What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
i'm not pretending to like serpent. i don't. i'm not prepared to fight him in bgs because i'm not great at deck making and drafting, so i ban him. do i wish he was toned down? yeah, but when was the last time a defender existed in the game with no good counters? let's count.
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.
All defenders in the game should have decent counters, even back in the day when Domino Thing and Korg were released there were ways to either counter them with skill alone or kits. There has never been a single defender in the game that had zero good counters, yes I know Chavez this Kushala that etc they're very slow, until we get Shathra there are no true good counters for him and that's simply not fair. Especially if you're doing it to milk future champs even further, it's messed up.
No we haven't, that's where you and the rest of the people on this thread are wrong. We have never been through this cause there has never been a defender as ridiculously broken as Serpent, even Domino on release when there were no aar immune champs wasn't as broken as this guy.
When they were released, there were very few counters to them. I remember when Iceman was released and everyone was shaking. Things change.
Iceman wasn’t a threat due to his damage was only 25% nothing major but serpent is way more powerful than simple 25% damage which 25% is only major in bgs by the time bgs came out iceman wasn’t a threat
Yes, but the game has changes since then. There are a lot more Champs and counters now. At the time, the reactions were pretty much still the same. Anything that people felt was too much has become not challenging at all.
This skates so close to the point yet misses it entirely. The vast majority of the constructive feedback has nothing to do with his challenge level, but instead is a discussion of the design change here and why it’s overturned to the RPG elements of the game.
You thread that needle so nicely that it seems like it’s part of the discussion , but really it’s off topic.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
i'm not pretending to like serpent. i don't. i'm not prepared to fight him in bgs because i'm not great at deck making and drafting, so i ban him. do i wish he was toned down? yeah, but when was the last time a defender existed in the game with no good counters? let's count.
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.
All defenders in the game should have decent counters, even back in the day when Domino Thing and Korg were released there were ways to either counter them with skill alone or kits. There has never been a single defender in the game that had zero good counters, yes I know Chavez this Kushala that etc they're very slow, until we get Shathra there are no true good counters for him and that's simply not fair. Especially if you're doing it to milk future champs even further, it's messed up.
No we haven't, that's where you and the rest of the people on this thread are wrong. We have never been through this cause there has never been a defender as ridiculously broken as Serpent, even Domino on release when there were no aar immune champs wasn't as broken as this guy.
When they were released, there were very few counters to them. I remember when Iceman was released and everyone was shaking. Things change.
Iceman wasn’t a threat due to his damage was only 25% nothing major but serpent is way more powerful than simple 25% damage which 25% is only major in bgs by the time bgs came out iceman wasn’t a threat
Yes, but the game has changes since then. There are a lot more Champs and counters now. At the time, the reactions were pretty much still the same. Anything that people felt was too much has become not challenging at all.
This skates so close to the point yet misses it entirely. The vast majority of the constructive feedback has nothing to do with his challenge level, but instead is a discussion of the design change here and why it’s overturned to the RPG elements of the game.
You thread that needle so nicely that it seems like it’s part of the discussion , but really it’s off topic.
It's not off-topic. It's just not what people want to hear. A discussion involves looking at all points. What we have here is a one-sided petition. The only thing people keep asserting is they want him nerfed in some capacity. I'm talking about my own experience over 9 years of playing and what I've seen come to pass. You're free to disagree, but that doesn't make it off-topic just because it's not what you agree with.
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
i'm not pretending to like serpent. i don't. i'm not prepared to fight him in bgs because i'm not great at deck making and drafting, so i ban him. do i wish he was toned down? yeah, but when was the last time a defender existed in the game with no good counters? let's count.
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.
All defenders in the game should have decent counters, even back in the day when Domino Thing and Korg were released there were ways to either counter them with skill alone or kits. There has never been a single defender in the game that had zero good counters, yes I know Chavez this Kushala that etc they're very slow, until we get Shathra there are no true good counters for him and that's simply not fair. Especially if you're doing it to milk future champs even further, it's messed up.
No we haven't, that's where you and the rest of the people on this thread are wrong. We have never been through this cause there has never been a defender as ridiculously broken as Serpent, even Domino on release when there were no aar immune champs wasn't as broken as this guy.
When they were released, there were very few counters to them. I remember when Iceman was released and everyone was shaking. Things change.
Iceman wasn’t a threat due to his damage was only 25% nothing major but serpent is way more powerful than simple 25% damage which 25% is only major in bgs by the time bgs came out iceman wasn’t a threat
Iceman came out in 2017, tell me how many great champs were there that came before him, let alone being a counter, there are not a lot of coldsnap immune champ at this point either but it really doesnt matter...He was never a problem to begin with
Even if a mod seen this thread (the surely have) what do you expect them to say. "Hey we understand your frustrations but you gotta deal with it. He isn't getting nerfed".
They all know they have nothing to say in this matter. So they probably will never comment on this thread
Yeah I think for this thread specifically, Mod doesn’t need to comment anything if they don’t want because they’re not the one make decision about Serpent, and this thread just a place for everyone share their opinion about Serpent as well. However, we need their OFFICIAL RESPONSE ABOUT THE BUGS, AI. Do they capable to fix it or not? If not, just let us know so we can have our own plan with this game as well
What's crazy about all this arguing is that they probably won't change him still and just wait till we all forget and move on lol
bro everything will be ok.
y'all acting like some evil villain snuck his way into the company to mess with us lol. solutions will come.
But they are completely ignoring the thread lmao he's right.
they don't owe us anything lol
"yeah hi guys he's a hard defender and as usual we'll have solutions ok thanks bye"
Where in this whole thread did anyone claim they owe us anything?
when you say they're ignoring the thread that implies that we should get a response.
i'm a player like everyone else and his kit is OP so i agree with almost everything said here, but it's not the end of the world.
we know how the game works:
problem ---> solution
so unless we think they're going to skip the other half of this game (which they'd be insane to do), it's going to work out fine.
No it doesn't, it implies we want a response and they can either give us one or not, and people can either be frustrated due to this (us) or not care about it cause you just take whatever they give you (you).
Also I don't know why you continue to use that argument when I've said like ten times on this same thread already, DLL pretty much confirmed there will be no hard counters, those days are long gone. The best we will get is something similar to Shathra but that's it.
no matter how garbage serpent looks right now, i am 99.99% positive that their decision not to nerf him is deliberate, intentional, planned, well thought out, and well reasoned.
our "frustrations" will be soothed in the future and they won't let us drown. they are not dumb enough to leave us without a life preserver. help is coming.
I'm not disputing that, of course it was intentional, doesn't however change the fact that it's **** to pull that off just so you can sell counters if people want to be able to enjoy BGs. I never buy pre-release bundles however I'm pretty much forced to do so with Shathra if I don't want to get wiped out again and again next meta with rich get richer.
You say they're not dumb enough yet DLL already quite literally said there will never be a Galan Peni situation where a defender becomes completely irrelevant due to a hard counter.
i'm not pretending to like serpent. i don't. i'm not prepared to fight him in bgs because i'm not great at deck making and drafting, so i ban him. do i wish he was toned down? yeah, but when was the last time a defender existed in the game with no good counters? let's count.
while there might not be another hulking/peni situation in the future, there will be GOOD counters and this serpent problem won't be as big as it is now. patience, we've been through this so many times and the game's still here and we're still here.
All defenders in the game should have decent counters, even back in the day when Domino Thing and Korg were released there were ways to either counter them with skill alone or kits. There has never been a single defender in the game that had zero good counters, yes I know Chavez this Kushala that etc they're very slow, until we get Shathra there are no true good counters for him and that's simply not fair. Especially if you're doing it to milk future champs even further, it's messed up.
No we haven't, that's where you and the rest of the people on this thread are wrong. We have never been through this cause there has never been a defender as ridiculously broken as Serpent, even Domino on release when there were no aar immune champs wasn't as broken as this guy.
When they were released, there were very few counters to them. I remember when Iceman was released and everyone was shaking. Things change.
Yet the fights were doable even if you lost some health, if you fight Iceman without a counter you lose 25% health and then he's just dead cause he has nothing else in his kit. When you fight Serpent without a counter you lose 100% of your health and you're dead because his kit is ridiculous, and even when you do fight him with a counter you will most likely lose more health than you would've lost against Iceman or still lose the round due to time. So yeah that's a pretty bad comparison, not to mention one node doesn't absolutely break Iceman, Serpent on the other hand well we all saw how absolutely ridiculous the buff duration was last meta, even Chavez and Kushala were timing out.
I'm case you didn't gety point, I not denying we've had hard defenders, what I'm denying is the "we've been through this before" lol no we have not, no defender ever released has been as overtuned as this guy whether you want to accept that fact or not.
Well the mods are active on this thread. They just removed one of my comments. I don’t know if it was me referencing X-Magica or what but they are looking at this.
Even if a mod seen this thread (the surely have) what do you expect them to say. "Hey we understand your frustrations but you gotta deal with it. He isn't getting nerfed".
They all know they have nothing to say in this matter. So they probably will never comment on this thread
Yeah I think for this thread specifically, Mod doesn’t need to comment anything if they don’t want because they’re not the one make decision about Serpent, and this thread just a place for everyone share their opinion about Serpent as well. However, we need their OFFICIAL RESPONSE ABOUT THE BUGS, AI. Do they capable to fix it or not? If not, just let us know so we can have our own plan with this game as well
This thread is starting to look like my tinder! 22 pages of messages and we still can't get a text back lol Kabam are you there? It's me, Groot 😆
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
Wait until Serpent starts coming to quests. Wait until we have to fight a Serpent with extend, rich get richer, and Lazarus. Then see how much fun you have. And one custom made node just for Serpent that prevents his power from being manipulated in any way.
Looking forward to that 😂 I know you’re trying to over exaggerate it to make a point…but sounds ok lol
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
Wait until Serpent starts coming to quests. Wait until we have to fight a Serpent with extend, rich get richer, and Lazarus. Then see how much fun you have. And one custom made node just for Serpent that prevents his power from being manipulated in any way.
Looking forward to that 😂 I know you’re trying to over exaggerate it to make a point…but sounds ok lol
Double the amount of power gain when his power gain is already ridiculous sounds okay to you? You're either a troll or a bot, which one is it?
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
The idea is to be competitive and strategic. If a champion is so overtuned that he’s essentially going to be permabanned until the end of time, that doesn’t make for a healthy game. Especially when they try to top Serpent down the line.
Exactly. Suppose tomorrow Kabam releases a champion that insta-KOs you at the start of the fight. Sure, we could permaban them in Battlegrounds, but is that really a solution? To those saying, 'but you can always ban them,' think about this: What’s the point of having a game full of diverse champions and strategies if we're forced to ban certain characters just to maintain balance? This approach doesn't fix the core issue; it only masks the problem and limits the true potential of the game.
Well the mods are active on this thread. They just removed one of my comments. I don’t know if it was me referencing X-Magica or what but they are looking at this.
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
So what happens when the next Serpents come to the game? What then? You can't ban all of them. Forcing people to just "ban" defenders is not healthy for the game on the long run and would eventually turn the whole game mode into an RNG fiesta where the person with the best luck during the draft wins, skill goes out the window completely if that happens and then the game mode dies, naturally.
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
It’s fine that they don’t, but I can also mention to you as examples top players like Trappy, Nagase, Lagacy, KT1, etc who are in favor of a nerf and have complained about him. It’s not because they have a “skill issue” as so many suggest and just suck at fighting him, but rather that serpent even if they play well is busted enough to cause a loss.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
So what happens when the next Serpents come to the game? What then? You can't ban all of them. Forcing people to just "ban" defenders is not healthy for the game on the long run and would eventually turn the whole game mode into an RNG fiesta where the person with the best luck during the draft wins, skill goes out the window completely if that happens and then the game mode dies, naturally. That was in reference to the current meta Serpent isn’t some FOREVER ban champ that you’re just gonna have to ban EVERY SINGLE TIME lol if you’re struggling with someone in a certain meta it’s ok to ban doesn’t mean you’ll have to forever from this day onward lol as for the “next Serpent” like every hard defender the community has complained about in the past were smart enough to find a way. There’s over 200 champs at this point there WILL be options I promise you😂
So what happens when the next Serpents come to the game? What then? You can't ban all of them. Forcing people to just "ban" defenders is not healthy for the game on the long run and would eventually turn the whole game mode into an RNG fiesta where the person with the best luck during the draft wins, skill goes out the window completely if that happens and then the game mode dies, naturally.
That was in reference to the current meta Serpent isn’t some FOREVER ban champ that you’re just gonna have to ban EVERY SINGLE TIME lol if you’re struggling with someone in a certain meta it’s ok to ban doesn’t mean you’ll have to forever from this day onward lol as for the “next Serpent” like every hard defender the community has complained about in the past were smart enough to find a way. There’s over 200 champs at this point there WILL be options I promise you😂
How do you know? We don't even have a single strong counter yet, there is absolutely no reason to assume that won't be the case when DLL already said there will be no hard counters for Serpent either.
As for your other argument, no defender in the past was as overtuned as this one, the fact that you're even trying to compare the rest of the defenders to this guy is crazy.
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
It’s fine that they don’t, but I can also mention to you as examples top players like Trappy, Nagase, Lagacy, KT1, etc who are in favor of a nerf and have complained about him. It’s not because they have a “skill issue” as so many suggest and just suck at fighting him, but rather that serpent even if they play well is busted enough to cause a loss.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
To be fair I know some that aren’t upset about not getting nerfed too lol KT1/Lags seem to be the loudest about it but when it comes to complaints they go in one ear out the other these days. I would argue in my experience a lot of loses I’ve seen to him have been more on a skill set(or just not thinking options through lol) result tho. It’ll be fine imo tho in another month or two well probably be on to complaining some other champ is just too hard…as the cycle goes so often here lol
So what happens when the next Serpents come to the game? What then? You can't ban all of them. Forcing people to just "ban" defenders is not healthy for the game on the long run and would eventually turn the whole game mode into an RNG fiesta where the person with the best luck during the draft wins, skill goes out the window completely if that happens and then the game mode dies, naturally.
That was in reference to the current meta Serpent isn’t some FOREVER ban champ that you’re just gonna have to ban EVERY SINGLE TIME lol if you’re struggling with someone in a certain meta it’s ok to ban doesn’t mean you’ll have to forever from this day onward lol as for the “next Serpent” like every hard defender the community has complained about in the past were smart enough to find a way. There’s over 200 champs at this point there WILL be options I promise you😂
Serpent has sucked in every. Single. Meta. That’s the point is that he’s so easily pushed over the top in even the simplest seeming metas. And then goes way off the deep end in a meta like archaos where you’re constantly crushed or he’s unblockable. He’s been awful for Archaos. Insufferable in extend. Really bad for power snack and rich get richer. And Crit Me meta will remove his supposed best counters of Wiccan, Sym Supreme, and Kushala. Even Wolf won’t be a super great counter because of no rupture damage. Every meta makes him even worse.
As for the "We've had tough defenders before without hard counters" argument, while it's true defenders with little counters and annoying mechanics existed before serpent, that was also before introduction of BGs (where serpent is most notorious) and, more importantly, rebalancing. That is the reason why this discussion is happening at all since prior to this, complaining about OP champs was pointless as they were (mostly) set in stone after release. Lots of players may have felt very similar to now when those defenders were released but didn't have much reason to post about it.
And who knows, maybe defenders like domino, infinity-man, korg, could've also received a tune downs if rebalancing was in place. Kabam already said herc and kitty would've been changed.
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
It’s fine that they don’t, but I can also mention to you as examples top players like Trappy, Nagase, Lagacy, KT1, etc who are in favor of a nerf and have complained about him. It’s not because they have a “skill issue” as so many suggest and just suck at fighting him, but rather that serpent even if they play well is busted enough to cause a loss.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
To be fair I know some that aren’t upset about not getting nerfed too lol KT1/Lags seem to be the loudest about it but when it comes to complaints they go in one ear out the other these days. I would argue in my experience a lot of loses I’ve seen to him have been more on a skill set(or just not thinking options through lol) result tho. It’ll be fine imo tho in another month or two well probably be on to complaining some other champ is just too hard…as the cycle goes so often here lol
I’ve seen two competitive bg players with the opinions that serpent should stay the same, one being Andy (who has an r3 sig 100 serpent lol) and Vega, who is good friends with the designer of serpent. I’m not saying that Vega intentionally is taking on bias because his friend is the designer, but I do think there’s inherent and unavoidable bias just due to the position he’s in. There’s still far more competitive players in team nerf than on team no nerf. You also claim their fails are skill issues when serpent has no areas that allow you to express skill.
And again as so many others in this thread have said, comparing serpent to any other problematic defender is an unfair comparison, serpent is much much worse.
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
It’s fine that they don’t, but I can also mention to you as examples top players like Trappy, Nagase, Lagacy, KT1, etc who are in favor of a nerf and have complained about him. It’s not because they have a “skill issue” as so many suggest and just suck at fighting him, but rather that serpent even if they play well is busted enough to cause a loss.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
To be fair I know some that aren’t upset about not getting nerfed too lol KT1/Lags seem to be the loudest about it but when it comes to complaints they go in one ear out the other these days. I would argue in my experience a lot of loses I’ve seen to him have been more on a skill set(or just not thinking options through lol) result tho. It’ll be fine imo tho in another month or two well probably be on to complaining some other champ is just too hard…as the cycle goes so often here lol
I’ve seen two competitive bg players with the opinions that serpent should stay the same, one being Andy (who has an r3 sig 100 serpent lol) and Vega, who is good friends with the designer of serpent. I’m not saying that Vega intentionally is taking on bias because his friend is the designer, but I do think there’s inherent and unavoidable bias just due to the position he’s in. There’s still far more competitive players in team nerf than on team no nerf. You also claim their fails are skill issues when serpent has no areas that allow you to express skill.
And again as so many others in this thread have said, comparing serpent to any other problematic defender is an unfair comparison, serpent is much much worse.
No hate towards Vega as a person, but I can't take his opinion on anything related to Battlegrounds seriously. He tried to showcase Luke Cage as a viable counter to Serpent but even with perfect AI and flawless gameplay, the fight still dragged on for nearly 80 seconds. In a mode where every second counts, that kind of performance just doesn’t cut it.
As for Andy's stream, it's something I almost completely ignore. I only tuned in once when he was fighting Fin in a tournament. 90% of his stream is filled with words like 'cooked,' 'goat,' and 'mid,' the usual brainrot and the remaining 10% is just even more useless information. It's just not for me
Eh I’m the minority here but I think not nerfing him is fine. He’s harder for sure with certain nodes but he’s far from an insurmountable opponent still lol
I think a lot of the people who say he’s strong but not too strong have their standards for what’s “too strong” lower than they should be. Being able to have a clean fight against serpent doesn’t make him fair. In fact a big problem is that you can have a perfectly clean fight but it still took 70s so you lost because it was so slow. His absolute best counters like Chavez take 55s on a good fight in a neutral meta, that’s literally more of a stall than rank 3 sassy, and that’s when using one of his best counters.
In an average fight with a decent counter, it’s closer to finishing in 80-90s with 85% health which is about 46k points. In less competitive tiers of bgs you can get away with 46k points as a win most of the time. But once you reach gc, and as you climb the ranks that score becomes less and less likely to get a win. It could still have been a clean fight, but you simply didn’t have enough damage to take him down and his pierce made you eat block damage. Nothing you can do about it.
When we use the term unbalanced, we’re comparing serpent to other defenders and seeing how he’s very far above them. It’s not inherently the level of difficulty that’s the issue, it’s the fact that his level of difficulty is much higher than everyone else’s that he stands out among the crowd. (And obviously that you can’t work around his kit using skill, it’s either draft a counter or lose.) If kabam decides that the overall difficulty of bgs is too low, then the solution is not to release a broken defender who is a cut above the rest, it’s to increase the difficulty of the nodes so that many champs are made more difficult. Notice how tame most of the metas have been since serpent’s release? And the ones that weren’t made him quite clearly broken as if he wasn’t bad enough already.
He’s bad for the game in his current state, both from a competitive and design standpoint. If you don’t play bgs completely (and that’s fine you don’t have to) then you won’t feel the full effect of serpent in competitive play. He’s hurt the mode quite a bit.
Well I’ll just say I have plenty of alliance members that play bgs really heavy and none of them have complained about Serpent or were even mad he wasn’t nerfed bc even in the current meta there’s been more than a few ways around him. And besides in future metas where he MIGHT actually get broken…you could just block him as an option lol I mean that is part of the idea behind the whole ban portion at the start of bgs lol don’t wanna fight this champ? Then don’t. lol
It’s fine that they don’t, but I can also mention to you as examples top players like Trappy, Nagase, Lagacy, KT1, etc who are in favor of a nerf and have complained about him. It’s not because they have a “skill issue” as so many suggest and just suck at fighting him, but rather that serpent even if they play well is busted enough to cause a loss.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
To be fair I know some that aren’t upset about not getting nerfed too lol KT1/Lags seem to be the loudest about it but when it comes to complaints they go in one ear out the other these days. I would argue in my experience a lot of loses I’ve seen to him have been more on a skill set(or just not thinking options through lol) result tho. It’ll be fine imo tho in another month or two well probably be on to complaining some other champ is just too hard…as the cycle goes so often here lol
I’ve seen two competitive bg players with the opinions that serpent should stay the same, one being Andy (who has an r3 sig 100 serpent lol) and Vega, who is good friends with the designer of serpent. I’m not saying that Vega intentionally is taking on bias because his friend is the designer, but I do think there’s inherent and unavoidable bias just due to the position he’s in. There’s still far more competitive players in team nerf than on team no nerf. You also claim their fails are skill issues when serpent has no areas that allow you to express skill.
And again as so many others in this thread have said, comparing serpent to any other problematic defender is an unfair comparison, serpent is much much worse.
No hate towards Vega as a person, but I can't take his opinion on anything related to Battlegrounds seriously. He tried to showcase Luke Cage as a viable counter to Serpent but even with perfect AI and flawless gameplay, the fight still dragged on for nearly 80 seconds. In a mode where every second counts, that kind of performance just doesn’t cut it.
As for Andy's stream, it's something I almost completely ignore. I only tuned in once when he was fighting Fin in a tournament. 90% of his stream is filled with words like 'cooked,' 'goat,' and 'mid,' the usual brainrot and the remaining 10% is just even more useless information. It's just not for me
I still respect most of Vega’s opinions but his take on serpent was very out of character for him. That’s why I suspect some level of subconscious bias because it was very contrary to a lot of other things he’s said. The fights he showcased in defense of serpent did more against his case than they did for him. His first fight was an r3 s100 chavez against an r6 serpent in the armor meta where Chavez is supercharged. It was a clean fight but she took 69s to kill him and the dupe in the iron fist relic absolutely carried her damage in that fight. In a normal meta against an r3 serpent that’s an 80-90s fight.
As far as Andy goes his opinion was in a video he made not a stream, but yea he uses those terms a lot lol. It’s not for everyone I get it.
Lol keep deleting all the comments you want Kabam, I'm gonna make sure this thread stays at the top every single time you try to push it down by deleting comments. The only thing that will stop me from keeping this thread at the top is a ban, but they have no reason to swing that ban hammer yet so I'll just keep posting comments 💀
Lol keep deleting all the comments you want Kabam, I'm gonna make sure this thread stays at the top every single time you try to push it down by deleting comments. The only thing that will stop me from keeping this thread at the top is a ban, but they have no reason to swing that ban hammer yet so I'll just keep posting comments 💀
They’ll have to ban me to I’ll keep this thing at the top
Comments
You thread that needle so nicely that it seems like it’s part of the discussion , but really it’s off topic.
A discussion involves looking at all points. What we have here is a one-sided petition. The only thing people keep asserting is they want him nerfed in some capacity.
I'm talking about my own experience over 9 years of playing and what I've seen come to pass. You're free to disagree, but that doesn't make it off-topic just because it's not what you agree with.
Moving on.
So yeah that's a pretty bad comparison, not to mention one node doesn't absolutely break Iceman, Serpent on the other hand well we all saw how absolutely ridiculous the buff duration was last meta, even Chavez and Kushala were timing out.
I'm case you didn't gety point, I not denying we've had hard defenders, what I'm denying is the "we've been through this before" lol no we have not, no defender ever released has been as overtuned as this guy whether you want to accept that fact or not.
As far as the “just ban him” argument that I see all the time, “just ban him” is not a solution. It’s a band-aid. I as the individual can and currently do ban him if I choose to, but that ignores all the game balance issues he creates and design issues for kabam that he creates. I also don’t see why I the player should have to be at a disadvantage wasting one of my bans because Kabam can’t properly balance a champ. If serpent was a skill based defender that I just needed to learn how to fight then banning him instead of learning him would be my fault. But he’s the complete antithesis of a skill based fight, he’s an rpg ask with very few answers. This is why top players have some struggle against him, because he’s not testing their skills he’s testing their draft luck.
That was in reference to the current meta Serpent isn’t some FOREVER ban champ that you’re just gonna have to ban EVERY SINGLE TIME lol if you’re struggling with someone in a certain meta it’s ok to ban doesn’t mean you’ll have to forever from this day onward lol as for the “next Serpent” like every hard defender the community has complained about in the past were smart enough to find a way. There’s over 200 champs at this point there WILL be options I promise you😂
How do you know? We don't even have a single strong counter yet, there is absolutely no reason to assume that won't be the case when DLL already said there will be no hard counters for Serpent either.
As for your other argument, no defender in the past was as overtuned as this one, the fact that you're even trying to compare the rest of the defenders to this guy is crazy.
Serpent has sucked in every. Single. Meta. That’s the point is that he’s so easily pushed over the top in even the simplest seeming metas. And then goes way off the deep end in a meta like archaos where you’re constantly crushed or he’s unblockable. He’s been awful for Archaos. Insufferable in extend. Really bad for power snack and rich get richer. And Crit Me meta will remove his supposed best counters of Wiccan, Sym Supreme, and Kushala. Even Wolf won’t be a super great counter because of no rupture damage. Every meta makes him even worse.
And who knows, maybe defenders like domino, infinity-man, korg, could've also received a tune downs if rebalancing was in place. Kabam already said herc and kitty would've been changed.
And again as so many others in this thread have said, comparing serpent to any other problematic defender is an unfair comparison, serpent is much much worse.
As for Andy's stream, it's something I almost completely ignore. I only tuned in once when he was fighting Fin in a tournament. 90% of his stream is filled with words like 'cooked,' 'goat,' and 'mid,' the usual brainrot and the remaining 10% is just even more useless information. It's just not for me
As far as Andy goes his opinion was in a video he made not a stream, but yea he uses those terms a lot lol. It’s not for everyone I get it.
Serpent Serpent
How wonderful you are
Just kidding you suck
Please delete yourself from the game
“we’re happy with his performance as a defender so far and won’t be making any change.”