Morningstar Life Steal Bug Fix

Moosetiptronic · April 2020

Voltolos said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.
Gulk/Bane does benefit anyone who ever had to fight him on a bane node, so it's not really a bad thing for the playerbase

You misunderstand; The description for Gulk, means he should Regen bane damage. They have said this is an exception, but haven't changed his text or bug fixed it. The same is the case with descriptions for flow, Kamala, thing sp3, parry, Ms & bwcv.

Ganesh10a · April 2020

DNA3000 said:

Coreyb516 said:
Any of the devs plan to comment on this and i
Trying to understand how is this a bug in the first place lol
Morningstar's abilities explicitly state that she has a chance to heal 50% of damage she deals. So if she deals 1000 points of damage and the heal triggers you'd expect Morningstar to heal 500 points of health. If she lands an attack for 200 damage you'd expect her to heal for 100 health. If she lands an attack for 10 points of damage you'd expect her to heal only 5 points of health.

So how much health would you expect MS to heal if she lands an attack for zero damage?

Damage dealt is not sams as Damage Taken. With indestructible charges champion doesn't take the damage that doesn't mean the attacks doesn't deal any damage. This is the reason in the first place BWCV and MS was able to Regen. Because they are still dealing the damage. It's just that Champion is not taking them. so it's 100% expected behaviour.

if you fight in power shield node whenever you use a basic attack you will a Number 0. That's because the attackers are dealing ZERO DAMAGE.

Hope that makes it clear.

_matto_ · April 2020

tafre said:

Kabam Zibiit said:
Hey there everyone, we wanted to drop in and weigh in on this again. To confirm, at 5 Souls, Morningstar has a chance to Life Steal 50% of the damage she deals, so she should not gain any health from attacks that deal 0 damage. Her being able to is a bug that we are working on a fix for and have documented in our Bugs and Known Issues thread here. We wanted to let everyone know ahead of time that a fix was coming for this, though it looks like it won't be able to be resolved until the 27.1 update at the earliest, which is currently slated for June. We also wanted to let everyone know that we are passing feedback on this and the Champion as a whole fight along to the rest of the team.
I suggest watching this video before saying that she deals 0 damage. The youtuber gives a very valid and relevant explanation regarding this issue, shoutout to @JaeSylvr

https://youtu.be/gNAOEJXx87k

Champions ability states:

10%-0% health: Dark Match: The Champion gains 5 Indestructible charges, and while he has at least 1 charge he is immune to all damage.

So he is immune to damage but that most certainly does not state that the damage dealt is zero, it is just being ignored since the Champion is immune to damage. The damage is still there, he is just not taking it.

Morningstar still heals when he is hitting Luke Cage when the indestrucrible buff is on him, the damage is still there but he is immune to it because of the buff.

If the description was like the Descructive Feedback node, you guys would have been absolutely correct, the video points this out as well, but you guys are dead wrong about this fix and just trying to make this fight harder and harder every time some convenient and easy accessible counter is popular.

THANK YOU!

Bluuurrrr · April 2020

I think this is kind of stupid, It just seems that as soon as a “bug” pops up that benefits the player it gets fixed extremely fast (in this case I think it was just when they noticed this interaction or at a point where they fancied a bit more money from this fight) but whenever there is an actual real bug that gives the player a disadvantage it seems to get ignored and left for ages, it just gets put on the back burner and forgotten because it means the player has to spend more units. I completed 6.2.5 yesterday and I am currently grinding units for the fight and I was planning on taking up my CV or MS up to 4/55 as I have seen they are very effective but now I am stuck on who to use and I am realising that I am going to have to grind way more units for the fight, i can see that the fight is hard enough and it doesn’t need making worse. It also seems unfair that all the top players have completed this chapter and fight with either CV or MS and then that leaves players like me (8k prestige, 600k rated who don’t have the best champs in the game and don’t have 20 counters to this one fight) at a disadvantage to the players who do have all the best counters for the boss. I think you should maybe think this through a little more and give us a bit more respect as we are the ones who are paying all of your bills. I love the game and I hate to see things like this where you are clearly trying to make us spend more money and it just makes me less motivated to play, especially because I’m now at 6.2.6 and suddenly I have less effective counters (other than my wallet)

Zuko_ILC · April 2020

I don't understand how this is a bug. Bwcv and Morningstar regen based on damage dealt. This is based off the numbers you see during their attack not how much life has been removed from an opponent. Indestructible stops the damage to the opponent but the damage is still dealt from the players side. Now if their abilities stated that regen is based off how much health is removed from a champion that is a completely different ability. It really needs to stay the same otherwise this is changing the champions people ranked up.

kfd2010 · April 2020

I just want to say how much I enjoy that this has become a debate digging into the weeds of the semantics. And I don't mean that at all sarcastically. It feels like two different sides preparing to argue in front of the Supreme Court.

And honestly, I can see it both ways. Is the damage being dealt but not taken? But if it's not being taken, is it being dealt?

Kabam Miike · April 2020

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.

I don't know where that information is coming from, but it's not true. When there are indestructible charges up, or any effect that keeps a Champion from taking damage, Morningstar (or any other Champion) is not dealing any damage in those cases.

I understand the frustration here guys, but this is not just a bug that affects one fight. This is something that can and has been exploited in other areas as well and needs to be dealt with. This has never been an intentional part of Morningstar's kit, and her ability descriptions are pretty explicit about it.

Yofa · April 2020

Kabam Miike said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.
I don't know where that information is coming from, but it's not true. When there are indestructible charges up, or any effect that keeps a Champion from taking damage, Morningstar (or any other Champion) is not dealing any damage in those cases.

I understand the frustration here guys, but this is not just a bug that affects one fight. This is something that can and has been exploited in other areas as well and needs to be dealt with. This has never been an intentional part of Morningstar's kit, and her ability descriptions are pretty explicit about it.

I do not think you understand this frustration thousands of people have not taken advantage of it and then we who come behind our solutions to complete this content are dwindling .... so now are you offering us solutions or should we just uninstall this game

MostWanted · April 2020

Kabam Miike said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.
I don't know where that information is coming from, but it's not true. When there are indestructible charges up, or any effect that keeps a Champion from taking damage, Morningstar (or any other Champion) is not dealing any damage in those cases.

I understand the frustration here guys, but this is not just a bug that affects one fight. This is something that can and has been exploited in other areas as well and needs to be dealt with. This has never been an intentional part of Morningstar's kit, and her ability descriptions are pretty explicit about it.

You are absolutely right, Miike: abilities are pretty explicit. The champion has 5 indestructible charges. What is the indestructible effect? Let's see on Luke cage info, since he too has an indestructible effect:
Bullet-proof skin allows Luke Cage to become Indestructible and ignore all incoming damage for 1.7 to 3.7 seconds.

Indestructible doesn't say that the defender takes 0% damage, it simply ignores it. In fact in many other contents of the game there are nodes like "do you bleed": the defender takes -100% damage from any source other than bleed.
In this case, you will see that your hits deal 0 to the opponent.
So I suppose that indestructible mechanics and -100% reduced damage are different things. In my opinion they should be still separate things, but it looks like that it wasn't working as intended.
PS: indestructible is an ability that works this way since the beginning, 2015

Okaythen · April 2020

LOLO1 said:
@Kabam Miike @Kabam Zibiit @Kabam Lyra @Kabam Porthos

Ask the kabam crew why millions isn't enough and why punish a great player base. Kabam is lucky to have the player base and to have this game. Keep it up and kabam will lose both. Shady and pathetic.

How much proff hof do you watch?

Kabam Miike · April 2020

MostWanted said:

Kabam Miike said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.
I don't know where that information is coming from, but it's not true. When there are indestructible charges up, or any effect that keeps a Champion from taking damage, Morningstar (or any other Champion) is not dealing any damage in those cases.

I understand the frustration here guys, but this is not just a bug that affects one fight. This is something that can and has been exploited in other areas as well and needs to be dealt with. This has never been an intentional part of Morningstar's kit, and her ability descriptions are pretty explicit about it.
You are absolutely right, Miike: abilities are pretty explicit. The champion has 5 indestructible charges. What is the indestructible effect? Let's see on Luke cage info, since he too has an indestructible effect:
Bullet-proof skin allows Luke Cage to become Indestructible and ignore all incoming damage for 1.7 to 3.7 seconds.

Indestructible doesn't say that the defender takes 0% damage, it simply ignores it. In fact in many other contents of the game there are nodes like "do you bleed": the defender takes -100% damage from any source other than bleed.
In this case, you will see that your hits deal 0 to the opponent.
So I suppose that indestructible mechanics and -100% reduced damage are different things. In my opinion they should be still separate things, but it looks like that it wasn't working as intended.
PS: indestructible is an ability that works this way since the beginning, 2015

During Luke Cage's Indestructible phase, he is not taking damage. Morningstar is not doing any damage, and should not be healing there either. Additionally, there have been abilities with similar names with different descriptions and effects before.

Greekhit · April 2020

Weather this was a bug or not that’s not the real issue here. That what matters is that some players took advantage of that while others wont be able to do so. It’s like discriminate the player base. The very least the developers need to do to restore balance between the players who took advantage and those who didn’t is to tone down the fight and adjust the indestructible charges to 3. That will give both sides no reason to shout for anything.

TheTalents · April 2020

Kabam Miike said:

MostWanted said:

Kabam Miike said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Damage is dealt, it is just ignored. Leave it in as able to steal; no bug to fix if looked at this way (jae sylvr!)

Far easier to change the text, than change the code.

They ignore Gulk/bane, Kamala, flow, thing sp3, parry; indeed on the latter, they just changed the text.

The only reason they want to "fix" this, is because it benefits the player base, 1,000s of whom have already used it.
I don't know where that information is coming from, but it's not true. When there are indestructible charges up, or any effect that keeps a Champion from taking damage, Morningstar (or any other Champion) is not dealing any damage in those cases.

I understand the frustration here guys, but this is not just a bug that affects one fight. This is something that can and has been exploited in other areas as well and needs to be dealt with. This has never been an intentional part of Morningstar's kit, and her ability descriptions are pretty explicit about it.
You are absolutely right, Miike: abilities are pretty explicit. The champion has 5 indestructible charges. What is the indestructible effect? Let's see on Luke cage info, since he too has an indestructible effect:
Bullet-proof skin allows Luke Cage to become Indestructible and ignore all incoming damage for 1.7 to 3.7 seconds.

Indestructible doesn't say that the defender takes 0% damage, it simply ignores it. In fact in many other contents of the game there are nodes like "do you bleed": the defender takes -100% damage from any source other than bleed.
In this case, you will see that your hits deal 0 to the opponent.
So I suppose that indestructible mechanics and -100% reduced damage are different things. In my opinion they should be still separate things, but it looks like that it wasn't working as intended.
PS: indestructible is an ability that works this way since the beginning, 2015
During Luke Cage's Indestructible phase, he is not taking damage. Morningstar is not doing any damage, and should not be healing there either. Additionally, there have been abilities with similar names with different descriptions and effects before.

At this point if you nerf the Champion fight, you win the communities favor and people will care little to none about Morning Star. Most people like me don't like the character, she is clunky in her movements and is a wet noodle which makes it a pain to build up her charges in end game content.
BWCV stand up on her own and would be a great champ with or without the regen. So all the arguments on both sides about what the node is irrelevant overall. The heart of the issue is with the difficulty of the champion fight itself. Bare minimum remove the no retreat node and I think that would be enough.

_matto_ · April 2020

I might be making a completely irrelevant point here but ghost with a tech power boost in 6.3.6 regains power when launching a special while destructive feedback is active, even though its based on damage dealt when captain America takes no damage as there’s “crit me with your best shot” (can’t crit with destructive feedback) and I know ghost has 100% crit chance with specials but he still takes no damage when the destructive feedback goes on cool down

This is very similar to the way MS and BWCV heal(ed) when the champions indestructible. So the damage is still being dealt he just takes non of it 🤷‍♂️

Kabam Miike · April 2020

_matto_ said:

I might be making a completely irrelevant point here but ghost with a tech power boost in 6.3.6 regains power when launching a special while destructive feedback is active, even though its based on damage dealt when captain America takes no damage as there’s “crit me with your best shot” (can’t crit with destructive feedback) and I know ghost has 100% crit chance with specials but he still takes no damage when the destructive feedback goes on cool down

This is very similar to the way MS and BWCV heal(ed) when the champions indestructible. So the damage is still being dealt he just takes non of it 🤷‍♂️

That sounds like another bug that we should log. I know there are inconsistencies in the language in the game. It's over 5 years old, and there's new content added at least twice a month, so inconsistencies will happen. We can work to fix it the best we can when they're discovered though.

Savage · April 2020

_matto_ said:

I might be making a completely irrelevant point here but ghost with a tech power boost in 6.3.6 regains power when launching a special while destructive feedback is active, even though its based on damage dealt when captain America takes no damage as there’s “crit me with your best shot” (can’t crit with destructive feedback) and I know ghost has 100% crit chance with specials but he still takes no damage when the destructive feedback goes on cool down

This is very similar to the way MS and BWCV heal(ed) when the champions indestructible. So the damage is still being dealt he just takes non of it 🤷‍♂️

In that case you actually are dealing damage but it is just being stored with the Destructive Feedback node. That's why if you were to block you would take all the damage you just dealt.

Edit: Misread the post. That's probably a bug then.

Gamer · April 2020

Kabam Miike said:

_matto_ said:

I might be making a completely irrelevant point here but ghost with a tech power boost in 6.3.6 regains power when launching a special while destructive feedback is active, even though its based on damage dealt when captain America takes no damage as there’s “crit me with your best shot” (can’t crit with destructive feedback) and I know ghost has 100% crit chance with specials but he still takes no damage when the destructive feedback goes on cool down

This is very similar to the way MS and BWCV heal(ed) when the champions indestructible. So the damage is still being dealt he just takes non of it 🤷‍♂️
That sounds like another bug that we should log. I know there are inconsistencies in the language in the game. It's over 5 years old, and there's new content added at least twice a month, so inconsistencies will happen. We can work to fix it the best we can when they're discovered though.

Well great keep in mind this will hurts even more but better to get it done right first love those bosts somtimes there’s great somtimes ther don’t help unless u deal larger danmged with ghost ect

Crimson8399 · April 2020

Why can't the block penetration just be reduced. If that happens then it will make the fight still a challenge but not so bad that a blocked hit costs several thousand HP. Also wasn't the point or patch 12.0 to make the game more diverse so everyone wasn't using the same champs for everything. Now it is a case of the haves vs have nots. It's even been said by mods that content moving forward may have to wait til you a get the right champ.

Pgal · April 2020

My 2 cents: people wouldn't react this way if Kabam dealt with bugs that are against the player base with the same urgency.

Patchie93 · April 2020

Pgal said:
My 2 cents: people wouldn't react this way if Kabam dealt with bugs that are against the player base with the same urgency.

Such as?

GroundedWisdom · April 2020

tafre said:

DNA3000 said:

Coreyb516 said:
Any of the devs plan to comment on this and i
Trying to understand how is this a bug in the first place lol
Morningstar's abilities explicitly state that she has a chance to heal 50% of damage she deals. So if she deals 1000 points of damage and the heal triggers you'd expect Morningstar to heal 500 points of health. If she lands an attack for 200 damage you'd expect her to heal for 100 health. If she lands an attack for 10 points of damage you'd expect her to heal only 5 points of health.

So how much health would you expect MS to heal if she lands an attack for zero damage?
That is the point where you might be wrong though, it does not state anywhere that the damage MS or BWCV deals is 0. It is due to the nature of the Indestructible charges, when they are up the Champion is immune to damage. However, this does not in any way indicate that the damage dealt is 0. The damage is still there but it is not being applied due to the indestructible charge. Since there is still some amount of damage being applied even though it is not registered due to the damage immunity, the healing should still be occuring imo. If this is not the case, it is another case of a poorly described ability.

Damage dealt means Damage received. Not potential Damage blocked by a Buff. If the opponent receives no Damage, it's not dealt.

TheInfinty · April 2020

Moosetiptronic said:

TheInfinty said:

Moosetiptronic said:

TheInfinty said:

Moosetiptronic said:
Ok. Gulk. It says he regenerates from passive damage. But bane is apparently "special".

Where is the bug fix allowing Gulk to Regen from bane? He should.
That’s because originally when they first made act 5 it was a active degen I don’t remember when they changed it but they did but I think that’s just because the game still registers it as a buff
You are selectively choosing which description is a bug that needs fixing and one that is ok to slide.

Why does Morningstar's description need a bug fix, rather than a quick text change?

Why can't this just be ignored like Gulk and bane?

How about Kamala and her removing buffs that aren't in her description either?

Again, flow's description can be dragged into this as can multiple others.

Fixing Morningstar, while ignoring all the others, stinks.
Listen I’m not always on kabams side ok infact I was pissed off when they nerfed she hulk because that effected her in more matches then just the 6.2 champion fight. Morningstar barely got touched at all is this going to effect how you will play Morningstar outside of 6.2 no it won’t because Morningstar will still function the same. And yes I’m annoyed that kabam hasn’t fixed the gladiator hulk and kamala bugs
Or are all of Gulk, Kamala and Morningstar, *as they stand*, "working at intended" and they just need to change their text?

Why the single minded insistence from you, really and others that the code be changed to match the description?</.

Okay then do you just want every single bug to be fixed at once by kabam listen I’m also quite annoyed you caller me a single minded insistence despite the fact I haven’t called you any sort of rude word(bottom line let’s not just insult each other this isn’t twitter) but they changed absolutely nothing about her description please go check out my previous reply in this thread showing Morningstar from may 10 2018 to now not a single thing changed at all

Morningstar Life Steal Bug Fix

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