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New Carrina's challenges thoughts?

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    AshacekarAshacekar Posts: 1,820 ★★★★

    LJF said:

    It's sad to see Kabam employees sticking fingers into their ears with these incredibly defensive responses. It's evident from each of Miike, Crashed, and Jax's comments that they aren't interested in feedback from players about these challenges. I was going to come and offer some thoughts on why, as one of those players (arguably) that these challenges were designed for, these challenges miss the mark. But I'm not going to waste time giving constructive criticism to a willfully deaf audience. So good luck I guess, hope you guys are happy with how this all turns out.

    We take feedback seriously and actually earlier today changed the design for an upcoming piece of content based on this feedback.
    Yay!!! The WoW Nebula will be good then
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    Matty_IceMatty_Ice Posts: 564 ★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    Yeah but I don't get paid to do for them so believe what you want keep spending and just remember my post when exactly what I said happens. I don't need anyone to agree with me plus kabam couldn't afford me 🤣which is another reason bc they probably hired the cheapest data analysist to work for them. But hey goi ahead I'm just letting the people that know and understand what will happen if they don't turn it around

    I might remember, and then again I might not. My memory is pretty good, but the number of people who have said "just remember me" over the last nine years has exceeded my ability to keep them all straight. Also, many of them aren't around anymore.

    The fact that you don't get paid to do it justifies not actually doing any data analytics work. It doesn't justify claiming that just because you are a data analyst your judgments should be deemed credible even when you don't actually do any data analysis. A data analyst that doesn't do data analysis is just Bob, a guy with a random opinion. Your background as a data analyst only matters when you do good data analysis that can be read and reviewed.

    I've done data analysis. I've done professional game design work. I've done systems engineering, software development, and a whole bunch of stuff I keep forgetting to put on my resume. But none of it matters unless I'm actually talking about those fields. I've done a lot of math, I've even taught math, but I still show my work. I've done game systems design, but when I make a game altering suggestion, I show my work. And when I just offer an off the cuff opinion without doing any work, I expect everyone to give it the same credence as Bob, the guy with an opinion about everything.

    Anything else is a bit of overselling. And if you are actually a professional data analyst, you know what that always means when it comes to assessing the credibility of someone you've just met and know nothing else about.
    So where's the Data analysis you run to back all of the claims you make on forums? By your logic, you're just another "Bob".
    Sometimes, I am just a BoB.

    Sometimes I'm Bill, the guy that actually tests things in the game.

    But you asked about analysis. When I talk about the game economy, I do economic analysis. Unless I'm talking about ISO, in which case I really, really, really, really, really analyze the numbers.

    But those are relatively small bits of data to be sure, even if they are sometimes exhausting to collect. When I address things like the drop rates of arena crystals, I can point to actual data because I collect it and can analyze both the average and statistical distribution of drops to address crystal manipulation suspicions.

    Lost to time (and the forum software switch over) was the data collection and analysis I did to estimate the drop rate of the original featured crystals (I was the first to estimate the 20-25% drop rate) and the relative rarity drop rates of the PHC (I was the only one attempting a large scale analysis of those numbers using unbiased streamed crystal openings). And sometimes I only provide the outline of the calculation process, because if I articulated all of it every single time that would get ridiculous.

    If you're looking for some gigantic data lake crunch, I can't say I've done that because that data is not available to the players in any reasonable form. However, I never claim to do such analysis either. I only claim to do the analysis required to validate the conclusions I produce, when I claim those conclusions are themselves data-driven or analysis-based. I could just say "I've done professional game design, just trust me" but I don't. If I'm going to suggest that parts of the game are broken, and how to fix them, I show my work. If I'm going to claim that a significant part of the game economy should be changed in a radical, almost unthinkable way, I articulate why.

    No one is required to do any of this to provide feedback, or to discuss the game in general. I would not, and do not fault players for simply expressing their opinions, up to a point. However, once you bring resume into it, you should be held to a higher standard commensurate with that qualification. "I'm a data analyst trust me" should be backed up with some actual data analysis, or it is simply a longer way of saying "just trust me."
    This might be the best comeback I’ve ever seen on the forums.

    P.S. how much time did it take you to link all your forum threads in there?
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    DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 18,822 Guardian
    Matty_Ice said:

    This might be the best comeback I’ve ever seen on the forums.

    P.S. how much time did it take you to link all your forum threads in there?

    Not too much. What i really wanted to find was that time some guy tried to refute something I said about the game revenue by quoting Google, and Google in turn was quoting me, but I forgot the context of that post.

    That was a special day.
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    GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,301 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    Yeah but I don't get paid to do for them so believe what you want keep spending and just remember my post when exactly what I said happens. I don't need anyone to agree with me plus kabam couldn't afford me 🤣which is another reason bc they probably hired the cheapest data analysist to work for them. But hey goi ahead I'm just letting the people that know and understand what will happen if they don't turn it around

    I might remember, and then again I might not. My memory is pretty good, but the number of people who have said "just remember me" over the last nine years has exceeded my ability to keep them all straight. Also, many of them aren't around anymore.

    The fact that you don't get paid to do it justifies not actually doing any data analytics work. It doesn't justify claiming that just because you are a data analyst your judgments should be deemed credible even when you don't actually do any data analysis. A data analyst that doesn't do data analysis is just Bob, a guy with a random opinion. Your background as a data analyst only matters when you do good data analysis that can be read and reviewed.

    I've done data analysis. I've done professional game design work. I've done systems engineering, software development, and a whole bunch of stuff I keep forgetting to put on my resume. But none of it matters unless I'm actually talking about those fields. I've done a lot of math, I've even taught math, but I still show my work. I've done game systems design, but when I make a game altering suggestion, I show my work. And when I just offer an off the cuff opinion without doing any work, I expect everyone to give it the same credence as Bob, the guy with an opinion about everything.

    Anything else is a bit of overselling. And if you are actually a professional data analyst, you know what that always means when it comes to assessing the credibility of someone you've just met and know nothing else about.
    So where's the Data analysis you run to back all of the claims you make on forums? By your logic, you're just another "Bob".
    Sometimes, I am just a BoB.

    Sometimes I'm Bill, the guy that actually tests things in the game.

    But you asked about analysis. When I talk about the game economy, I do economic analysis. Unless I'm talking about ISO, in which case I really, really, really, really, really analyze the numbers.

    But those are relatively small bits of data to be sure, even if they are sometimes exhausting to collect. When I address things like the drop rates of arena crystals, I can point to actual data because I collect it and can analyze both the average and statistical distribution of drops to address crystal manipulation suspicions.

    Lost to time (and the forum software switch over) was the data collection and analysis I did to estimate the drop rate of the original featured crystals (I was the first to estimate the 20-25% drop rate) and the relative rarity drop rates of the PHC (I was the only one attempting a large scale analysis of those numbers using unbiased streamed crystal openings). And sometimes I only provide the outline of the calculation process, because if I articulated all of it every single time that would get ridiculous.

    If you're looking for some gigantic data lake crunch, I can't say I've done that because that data is not available to the players in any reasonable form. However, I never claim to do such analysis either. I only claim to do the analysis required to validate the conclusions I produce, when I claim those conclusions are themselves data-driven or analysis-based. I could just say "I've done professional game design, just trust me" but I don't. If I'm going to suggest that parts of the game are broken, and how to fix them, I show my work. If I'm going to claim that a significant part of the game economy should be changed in a radical, almost unthinkable way, I articulate why.

    No one is required to do any of this to provide feedback, or to discuss the game in general. I would not, and do not fault players for simply expressing their opinions, up to a point. However, once you bring resume into it, you should be held to a higher standard commensurate with that qualification. "I'm a data analyst trust me" should be backed up with some actual data analysis, or it is simply a longer way of saying "just trust me."
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