Boy, you sure can tell how the majority of yall weren't around for the 12.0 update. And you guys would definitely hate losing your Hercules crutches and actually have to play the game.
Things this thread is about: Zemo ✅ Kraven ✅ Root ✅ The 12.0 Update ❌ Hercules ❌
No, it's everyone upset about a bug being fixed. Yall really thought being able to prevent sps just by using root was supposed to happen?
Seeing as the devs told CCP beta members that it was working as intended all the way back in November of 2021, and then they failed to include a description of the ability in game or on the forums, and then they built two other champions around the ability, and then they let CCP beta members make videos about the ability without letting them know they'd be fixing it, and then they failed to mention it in Zemo's rebalance or literally anywhere else on the forums, I'd say yeah... and I don't blame them. Why do you?
Boy, you sure can tell how the majority of yall weren't around for the 12.0 update. And you guys would definitely hate losing your Hercules crutches and actually have to play the game.
Things this thread is about: Zemo ✅ Kraven ✅ Root ✅ The 12.0 Update ❌ Hercules ❌
No, it's everyone upset about a bug being fixed. Yall really thought being able to prevent sps just by using root was supposed to happen?
You’re dense and honestly kinda slow, since you’re having a very hard time understanding what the issue here is. Even if you were right and it was actually just a bug the lack of proper communication is MORE THAN ENOUGH to warrant compensation.
Boy, you sure can tell how the majority of yall weren't around for the 12.0 update. And you guys would definitely hate losing your Hercules crutches and actually have to play the game.
Things this thread is about: Zemo ✅ Kraven ✅ Root ✅ The 12.0 Update ❌ Hercules ❌
No, it's everyone upset about a bug being fixed. Yall really thought being able to prevent sps just by using root was supposed to happen?
You’re dense and honestly kinda slow, since you’re having a very hard time understanding what the issue here is. Even if you were right and it was actually just a bug the lack of proper communication is MORE THAN ENOUGH to warrant compensation.
Dude, i genuinely understand your frustrations and am on your side but please don't call other members names. ( I'm not sinless, but it's not getting anyone in your favour)
Yeah, this is becoming disrespectful. It's also not going to change anything. The Devs themselves sent a message saying only one Champ is getting Tickets. So arguing with other Players isn't going to change things. It's entirely up to whether they change their minds or not, but either way, tearing each other apart in the comments isn't helping.
Boy, you sure can tell how the majority of yall weren't around for the 12.0 update. And you guys would definitely hate losing your Hercules crutches and actually have to play the game.
Things this thread is about: Zemo ✅ Kraven ✅ Root ✅ The 12.0 Update ❌ Hercules ❌
No, it's everyone upset about a bug being fixed. Yall really thought being able to prevent sps just by using root was supposed to happen?
Oh fun another blame the players opinion. It should not be the responsibility of the players to go to Trello before ranking up champs, it shouldn’t be the responsibility of players to even come to the forums to know what champs are bugged. Neither communication tool reaches a majority of the player base, Kabam has admitted this time and time again. Heck the Titan crystal polls were on Twitter for this reason. That’s why by it’s a tone deaf argument on every level to see the Trello board used as a justification for not giving RDTs to Zemo. It’s a percentage of a percentage of the player base that even knows what it is. And another percentage that would think to go to that poorly updated tool before a rank up decision.
Kabam knows that this was a fumble, they have even admitted it on their first response. Hopefully it’s not the final one
Boy, you sure can tell how the majority of yall weren't around for the 12.0 update. And you guys would definitely hate losing your Hercules crutches and actually have to play the game.
Things this thread is about: Zemo ✅ Kraven ✅ Root ✅ The 12.0 Update ❌ Hercules ❌
No, it's everyone upset about a bug being fixed. Yall really thought being able to prevent sps just by using root was supposed to happen?
You’re dense and honestly kinda slow, since you’re having a very hard time understanding what the issue here is. Even if you were right and it was actually just a bug the lack of proper communication is MORE THAN ENOUGH to warrant compensation.
Dude, i genuinely understand your frustrations and am on your side but please don't call other members names. ( I'm not sinless, but it's not getting anyone in your favour)
Sorry bout that, I thought those weren’t bad words, my frustration is getting the best of me :,
I agree. It’s not player’s job to search every website and forum for a “supposed bug” as per Kabam. They should find a better way to deliver information that it reaches all player base, may be through an in-game message.
They should issue RDTs for all affected champs due to this root mechanic change.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
I think it’s one thing to have created this platform, but when through their own admission it’s often out of date and not widely known, it’s another thing to treat it like a public communication and paper shield.
Yes it could be a useful tool, but it’s not reliably up to date, and it’s not linked to in game. If those conditions were true I could understand their position, but they aren’t. So the tool is in the spotlight as players are now going to feel impacted negatively by its presence, and because it was held up there as a paper shield it’s going to be torn to shreds.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
People wait for and rely on the accuracy of a rebalance report They view it as the final piece of information they receive before committing to upgrading a champion It's a huge mistake to now compromise the integrity of these rebalance reports imo
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
Perfect and I agree. Efforts were made by them, efforts were made by the player base.
Now issue rank down tickets for Zemo because it is the fair and just thing to do. It rights a wrong, and the two sides can meet in the middle and no one will feel like they were cheated.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
The burden to foster that kind of player/dev relationship and communication is on the company. This kind of decision doesn’t help that. They admitted to several failures in this situation but then fall back to “we put it on the Trello almost 3 months after he was released so no rank down tickets for you”.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it.
I actually think you're drastically understating things - it's not that this wasn't visible for "some" people, it wasn't visible to the majority of players.
That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts.
I agree that it should be kept constructive, something I myself have struggled with doing. But let's be honest, minimal efforts were made. The bare minimum. It was hidden away, not even linked to anywhere else and if you go to Trello now, can you even find it? It's not something consistently used, it's not up to date and most of the things posted there don't even have a description or details...
There's no positive spin for Kabam on this one. Both sides must be willing to meet each other? They "attempted" to communicate something in the most obscure way that THEY don't even regularly use, that's not an attempt to communicate - that's someone grasping for straws to find ANY excuse they can present as saying "We told you all."
Kabam Miike did effectively say "We never communicated this properly, we're sorry, we messed up here. But the change is being implemented." Which, tbh, is appreciated. We can all continue talking in circles about how they should have communicated better, but they've already acknowledged that so let's move past it and hope they take better efforts in the future.
The apology was appreciated, the response though? The community wants RDT for Zemo and Kabam doesn't feel like they should because of a vague post that was made? That, seems a little one-sided and yet you're talking about meeting each other half way.
They can't acknowledge that their efforts to communicate this weren't done properly and then also use "those efforts" as reasoning for why people shouldn't be able to rank their champion down. Come on Kabam, it literally costs you nothing to swallow your pride and make this concession. It's actually kind of a no-brainer for them to do this in efforts to garner some good will after everything that's happened this week.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
The burden to foster that kind of player/dev relationship and communication is on the company. This kind of decision doesn’t help that. They admitted to several failures in this situation but then fall back to “we put it on the Trello almost 3 months after he was released so no rank down tickets for you”.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
That "burden" is on both sides. All too often I've seen people cite transparency, and in the same token complain about their efforts. Communication takes two sides. When one side fails and acknowledges it, that's worth something. Not the expectation that they should have known better. They did make a communication. They realized it fell short and made a direct address from the Devs themselves. Something that doesn't happen often. The Trello board was something that fell short, no doubt. When people are acting like it doesn't even exist, when it's been posted here for months and months, that's not entirely their fault.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
The burden to foster that kind of player/dev relationship and communication is on the company. This kind of decision doesn’t help that. They admitted to several failures in this situation but then fall back to “we put it on the Trello almost 3 months after he was released so no rank down tickets for you”.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
That "burden" is on both sides. All too often I've seen people cite transparency, and in the same token complain about their efforts. Communication takes two sides. When one side fails and acknowledges it, that's worth something. Not the expectation that they should have known better. They did make a communication. They realized it fell short and made a direct address from the Devs themselves. Something that doesn't happen often. The Trello board was something that fell short, no doubt. When people are acting like it doesn't even exist, when it's been posted here for months and months, that's not entirely their fault.
For the most part, I agree. But I really do not understand what you're asking the community to do.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
The burden to foster that kind of player/dev relationship and communication is on the company. This kind of decision doesn’t help that. They admitted to several failures in this situation but then fall back to “we put it on the Trello almost 3 months after he was released so no rank down tickets for you”.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
It’s unclear how much Kabam values it as there are still dedicated bug threads on the forum, including a large one dedicated to Relics that was created in December, after the Trello board went live.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
And you support the company or the people that are now disappointed? You do know rank down tickets are nothing right? The resources spent on the game, real money, is gone and in return we have a champion that is sub par. He didn’t use to be this way, so no matter their effort, why yould you not wish for the people to receive this champion’s resources back in-game? Kabam is losing nothing here… the only ones potentially winning are the players.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
The burden to foster that kind of player/dev relationship and communication is on the company. This kind of decision doesn’t help that. They admitted to several failures in this situation but then fall back to “we put it on the Trello almost 3 months after he was released so no rank down tickets for you”.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
That "burden" is on both sides. All too often I've seen people cite transparency, and in the same token complain about their efforts. Communication takes two sides. When one side fails and acknowledges it, that's worth something. Not the expectation that they should have known better. They did make a communication. They realized it fell short and made a direct address from the Devs themselves. Something that doesn't happen often. The Trello board was something that fell short, no doubt. When people are acting like it doesn't even exist, when it's been posted here for months and months, that's not entirely their fault.
Nobody said they should have known better. When they acknowledge that they failed to communicate, some sort of restitution is required and in this case, RDT for zemo in addition to kraven is warranted.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
And you support the company or the people that are now disappointed? You do know rank down tickets are nothing right? The resources spent on the game, real money, is gone and in return we have a champion that is sub par. He didn’t use to be this way, so no matter their effort, why yould you not wish for the people to receive this champion’s resources back in-game? Kabam is losing nothing here… the only ones potentially winning are the players.
I support both, actually. The company is made of people, just like the Players. All trying to do a job. I don't subscribe to the idea that it's "nothing". Everything in the game represents hours of work. If you're asking me to support RDTs, I don't. I wish they were never programmed. They were introduced for a very specific purpose, and we've never heard the end of them. Everytime they're given, that purpose is misconstrued, and it just feeds people asking for more. I'm not ignorant to the fact that people spent time, energy, and money Ranking Champs. However, it's their product. They have the right to change it as is needed. That much is outlined in the ToS. They're as accommodating as possible in these instances. More than I would be because unless it applies to major changes to a way a Champ is intended to perform, I don't agree it applies. There are no end-user purchases in a game like this. It's not even a purchase for ownership. It's a lease to use their product, and as much as people call them "Kascam" and cry about Bait-And-Switch, and claim precedence, they've shown a consistent ability to take responsibility and make things right whenever they can. That doesn't always translate into giving people EVERYTHING they want. Just as much as they can, as appropriately as they can, without infringing on design constraints. Go ahead, be mad. Just stop and realize they do more than people are letting on when they grab the pitchforks. Not because I'm "pro-Kabam", because it's the truth.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
And you support the company or the people that are now disappointed? You do know rank down tickets are nothing right? The resources spent on the game, real money, is gone and in return we have a champion that is sub par. He didn’t use to be this way, so no matter their effort, why yould you not wish for the people to receive this champion’s resources back in-game? Kabam is losing nothing here… the only ones potentially winning are the players.
I support both, actually. The company is made of people, just like the Players. All trying to do a job. I don't subscribe to the idea that it's "nothing". Everything in the game represents hours of work. If you're asking me to support RDTs, I don't. I wish they were never programmed. They were introduced for a very specific purpose, and we've never heard the end of them. Everytime they're given, that purpose is misconstrued, and it just feeds people asking for more. I'm not ignorant to the fact that people spent time, energy, and money Ranking Champs. However, it's their product. They have the right to change it as is needed. That much is outlined in the ToS. They're as accommodating as possible in these instances. More than I would be because unless it applies to major changes to a way a Champ is intended to perform, I don't agree it applies. There are no end-user purchases in a game like this. It's not even a purchase for ownership. It's a lease to use their product, and as much as people call them "Kascam" and cry about Bait-And-Switch, and claim precedence, they've shown a consistent ability to take responsibility and make things right whenever they can. That doesn't always translate into giving people EVERYTHING they want. Just as much as they can, as appropriately as they can, without infringing on design constraints. Go ahead, be mad. Just stop and realize they do more than people are letting on when they grab the pitchforks. Not because I'm "pro-Kabam", because it's the truth.
This is scary narrative right here and not backed up by anything remotely resembling fair business practices.
When a company makes a mistake, the absolute least they can do is make it right. A clear bait and switch happened, and you know it just as well as everyone else.
I can tell you one thing for certain, my credit card will be turned off for this game until this is resolved in a fair and balanced way and I am betting I will not be alone.
It's not that random. Anyone who frequents the Forum is aware of it. I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for. Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that. You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Listen, you said you’re not a villain, then trust, I play the game since 2015 and have been on the forums since 2017, I never knew about it, it’s got like 9.2k views. This thread has more than double… you gotta trust us that we ain’t lying.
I've been around for 7 and a half years. I'm not new. I was on this Forum, and the last. Both cases, there is a lack or acknowledgement for the efforts they do make. I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure. In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
And you support the company or the people that are now disappointed? You do know rank down tickets are nothing right? The resources spent on the game, real money, is gone and in return we have a champion that is sub par. He didn’t use to be this way, so no matter their effort, why yould you not wish for the people to receive this champion’s resources back in-game? Kabam is losing nothing here… the only ones potentially winning are the players.
Go ahead, be mad. Just stop and realize they do more than people are letting on when they grab the pitchforks. Not because I'm "pro-Kabam", because it's the truth.
Just take a second. Imagine what the forums would look like today if they had given RDT's for both Kraven and Zemo, and then promised to make all future announcements into detailed forum posts. The way things are going is not due to the players misjudgment of Kabam. It's not due to the players at all.
That "burden" is on both sides. All too often I've seen people cite transparency, and in the same token complain about their efforts. Communication takes two sides. When one side fails and acknowledges it, that's worth something. Not the expectation that they should have known better. They did make a communication. They realized it fell short and made a direct address from the Devs themselves. Something that doesn't happen often. The Trello board was something that fell short, no doubt. When people are acting like it doesn't even exist, when it's been posted here for months and months, that's not entirely their fault.
You're a smart person, which is how I know you're intentionally being obtuse and trying to obfuscate the point.
People aren't JUST dogging on Trello, and even those who are, are doing so with purpose. Because the real issue here is the decision to not issue RDT for Zemo.
Kabam acknowledged that their communication was bad and they could have done better. The acknowledged that they intentionally didn't communicate it through other means and that this was a mistake. They promised to do better.
All of that, is amazing. I can't actually stress that enough. That accountability is fantastic and is honestly something they might not have done a couple of years ago. I concede to your point that the player base absolutely needs to give Kabam more props for this.
And, more of the player base probably would.... IF Kabam didn't follow it up in the very next sentence by attempting to use the communication they acknowledge wasn't done properly, as a means of saying "Well, we upheld our side of the bargain and communicated this during the three month period."
That's dealing in bad faith. You know it, I know it, they know it.
You don't like RDT, that's valid. TBH, I don't either. But not a single person has asked you to support them and I don't think a single person here cares whether or not you do.
Fact of the matter is, they do exist whether you support/like them or not and Kabam has set the precedent for their use. So yeah, people will cite precedent, because it's a business practice and you can act like ToS covers Kabam to make any and all decisions they want and we have no power, but businesses have responsibilities to their customers... and you know that.
This IS a change to the character that alters the way they function. It actually doesn't matter if it's a less efficient rotation, it alters the way people use Zemo.
RDT are actually pretty rare. They're not issued frequently because Kabam doesn't make mistakes like this often. Do I think they should get celebrated more frequently? Yes. Humanity is polarized towards the negative and we focus more on things we don't like... it's not fair but it's why the more vocal things are almost always complaints.
But when Kabam does make a mistake with a champion and then alter them in a way that changes their functionality, a RDT is warranted. Kabam acknowledges that, they're just trying to hold to line that separates Zemo and Kraven. "Zemo's issue was referenced... we owe you nothing. Kraven though, yeah we never referenced that so here's a RDT." Which might be valid, if their attempts to communicate with us was in any way efficient - which they themselves admitted was not the case.
Let's not pretend that issuing a RDT is some big company breaking moment that's going to bring Kabam to their knees or impact their PNL. You don't subscribe to the stance that "it's nothing" because it's work for someone to do. That's fair, I concede that point, but when players say "it's nothing" they're referencing the fact that many of them spent time, effort and/or money getting Zemo to that rank, only to have the product changed on them. So why is all of their time/effort/money less valued? "It's nothing" is a reference to the fact that it's minimal effort required from Kabam to make the situation right. But you already know that's what it means.
Someone has to put in the work to send out an in game E-Mail with champion specific RDT? Someone has to program those and make sure they can't work on other champions? You're absolutely right. But that falls on the company, because it was their mistake and oversight.
Kabam can either stand by their acknowledgement that the communication wasn't done properly, which gives credence to the argument that the players should be compensated because they weren't actually informed. Or Kabam stands by their belief that adequate communication was made and it was done in a timely manner, thus they upheld their end of the bargain and have no responsibility to make the players whole because "it was brought up during the rebalancing period and it's the players fault for not checking the notes."
Comments
It's also not going to change anything. The Devs themselves sent a message saying only one Champ is getting Tickets. So arguing with other Players isn't going to change things.
It's entirely up to whether they change their minds or not, but either way, tearing each other apart in the comments isn't helping.
Kabam knows that this was a fumble, they have even admitted it on their first response. Hopefully it’s not the final one
They should issue RDTs for all affected champs due to this root mechanic change.
😂
I think it's getting more hate than necessary. Granted, they've had issues keeping it updated, and it's been a work in progress, however it's what we asked for.
Players have been asking for years for a place to post issues that are being reported or investigated. This was an effort to accommodate that.
You know, communication slipping is one thing. I respect when people point that out. It's another to berate the efforts they actually make. Regardless of your feelings, they're still putting in effort.
Yes it could be a useful tool, but it’s not reliably up to date, and it’s not linked to in game. If those conditions were true I could understand their position, but they aren’t. So the tool is in the spotlight as players are now going to feel impacted negatively by its presence, and because it was held up there as a paper shield it’s going to be torn to shreds.
They view it as the final piece of information they receive before committing to upgrading a champion
It's a huge mistake to now compromise the integrity of these rebalance reports imo
What is a Trello?
I'm not suggesting people praise Trello, or Kabam. I understand the issue is it wasn't visible for some people. I get it. That doesn't mean we need to take a deuce on the fact that they did make efforts. Through a venue that people asked for. Crossed wires, failure in communication, sure.
In order for communication to take place, both sides must be willing to meet each other. Not just demands.
Now issue rank down tickets for Zemo because it is the fair and just thing to do. It rights a wrong, and the two sides can meet in the middle and no one will feel like they were cheated.
Trello is getting the heat because they put a spotlight on the issue by pointing to it as the main reason for not issuing RDTs.
I actually think it’s important for everyone to express their confusion about Trello. The response implies Kabam puts a lot of value in it and the community clearly does not. That’s a major problem and the more people that point it out, the easier it is for Miike and Jax to point out to the dev team.
There's no positive spin for Kabam on this one. Both sides must be willing to meet each other? They "attempted" to communicate something in the most obscure way that THEY don't even regularly use, that's not an attempt to communicate - that's someone grasping for straws to find ANY excuse they can present as saying "We told you all."
Kabam Miike did effectively say "We never communicated this properly, we're sorry, we messed up here. But the change is being implemented." Which, tbh, is appreciated. We can all continue talking in circles about how they should have communicated better, but they've already acknowledged that so let's move past it and hope they take better efforts in the future.
The apology was appreciated, the response though? The community wants RDT for Zemo and Kabam doesn't feel like they should because of a vague post that was made? That, seems a little one-sided and yet you're talking about meeting each other half way.
They can't acknowledge that their efforts to communicate this weren't done properly and then also use "those efforts" as reasoning for why people shouldn't be able to rank their champion down. Come on Kabam, it literally costs you nothing to swallow your pride and make this concession. It's actually kind of a no-brainer for them to do this in efforts to garner some good will after everything that's happened this week.
They did make a communication. They realized it fell short and made a direct address from the Devs themselves. Something that doesn't happen often.
The Trello board was something that fell short, no doubt. When people are acting like it doesn't even exist, when it's been posted here for months and months, that's not entirely their fault.
I don't subscribe to the idea that it's "nothing". Everything in the game represents hours of work.
If you're asking me to support RDTs, I don't. I wish they were never programmed. They were introduced for a very specific purpose, and we've never heard the end of them.
Everytime they're given, that purpose is misconstrued, and it just feeds people asking for more.
I'm not ignorant to the fact that people spent time, energy, and money Ranking Champs. However, it's their product. They have the right to change it as is needed. That much is outlined in the ToS.
They're as accommodating as possible in these instances. More than I would be because unless it applies to major changes to a way a Champ is intended to perform, I don't agree it applies.
There are no end-user purchases in a game like this. It's not even a purchase for ownership. It's a lease to use their product, and as much as people call them "Kascam" and cry about Bait-And-Switch, and claim precedence, they've shown a consistent ability to take responsibility and make things right whenever they can. That doesn't always translate into giving people EVERYTHING they want. Just as much as they can, as appropriately as they can, without infringing on design constraints.
Go ahead, be mad. Just stop and realize they do more than people are letting on when they grab the pitchforks. Not because I'm "pro-Kabam", because it's the truth.
When a company makes a mistake, the absolute least they can do is make it right. A clear bait and switch happened, and you know it just as well as everyone else.
I can tell you one thing for certain, my credit card will be turned off for this game until this is resolved in a fair and balanced way and I am betting I will not be alone.
People aren't JUST dogging on Trello, and even those who are, are doing so with purpose. Because the real issue here is the decision to not issue RDT for Zemo.
Kabam acknowledged that their communication was bad and they could have done better. The acknowledged that they intentionally didn't communicate it through other means and that this was a mistake. They promised to do better.
All of that, is amazing. I can't actually stress that enough. That accountability is fantastic and is honestly something they might not have done a couple of years ago. I concede to your point that the player base absolutely needs to give Kabam more props for this.
And, more of the player base probably would.... IF Kabam didn't follow it up in the very next sentence by attempting to use the communication they acknowledge wasn't done properly, as a means of saying "Well, we upheld our side of the bargain and communicated this during the three month period."
That's dealing in bad faith. You know it, I know it, they know it.
You don't like RDT, that's valid. TBH, I don't either. But not a single person has asked you to support them and I don't think a single person here cares whether or not you do.
Fact of the matter is, they do exist whether you support/like them or not and Kabam has set the precedent for their use. So yeah, people will cite precedent, because it's a business practice and you can act like ToS covers Kabam to make any and all decisions they want and we have no power, but businesses have responsibilities to their customers... and you know that.
This IS a change to the character that alters the way they function.
It actually doesn't matter if it's a less efficient rotation, it alters the way people use Zemo.
RDT are actually pretty rare. They're not issued frequently because Kabam doesn't make mistakes like this often. Do I think they should get celebrated more frequently? Yes. Humanity is polarized towards the negative and we focus more on things we don't like... it's not fair but it's why the more vocal things are almost always complaints.
But when Kabam does make a mistake with a champion and then alter them in a way that changes their functionality, a RDT is warranted. Kabam acknowledges that, they're just trying to hold to line that separates Zemo and Kraven. "Zemo's issue was referenced... we owe you nothing. Kraven though, yeah we never referenced that so here's a RDT." Which might be valid, if their attempts to communicate with us was in any way efficient - which they themselves admitted was not the case.
Let's not pretend that issuing a RDT is some big company breaking moment that's going to bring Kabam to their knees or impact their PNL. You don't subscribe to the stance that "it's nothing" because it's work for someone to do. That's fair, I concede that point, but when players say "it's nothing" they're referencing the fact that many of them spent time, effort and/or money getting Zemo to that rank, only to have the product changed on them. So why is all of their time/effort/money less valued? "It's nothing" is a reference to the fact that it's minimal effort required from Kabam to make the situation right. But you already know that's what it means.
Someone has to put in the work to send out an in game E-Mail with champion specific RDT? Someone has to program those and make sure they can't work on other champions? You're absolutely right. But that falls on the company, because it was their mistake and oversight.
Kabam can either stand by their acknowledgement that the communication wasn't done properly, which gives credence to the argument that the players should be compensated because they weren't actually informed. Or Kabam stands by their belief that adequate communication was made and it was done in a timely manner, thus they upheld their end of the bargain and have no responsibility to make the players whole because "it was brought up during the rebalancing period and it's the players fault for not checking the notes."
They can't realistically have it both ways.