Removing Corvus timeout for good would be the downfall of Mcoc

Markjv81 · October 2021

“I should be able to exploit a game mechanic to stay in a top alliance”

ShaggyM · October 2021

I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin

BitterSteel · October 2021

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin

The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.

World Eater · October 2021

Demonzfyre said:

thepiggy said:
The root cause of Corvus cheese was a nasty map. Anyone remember map 7 launch? Crit me with your best shot. 90% reduced damage. Links everywhere and you barely made it if you had timezone issues or everyone didn't check their phone every 30 minutes.

Eventually links were reduced, nodes tuned down, and good QoL changes, but it's still the same in spirit.

Apoc boss and miniboss with insanely high special attack block damage.

Cascading failure...

Parry curse...

All or nothing lanes that incentivize outdated 5* champions. All this and many more..

Doing this 5x a week is bad enough, removing the only cushion that made it slightly bearable is even worse. Plenty of players who do map 7 are very skilled and do competitive war, so all of you Git Gud jockeys need to chill : )

The fear with map 8 isn't a lack of skill, it's resources and being punished for being f2p. It takes hours of arena to revive one champion 4k health, it's insane that still costs this much to heal. We're almost in 2022, why are we still using potions from 2018?

Time outs started with map 6.....

What, lol? I used to time out vs Map3 groot mini boss In 2017.

ShaggyM · October 2021

BitterSteel said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.

"Alliance of Corvus exploiters" well that's a stretch lol. Quite a long post to make yourself feel the last sentence of my post doesn't apply to you.

naikavon · October 2021

BitterSteel said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.

Let me get this out of the way in the beginning. I'm against the corvus method. I think it's an exploit.

My point of contention is simple: this affects the kit of a champ adversely and doesn't even fix the problem.

So all this "fix" does is stops someone at low health living if they time out. What stops those who rely on this corvus method from changing the way they implement it. As an example, let's say I use 5 hit combos and get rid of all my charges. Now I pause the game. It doesn't kill me, I lose half my health. Let's say I'm down to 42% now. Do you really believe a r3 corvus with 4 charges won't be able to finish the boss?

This "fix" does not adequately address the problem but introduces a potential adverse change to corvus' kit.

I said it earlier, and it bears repeating here, there has to be a better way. Cause this fix doesn't fix anything.

BitterSteel · October 2021

ShaggyM said:

BitterSteel said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.
"Alliance of Corvus exploiters" well that's a stretch lol. Quite a long post to make yourself feel the last sentence of my post doesn't apply to you.

Despite the rudeness you display, I’ll give it another go to explain and discuss with you respectfully. Although I rather suspect you’d use a personal attack to deflect the subject instead of responding to the points I make.

An alliance of Corvus users was an exaggeration to make the point that some players can use Corvus as a crutch to inflate their score beyond what they’d usually get if they were playing the game without the exploit. If it’s one player or 30, that’s still extra points they may not get if they relied on their skill and roster, not a broken part of the game.

Now if you’d like to respond to my post again, I’d love to discuss what I actually said to you, but otherwise feel free to again pick one tiny part of the post to pretend that’s the main point to respond to. It’s a well known deflecting method people use when they know they can’t address what was said.

Worknprogress · October 2021

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.

If you need a game exploit to climb the ladder, you should probably stay on the ground

BitterSteel · October 2021

naikavon said:

BitterSteel said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.
Let me get this out of the way in the beginning. I'm against the corvus method. I think it's an exploit.

My point of contention is simple: this affects the kit of a champ adversely and doesn't even fix the problem.

So all this "fix" does is stops someone at low health living if they time out. What stops those who rely on this corvus method from changing the way they implement it. As an example, let's say I use 5 hit combos and get rid of all my charges. Now I pause the game. It doesn't kill me, I lose half my health. Let's say I'm down to 42% now. Do you really believe a r3 corvus with 4 charges won't be able to finish the boss?

This "fix" does not adequately address the problem but introduces a potential adverse change to corvus' kit.

I said it earlier, and it bears repeating here, there has to be a better way. Cause this fix doesn't fix anything.

I think I get what you mean, since a Corvus with 100% health could time out 6 times theoretically. 100% to 50%, 50%, then 25%, then 12.5% then 6.25% then 3.125% then the last one after which you will end below 3% health and be KOd.

However, it fixes the problem. As that assumes the player doesn’t lose any health throughout the 6 time outs. And also, it removes the infinite aspect of it, and also the no-negative aspect. It makes Corvus just like any other champ. Any other champ could do that right now, but people don’t do it because it isn’t as economical as Corvus exploit.

As it stands now, if you go in you can repeat time outs to your hearts content. But after the change, there’s an actual loss to it, you lose 50% health meaning items must be used if you want to repeat it.

Essentially, it makes him like most other champions you’d play at low health for the boss. If you’re timing out with Corvus after the change, you’re gonna be using items. Which is the entire point of the change. You’re not supposed to be able to exploit the game to stop yourself using items, and get a leg up over other alliances playing the game without the exploit.

The game as it works now actually KOs champs at 3% if they time out, the difference with Corvus is he has an ability that stops him dying so when he times out he doesn’t die. That was confirmed by Kabam Miike.

So if you use Cap IW on 1% and time out today, you will get KOd. Corvus doesn’t because of his immunity. The change is only that champs who have an ability to stop them dying will no longer prevent death from time out when below 3%.

I think this fix does stop the issue, because people aren’t going to be timing out with Corvus since they will be KOd when they end a fight below 3%.

BitterSteel · October 2021

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.

Same with mercs in AW and bots in arena. I’m very much happy to pull their ladder from under them as well.

Exploits are exploits. If they’re serious like mercing and botting then ban them. If it’s less serious like a broken part of the game mode, remove that broken part of the game mode. It’s not hard and it’s not an excuse to act like a victim.

naikavon · October 2021

BitterSteel said:

naikavon said:

BitterSteel said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
The use of Corvus method influences the type of content Kabam make for AQ, if they know a lot of it can be cheesed there’s a chance they’ll make it harder, which drives a wedge between the haves and the have-nots.

There’s a precedent of this with 12.0 and the fact that everyone needed to have SW, DS, Thor etc, which is why it was rightly balanced. Also with act 6 and quake and ghost, which is why act 7 took a different turn.

Map 8 with Corvus time outs allowed would look very different to the Map 8 that we are going to get, firstly due to these cross fights, and secondly because the nodes would be different.

Even though it’s not immediately obvious that someone using Corvus in the alliance next door could affect other people, if enough people are exploiting the game, the game does change. So I’d rather they address the exploit and make future content more fun.

Not to mention the rewards aspect where an alliance of Corvus exploiters may finish every map because they aren’t using items due to a loophole, whereas those that aren’t may not finish up a day here or there and drop down. Thereby enabling the Corvus cheese users to have an artificially high score compared to their skill and item use.

If you were right, and people using the Corvus exploit didn’t affect me, I wouldn’t care less.

But say there was an exploit that let people do arena fights with half as many refills and were finishing ahead of you in the leaderboard and making you miss out on a 6* champ. I don’t think people would be saying “oh well why do you need to see other people fail?”

The principle is that this is not how the game is meant to work, it’s an exploitation where someone does 30 seconds of a fight before it gets too hard, then times out with a champion who doesn’t need to have health to do well. However you look at it, it’s an exploitation and doesn’t belong in the game.
Let me get this out of the way in the beginning. I'm against the corvus method. I think it's an exploit.

My point of contention is simple: this affects the kit of a champ adversely and doesn't even fix the problem.

So all this "fix" does is stops someone at low health living if they time out. What stops those who rely on this corvus method from changing the way they implement it. As an example, let's say I use 5 hit combos and get rid of all my charges. Now I pause the game. It doesn't kill me, I lose half my health. Let's say I'm down to 42% now. Do you really believe a r3 corvus with 4 charges won't be able to finish the boss?

This "fix" does not adequately address the problem but introduces a potential adverse change to corvus' kit.

I said it earlier, and it bears repeating here, there has to be a better way. Cause this fix doesn't fix anything.
I think I get what you mean, since a Corvus with 100% health could time out 6 times theoretically. 100% to 50%, 50%, then 25%, then 12.5% then 6.25% then 3.125% then the last one after which you will end below 3% health and be KOd.

However, it fixes the problem. As that assumes the player doesn’t lose any health throughout the 6 time outs. And also, it removes the infinite aspect of it, and also the no-negative aspect. It makes Corvus just like any other champ. Any other champ could do that right now, but people don’t do it because it isn’t as economical as Corvus exploit.

As it stands now, if you go in you can repeat time outs to your hearts content. But after the change, there’s an actual loss to it, you lose 50% health meaning items must be used if you want to repeat it.

Essentially, it makes him like most other champions you’d play at low health for the boss. If you’re timing out with Corvus after the change, you’re gonna be using items. Which is the entire point of the change. You’re not supposed to be able to exploit the game to stop yourself using items, and get a leg up over other alliances playing the game without the exploit.

The game as it works now actually KOs champs at 3% if they time out, the difference with Corvus is he has an ability that stops him dying so when he times out he doesn’t die. That was confirmed by Kabam Miike.

So if you use Cap IW on 1% and time out today, you will get KOd. Corvus doesn’t because of his immunity. The change is only that champs who have an ability to stop them dying will no longer prevent death from time out when below 3%.

I think this fix does stop the issue, because people aren’t going to be timing out with Corvus since they will be KOd when they end a fight below 3%.

I like your optimism and you do make some good points. Maybe I'm over valuing players skills. I just can't imagine there are people who need to use this exploit more than once. I mean you have to be pretty bad to have to do this 6 times with a r3 4 charge corvus but maybe there are a ton of players that bad. I haven't played with any of players that bad,, but there are a great number of players in this game I haven't played with so I'm willing to concede that point. I doubt significant item increase will happen.

We already have the 50% loss right now. That has been happening. Corvus does not need a ton of health to be effective as evidenced by using him at 1 health. Saying people will now have to use items when he's at 20% seems a stretch to me.

Nonetheless, I don't think this accomplishes what they hoped. Unless what they hoped was to get rid of a champs awakened ability. As long as it stays in this small part of the game, I'll live with it.

CoatHang3r · October 2021

Ya’ll are finally touching on what this change actually does against Corvus. It doesn’t stop him from having a couple mulligans (or even infinite with suicides and tactics) but what it does is prevents him from getting infinite mulligans on RPG fights where he is being used to bypass the intent of playing against the node; things like incinerate 30, minis/bosses, the insane people who use him as a back up against acid wash etc.

It’s doesn’t change much aside from stopping people from using him to be lazy about planning counters.

Btw all this and people don’t even know how Corvus friendly map 8 will be. Kabam designed the paths, nodes/buffs and which defenders are placed on them. Corvus might already be ineffective due to design.

Demonzfyre · October 2021

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.

Who doesn't? This is a crazy comment.

naikavon · October 2021

CoatHang3r said:
Ya’ll are finally touching on what this change actually does against Corvus. It doesn’t stop him from having a couple mulligans (or even infinite with suicides and tactics) but what it does is prevents him from getting infinite mulligans on RPG fights where he is being used to bypass the intent of playing against the node; things like incinerate 30, minis/bosses, the insane people who use him as a back up against acid wash etc.

It’s doesn’t change much aside from stopping people from using him to be lazy about planning counters.

Btw all this and people don’t even know how Corvus friendly map 8 will be. Kabam designed the paths, nodes/buffs and which defenders are placed on them. Corvus might already be ineffective due to design.

That's how I see it too.

GroundedWisdom · October 2021

Demonzfyre said:

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.
Who doesn't? This is a crazy comment.

Yes. Stealing the Rewards is the key issue here. As much as people hate losing, when they lose fairly, that's part of the game. When Alliances are relying on cheap tactics when they would otherwise not handle the content, that doesn't go over well.

BitterSteel · October 2021

thepiggy said:

BitterSteel said:

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.
Same with mercs in AW and bots in arena. I’m very much happy to pull their ladder from under them as well.

Exploits are exploits. If they’re serious like mercing and botting then ban them. If it’s less serious like a broken part of the game mode, remove that broken part of the game mode. It’s not hard and it’s not an excuse to act like a victim.

It's not a good comparison because bots and mercs are against TOS and Corvus cheese isn't.

"Exploit - make full use of and derive benefit from". It sounds bad and I agree, cheese AQ is lame but that's what every player does, make full use of a tactic or character. Corvus cheese is as much of an exploit as Quake is and Kabam claiming it's a bug is incorrect.

Contrary to what you’ve said, Corvus cheese is actually condemned in the TOS: “[A player must not] Use features of the Services for anything other than their intended purpose, including exploiting glitches for personal gain”

In the post about this change Kabam state:
“Pausing/Quitting a fight are not gameplay mechanics, but if players wanted to avert any risk at all, they would use “the Corvus cheese”” or in other words, they used a feature of the service (pausing and quitting), as an unintended gameplay mechanic (which is other than it’s intended purpose). That is pretty evidently by Kabam's own definition, against the terms of service.

And to put this beyond any doubt that it’s an unintended interaction, here in the same post they say this
“ there has been a long-standing Bug in-game where some Champions were able to survive a timeout. This is not a game mechanic that was ever intended “
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/284834/alliance-quest-season-9-and-map-8-starting-november-19-2021#latest

And way back in May of 2020, they said the same thing, " [some] Champions being able to survive a timeout at 1% Health is a bug. This breaks a rule of the structure of the game and needs to be addressed someday."
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/198635/aq-timeout/p5

You agree then, that this is definitely against the terms of service?

Rebark · October 2021

I've been playing for 6 years always the hardest map available and I never timeout corvus, I never understood the need for you guys to do that.
Maybe until 2 years ago there were patches like unstoppeable that didn't have effective answers, but nowadays we have a huge variety of champions and we don't have fights that don't have at least 2 or 3 counters

BitterSteel · October 2021

thepiggy said:

BitterSteel said:

thepiggy said:

BitterSteel said:

thepiggy said:

ShaggyM said:
I've said it before, I'll never understand why people feel the need to see other people fail. Why does anyone care what other people do? If you don't use the timeout method great but who cares what someone else does? They're are only a few hundred alliances playing map7 now. I would bet that almost all would continue to run it regardless of the timeout method being taken away. It would only a small amount of alliances spend more or replace a few players either of which should be no one else's concern. I don't use the method but I couldn't care less what someone else does. It says a lot about what kind of person you are if you want someone else to fail. Just sayin
They don't want another player climbing the ladder and "stealing their rewards", so they try pulling them down. It's the oldest thing in the world.
Same with mercs in AW and bots in arena. I’m very much happy to pull their ladder from under them as well.

Exploits are exploits. If they’re serious like mercing and botting then ban them. If it’s less serious like a broken part of the game mode, remove that broken part of the game mode. It’s not hard and it’s not an excuse to act like a victim.

It's not a good comparison because bots and mercs are against TOS and Corvus cheese isn't.

"Exploit - make full use of and derive benefit from". It sounds bad and I agree, cheese AQ is lame but that's what every player does, make full use of a tactic or character. Corvus cheese is as much of an exploit as Quake is and Kabam claiming it's a bug is incorrect.
Contrary to what you’ve said, Corvus cheese is actually condemned in the TOS: “[A player must not] Use features of the Services for anything other than their intended purpose, including exploiting glitches for personal gain”

In the post about this change Kabam state:
“Pausing/Quitting a fight are not gameplay mechanics, but if players wanted to avert any risk at all, they would use “the Corvus cheese”” or in other words, they used a feature of the service (pausing and quitting), as an unintended gameplay mechanic (which is other than it’s intended purpose). That is pretty evidently by Kabam's own definition, against the terms of service.

And to put this beyond any doubt that it’s an unintended interaction, here in the same post they say this
“ there has been a long-standing Bug in-game where some Champions were able to survive a timeout. This is not a game mechanic that was ever intended “
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/284834/alliance-quest-season-9-and-map-8-starting-november-19-2021#latest

And way back in May of 2020, they said the same thing, " [some] Champions being able to survive a timeout at 1% Health is a bug. This breaks a rule of the structure of the game and needs to be addressed someday."
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/198635/aq-timeout/p5

You agree then, that this is definitely against the terms of service?
If those things truly were a true TOS exploit, they would have sent out warning messages, immediately shut it down 2 years ago, and banned players like they do for piloting, but they didn't. Instead they tip-toed around it, let it go on, and finally pushed the change when they thought they could do it without much outrage.

Shouting "it was never intended, you're breaking the TOS!", despite it being in the character's abilities, long after the fact, is silly. It's not a bug, it's a cheesy lame feature in Corvus' kit that players used to their advantage that they let slide for 3+ years.

Whether Kabam decide to punish by bans or not, or send out warnings, it’s quite clearly breaking the terms of service. That’s not an opinion, that’s reading their terms of service. Not every terms of service violation warrants a ban or a warning every week. If they had in game warnings for every possible terms of service violation you’d have 50 messages a week.

Your definition of TOS violation being “well they would have sent out warning messages” doesn’t hold any weight whatsoever.

And the idea that they would have done something years ago proved you didn’t read the link I posted from a year and a half ago, because Miike addressed that.

“It was one of a few different solutions we were looking at, and whatever solution we decide to move forward with, we will do it with advanced warnings, proper communication, compensation, and not in the middle of AW/AQ.

To reiterate, we are not rolling with this change at this time, and don’t have a timeline for when we will address this bug or a finalized plan for how.

We don’t think that this timeout play pattern is fun or healthy for the game and want to fix it, but only after we’ve done a deeper dive into where this change will make major impacts, and we also want to address the underlying reasons why a player might choose this way to complete content.”

Regardless, Bugs and exploits are not mutually exclusive. Kabam said it’s a bug a couple weeks ago, they said it was a bug over a year ago. You can shout at the sky for as long as you want and claim it’s red, but it’s still gonna be blue.

Arguing facts isn’t something I’m interested in, so if you want to talk about something else, let me know.

ShaggyM · October 2021

If they really wanted to make this about being "fair" they would introduce a point system for deaths. This method is only used in AQ because there's no repercussions for doing it. No one uses this method in AW because it goes against your score. If they gave more AQ points for less deaths no one in the top tiers would use it. Then it would be only about skill which everyone seems to be commenting about. With this fix there will be no change in the rankings. Small revives can accomplish the same thing. I'm not against this fix, it doesn't even affect me. Even when I ran map7 I didn't use it. I just have never been about looking at other people for my own advancement. Many people keep justifying their point by making comments about people not in the right map for their skill or "they're taking my spot in the rankings". That's not the side of an argument I'd want to be on. I'd want to talk about how I could get more points for MY skill rather than the lack of someone else's.

mgj0630 · October 2021

To the folks saying it's a fundamental change to Corvus' kit, please tell me, what happens if you pause the game in an EQ fight when you're low on health??

I suspect the game just stays paused til you come to grips with the fact you're going to die when you unpause, right?

If so, it's not a fundamental change to his kit.

And all those gripes aside...what if instead of removing the Corvus timeout, Kabam just made all mini-bosses and the boss Ebony Maw? Corvus would be useless then, barring his first light attack. It would achieve the same goal of avoiding the Corvus timeout, but you wouldn't complain, cause you could just roll in with Torch (or any other miss counter).

MisterSwin · October 2021

We've been getting 5 squad revs per week. Shush

Beewee · October 2021

Divide by 0? You've had an undefined number of timeouts?

I knew someone was gonna point this out. But it wasn't gonna be me.

Removing Corvus timeout for good would be the downfall of Mcoc

Comments