associated with a nerf, while still maintaining the ability to use Quake again at higher tiers. There could be an argument for it being more confusing, but with Deathless Champs, and multiple other characters with multiple versions, I don't see that being a problem.
I understand, and that's exactly what I want to understand. Why are people so against this idea? I've yet to find a single compelling argument other than "I'm worried they'll gut her kit completely" which is a valid concern but the rest I don't know, just doesn't make sense to me. Why would people feel this is a personal attack against the players if they're quite literally letting us use Quake once again. She's been irrelevant for such a long time now, I just don't get it really.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I mean yeah she wouldn't be able to quake 90% of the matchups like she can right now because the concussion plays a big part in that but I don't think the change from concussion to physical vulnerability would be as detrimental as some people think. It's a change for sure but I don't think it would make a big enough difference to make your argument valid. Agree to disagree 👍
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I mean yeah she wouldn't be able to quake 90% of the matchups like she can right now because the concussion plays a big part in that but I don't think the change from concussion to physical vulnerability would be as detrimental as some people think. It's a change for sure but I don't think it would make a big enough difference to make your argument valid. Agree to disagree 👍
Basically it boils down to the fact that a lot of people don’t read. You’re assuming that people will know that her kit is different as a 6* than it is as a 5*, which, let’s be honest, no they won’t. If they were using her before, they’ll start yelling and screaming and posting about how the champ is bugged and this is another cash-grabbing face-slapping move by kascam.
Plus it would set a precedent that I’m not sure we want to engage with.
It's also interesting that they want these 2 "broken op" champs to be phased out, but they never stopped introducing the terrible useless champs to the higher rarities like Groot, iron Patriot or superior ironman.. I wonder if they will be available as 7*s before a potential buff
That's my main gripe. I want champions that they're introducing into the pool to at least be usable before the touch anyone else. Stop introducing trash that is unusable to the pool when there is so many middle of the road champs that are actually usable, niche or fun that could be there instead.
I'm going to be frank, I can use quake as a 5* to do fights 7*s struggle with, but if champions like Groot, Captain America, ironfist, superior ironman and iron patriot ever get added to the 7* pool. Dang, I'd rather use a 5* anyday.
Bro's still acting like a Quake nerf would take 6 months to design and implement so we would stop getting buffs during that time 💀
They used to take 2-3 months for simple number changes to champs. You realise whenever they alter a champion they have to go through rigorous testing with their own staff, then get put into testing with the CCP. Contrary to the communities beliefs, there is an extensive amount of testing with each hero rebalancing, minor or large.
I never said there wasn't, however thinking this would disrupt the rebalancing program and bring a halt to all the buffs for a few months is ridiculous and very unlikely to happen. They have a team working on rebalancing every month for a reason.
The rebalancing team are exactly who would be working to adjust quake. So yes, it would take time out of and alter their roadmap/schedule.
I'm going to leave it here though, no point going backwards and forwards for eternity. I'm not entirely opposed to a quake change, I'd much rather a new quake like deathless quake and magik. I'd just much rather the champions that are useless and ineffective to be changed first.
The entire purpose of the rebalancing team involves, and see if you can follow me on this one: REBALANCING.
By rebalancing quake and magick, we introduce 2 new champs to the 6 and 7 star roster and make them available for new players to enjoy. It has zero difference from other rebalancing efforts except it has the word “nerf” attached to it. So like an absolute child you cry about the idea of it without actually thinking about what could be gained.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I mean yeah she wouldn't be able to quake 90% of the matchups like she can right now because the concussion plays a big part in that but I don't think the change from concussion to physical vulnerability would be as detrimental as some people think. It's a change for sure but I don't think it would make a big enough difference to make your argument valid. Agree to disagree 👍
Basically it boils down to the fact that a lot of people don’t read. You’re assuming that people will know that her kit is different as a 6* than it is as a 5*, which, let’s be honest, no they won’t. If they were using her before, they’ll start yelling and screaming and posting about how the champ is bugged and this is another cash-grabbing face-slapping move by kascam.
Plus it would set a precedent that I’m not sure we want to engage with.
I'm not assuming people will know, I'm assuming people will have enough common sense to go and read through her abilities when something goes wrong, that's what I do. If I'm wrong in assuming that then I will sit down. You do realize how ridiculous saying "we can't do this because of people who apparently can afford a phone but can't read" sounds though right? Cause I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and hilarious at the same time).
Couldn't they leave the 5-stars and lower versions as the original champion design, then do a tweaked version for the 6-star & 7-star? Kinda like how 2* Hulk, Juggs & Colossus are still the original versions... THAT way people who still use the 5-star (or lower) versions can still fight "the old fashioned way" by challenging themselves when bringing them into harder content. AND new accounts can have the opportunity to get a lower version of the champs and use them like we used to up to Act 5. Doesn't seem that difficult of a thing.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I mean yeah she wouldn't be able to quake 90% of the matchups like she can right now because the concussion plays a big part in that but I don't think the change from concussion to physical vulnerability would be as detrimental as some people think. It's a change for sure but I don't think it would make a big enough difference to make your argument valid. Agree to disagree 👍
Basically it boils down to the fact that a lot of people don’t read. You’re assuming that people will know that her kit is different as a 6* than it is as a 5*, which, let’s be honest, no they won’t. If they were using her before, they’ll start yelling and screaming and posting about how the champ is bugged and this is another cash-grabbing face-slapping move by kascam.
Plus it would set a precedent that I’m not sure we want to engage with.
I'm not assuming people will know, I'm assuming people will have enough common sense to go and read through her abilities when something goes wrong, that's what I do. If I'm wrong in assuming that then I will sit down. You do realize how ridiculous saying "we can't do this because of people who apparently can afford a phone but can't read" sounds though right? Cause I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and hilarious at the same time).
1000% agree it’s ridiculous. But also you’re as much a forum gremlin as I am, you see how many people post on here asking questions with immediately and extremely obvious answers.
And that’s just the people who make the effort to post here. Who knows how many more are on Reddit or just not saying anything while not understanding what’s happening.
Should people do better than that? Yeah, absolutely. Is it a reasonable expectation to think they will? It should be. Will it actually happen? Probably not.
I like the idea of leaving 2-5* Quake as is while also introducing a nerfed 6* version. That way she’ll stay viable, and there’ll still be an option to use her current kit with the lower rarities.
@Kabam Miike is there any reason this wouldn't work?
I don’t think that’s a good solution …
Let’s just accept one of the two scenarios and move on …
Why not? They did that with OG Hulk, 1* is still pre-buff version, they've already done it 🤷♂️
Yeah but 1* and 5* are totally different. You don’t feel the impact of the old kit on the 1* because that rarity is so far away from the 6* rarity, which is the most relevant rarity in the game.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Players would have to adjust to what exactly? Miike said the changes would be minimal, Quake's playstyle would not change, she would still be Quake the changes would simply allow the game team to counter her in different content.
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
They would have to adjust to a new playstyle. Yes even if the style itself does not change, the 5 and 6-star versions would do different things. Take it from the perspective of a Conqueror. My 5-star Quake does one thing but my 6-star Quake does something else. Like @Wicket329 said, it’s not a game-breaking problem but it is a problem.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Again, they wouldn't have to adjust to a new playstyle because the playstyle would remain the same. Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
I totally understand what you’re trying to say, but it’s what you said at the end is what I am afraid of.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
I mean yeah she wouldn't be able to quake 90% of the matchups like she can right now because the concussion plays a big part in that but I don't think the change from concussion to physical vulnerability would be as detrimental as some people think. It's a change for sure but I don't think it would make a big enough difference to make your argument valid. Agree to disagree 👍
Basically it boils down to the fact that a lot of people don’t read. You’re assuming that people will know that her kit is different as a 6* than it is as a 5*, which, let’s be honest, no they won’t. If they were using her before, they’ll start yelling and screaming and posting about how the champ is bugged and this is another cash-grabbing face-slapping move by kascam.
Plus it would set a precedent that I’m not sure we want to engage with.
I'm not assuming people will know, I'm assuming people will have enough common sense to go and read through her abilities when something goes wrong, that's what I do. If I'm wrong in assuming that then I will sit down. You do realize how ridiculous saying "we can't do this because of people who apparently can afford a phone but can't read" sounds though right? Cause I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and hilarious at the same time).
1000% agree it’s ridiculous. But also you’re as much a forum gremlin as I am, you see how many people post on here asking questions with immediately and extremely obvious answers.
And that’s just the people who make the effort to post here. Who knows how many more are on Reddit or just not saying anything while not understanding what’s happening.
Should people do better than that? Yeah, absolutely. Is it a reasonable expectation to think they will? It should be. Will it actually happen? Probably not.
That is true yeah, it just sucks I guess. We can't have nice thing because people are either too lazy or always complaining about everything. Oh well.
To be fair, I don't even agree with our POV necessarily. I think that it would be much better for players to have a small adjustment made to Quake so that we can release her, but I have been through enough of these situations to know that my mental health is better off by not making any changes at this time.
This change is pretty small, but it would allow the game team to actually be able to counter Quake in certain content, and allows players to start using her again. IMO, it just makes sense, but I made it clear to the team that unless we have a majority of players saying that they are open to a change, then Quake stays as a 5 Star forever.
The issue here is a lot of people are skeptical about the nerf so I feel like the only way to actually get more people on board would be posting the full details. I know some people just don't want her nerfed in general cause they like to pretend like they're special because they've been playing the game since 2015 and that's fine to each their own, but I also know some people just don't want her nerfed because they're afraid she'll get gutted completely and not be at Ghost level as you mentioned.
Unfortunate though that "staying as a 5* or 6* forever" is actually an option, no champ in the game should receive that treatment.
Edit: I second the people suggesting an in-game poll, the forums aren't even 50% of the actual playerbase.
Also people need to understand sometimes things have to happen and let it happen look at 12.0 people hated that adaption due to nerfed all the good champs healing usefulness but it was better for it to be than say now we had that change there be way more in that list of nerfs that no one can change
This community has a completely irrational fear and hatred of nerfs and it’s absolutely baffling. Such balance changes are completely normal and oftentimes necessary for longterm health of the game but instead we get a bunch of babies crying and hand wringing over the mere notion of such an option. Its stupid and irrational
To be fair, I don't even agree with our POV necessarily. I think that it would be much better for players to have a small adjustment made to Quake so that we can release her, but I have been through enough of these situations to know that my mental health is better off by not making any changes at this time.
This change is pretty small, but it would allow the game team to actually be able to counter Quake in certain content, and allows players to start using her again. IMO, it just makes sense, but I made it clear to the team that unless we have a majority of players saying that they are open to a change, then Quake stays as a 5 Star forever.
The issue here is a lot of people are skeptical about the nerf so I feel like the only way to actually get more people on board would be posting the full details. I know some people just don't want her nerfed in general cause they like to pretend like they're special because they've been playing the game since 2015 and that's fine to each their own, but I also know some people just don't want her nerfed because they're afraid she'll get gutted completely and not be at Ghost level as you mentioned.
Unfortunate though that "staying as a 5* or 6* forever" is actually an option, no champ in the game should receive that treatment.
Edit: I second the people suggesting an in-game poll, the forums aren't even 50% of the actual playerbase.
Also people need to understand sometimes things have to happen and let it happen look at 12.0 people hated that adaption due to nerfed all the good champs healing usefulness but it was better for it to be than say now we had that change there be way more in that list of nerfs that no one can change
This community has a completely irrational fear and hatred of nerfs and it’s absolutely baffling. Such balance changes are completely normal and oftentimes necessary for longterm health of the game but instead we get a bunch of babies crying and hand wringing over the mere notion of such an option. Its stupid and irrational
I agree, I play other games and it is very weird how this community reacts to nerfs compared to other communities. I mean, there are always people that aren't satisfied with the changes but this community is just straight up terrified of nerfs before they even happen, they won't even give them a chance.
As someone who sternly believes that every champion should be able to exist at every rarity: if Quake will never be a 6-Star without a nerf, then release the nerfed 6-Star.
I would absolutely HATE to see a character in this game actually phased out. I know we can talk about Scarlet Witch, Thor, etc, but how long did that take? And what a different game they arrived to once they were released at a higher rarity.
I agree entirely, I want to see the 6 and 7 star Quake with the nerf. The nerf they mentioned also doesn’t mean anything for her, she would still be VERY broken.
Welp. Pull out that shiny ascended 5* and get to work! There are plenty of other champs that need a rework/buff. Kabam is doing a great job releasing amazing champs/ frustrating champs. Buffing old champs that need it. Why not toss herc in for 7* and Magik. I think it’s perfectly fine having those champs locked away for good 💀.
I’d rather Kabam take this hypothetical time to potentially rework quake and use it to address in game issues like re-parry, AI inconsistencies etc.
Welp. Pull out that shiny ascended 5* and get to work! There are plenty of other champs that need a rework/buff. Kabam is doing a great job releasing amazing champs/ frustrating champs. Buffing old champs that need it. Why not toss herc in for 7* and Magik. I think it’s perfectly fine having those champs locked away for good 💀.
I’d rather Kabam take this hypothetical time to potentially rework quake and use it to address in game issues like re-parry, AI inconsistencies etc.
I don't know why you people keep using this OtHeR ChAmPs nEdD BuFfS argument lol it's like in your heads the words "nerf Quake" means rebalancing program is shutting down for the next 6-12 months and no more buffs in the meantime when in reality Quake would probably get nerfed in a month same way champs get buffed and rebalanced every month.
They could be 7* too if they got nerfed, no idea what's so funny about that lol.
As for the re-parry and AI issues, the rebalancing team isn't in charge of that. You realize they have different people working on different things at the same time and that if they started working on a Quake nerf it wouldn't interfere with anything other people are working on at Kabam? The people in charge of this would be the rebalancing team, surely you don't need me to explain to you what rebalancing team means correct? 💀
To be fair, I don't even agree with our POV necessarily. I think that it would be much better for players to have a small adjustment made to Quake so that we can release her, but I have been through enough of these situations to know that my mental health is better off by not making any changes at this time.
This change is pretty small, but it would allow the game team to actually be able to counter Quake in certain content, and allows players to start using her again. IMO, it just makes sense, but I made it clear to the team that unless we have a majority of players saying that they are open to a change, then Quake stays as a 5 Star forever.
Would it be possible to do some sort of in game vote a la summoners choice where the options are presented to all summoners and they can choose which they prefer?
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Only adjustment she needs is to have 0 affect on flying champs lol. If they're not touching the ground when her aftershocks hit, then they shouldn't be affected. This might be too much to program, but relax people, it's just a thought.
The alternate solution of only releasing an adjusted Quake at higher levels removes all of the negativity that would be associated with a nerf, while still maintaining the ability to use Quake again at higher tiers. There could be an argument for it being more confusing, but with Deathless Champs, and multiple other characters with multiple versions, I don't see that being a problem.
With the 5*, man. Players would have a hard time adjusting, content designers would have to design for different rarities across EQ, SQ, AW etc. Sounds like a nightmare thinking about it, and I haven’t dug deep into it …
Also, they wouldn't have to design anything around the 5* cause the 5* has been irrelevant for a very long time and would only continue to fade into obscurity if they released the nerfed 6* and kept the 5* as is.
Why would people feel this is a personal attack against the players if they're quite literally letting us use Quake once again. She's been irrelevant for such a long time now, I just don't get it really.
I agree with everything you said though.
Again, you’re oversimplifying it. Imagine you implement a node on a 5-star Quake boss and a 6-star Quake boss. The fights would not be exactly the same. Miike mentioned something about taking the Evade away. Imagine a node which punishes the player if Quake evades. The Conqueror fighting a 5-star Quake would have a tricker time fighting Quake than the Paragon fighting a 6-star Quake. This is just a hypothetical scenario but it is a valid scenario.
Best solution is to pick one of the two outcomes.
Both 5* and 6* Quake would do the same thing, hold heavy against the wall and dex let aftershock do the rest. I don't think you're quite getting what I'm trying to explain to you here, Miike literally said the changes are so they can shut her down for other game content whenever they choose to do so. Her kit would barely change, nobody would have to adjust to anything because the changes would be so small you wouldn't even notice them until you go read her abilities and compare them to the old ones.
As for the second part, I get what you're trying to say and to a certain extent I agree but that's a lot of ifs and buts that may never actually happen.
Those ifs and buts tend to cause more bugs, issues and outrage than one would normally expect.
Especially: did nobody test this at Kabam??!
When it comes to play style, I understand it might not change but one instance where Quake is dealing Concussion and the other where she’s dealing Physical Vulnerability are essentially different outcomes to the same play style. So there is an adjustment. How minor or major that is, I’m not sure. But I would prefer to play it safe if I were Kabam.
Overall, it just doesn’t seem like an optimal decision.
Agree to disagree 👍
Plus it would set a precedent that I’m not sure we want to engage with.
By rebalancing quake and magick, we introduce 2 new champs to the 6 and 7 star roster and make them available for new players to enjoy. It has zero difference from other rebalancing efforts except it has the word “nerf” attached to it. So like an absolute child you cry about the idea of it without actually thinking about what could be gained.
You do realize how ridiculous saying "we can't do this because of people who apparently can afford a phone but can't read" sounds though right? Cause I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and hilarious at the same time).
And that’s just the people who make the effort to post here. Who knows how many more are on Reddit or just not saying anything while not understanding what’s happening.
Should people do better than that? Yeah, absolutely. Is it a reasonable expectation to think they will? It should be. Will it actually happen? Probably not.
I’d rather Kabam take this hypothetical time to potentially rework quake and use it to address in game issues like re-parry, AI inconsistencies etc.
They could be 7* too if they got nerfed, no idea what's so funny about that lol.
As for the re-parry and AI issues, the rebalancing team isn't in charge of that. You realize they have different people working on different things at the same time and that if they started working on a Quake nerf it wouldn't interfere with anything other people are working on at Kabam? The people in charge of this would be the rebalancing team, surely you don't need me to explain to you what rebalancing team means correct? 💀