**KNOWN ISSUE WITH SIDE QUEST KEYS**
We are aware of an issue impacting some Summoners, resulting in the loss of their stash of SQ entry keys.
The team will be redistributing lost keys.
Timeline is uncertain.
(Slightly) More information here.

General Game Feedback [Merged Threads]

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Comments

  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,069 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    Oh good, they deleted the boycott post and didn’t close down the thread.

    At the risk of giving this more attention than I should, it is impossible to convince anyone you represent them. Either they believe you do based on your actions, or they don't. And if they don't, but you assert you do, that's going nowhere.

    People will climb mountains and swim oceans just to tell you that you don't represent them. I think people with current situational awareness will understand my point, regardless of what side you might be on.
    I’m sorry but I have no idea what that is in reference to.
    I believe he's referring to those organizing said action, and how they don't feel represented in these discussions. It's impossible to convince them that they're being represented here. They either believe it, or they don't. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.
    Ah, I think that’s what he meant. I doubt the boycott would even happen if Kabam would just give regular updates and announcements of what they are working on.
    Let's not forget this is being tipped off by a change that isn't even happening. They're taking feedback in, and they've acknowledged it. What isn't happening is completely unreasonable demands. They can't do away with all RNG. They can't buff all Champs overnight. They aren't likely going to delete all the "trash Champs" from the Crystal, they're not likely going to stop the current Season and remove Flow because people are already underway in it (of all the requests that one is the most doable, but their stance is they will readjust after the data from this Season comes), et al.
    They're hearing it. That doesn't mean they can snap their fingers and give people whatever they want. I don't mind saying this. The whole exercise is just entitled.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,069 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    Oh good, they deleted the boycott post and didn’t close down the thread.

    At the risk of giving this more attention than I should, it is impossible to convince anyone you represent them. Either they believe you do based on your actions, or they don't. And if they don't, but you assert you do, that's going nowhere.

    People will climb mountains and swim oceans just to tell you that you don't represent them. I think people with current situational awareness will understand my point, regardless of what side you might be on.
    I’m sorry but I have no idea what that is in reference to.
    I believe he's referring to those organizing said action, and how they don't feel represented in these discussions. It's impossible to convince them that they're being represented here. They either believe it, or they don't. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.
    Ah, I think that’s what he meant. I doubt the boycott would even happen if Kabam would just give regular updates and announcements of what they are working on.
    Let's not forget this is being tipped off by a change that isn't even happening. They're taking feedback in, and they've acknowledged it. What isn't happening is completely unreasonable demands. They can't do away with all RNG. They can't buff all Champs overnight. They aren't likely going to delete all the "trash Champs" from the Crystal, they're not likely going to stop the current Season and remove Flow because people are already underway in it (of all the requests that one is the most doable, but their stance is they will readjust after the data from this Season comes), et al.
    They're hearing it. That doesn't mean they can snap their fingers and give people whatever they want. I don't mind saying this. The whole exercise is just entitled.
    I don’t think anyone expects Kabam to resolve these issues overnight, I think most people expect what we have been asking for: open communication and a clear plan of what they will do. I don’t think the boycott is entitled and I support it, but the forums is not the place to talk about it.
    I've outlined the various points they've already addressed, and larger points are being discussed by them. They've indicated as much. Have they systematically answered every issue in this Thread? No. The largest points have been addressed, and they can't provide much on something they're still talking about. More will be outlined in June.
    I don't support actions like that, never have. It's not the appropriate way to communicate. However, I would be less inclined to argue had they been issues that weren't already being looked at. I don't care who's behind it. Ignoring the discussions already taking place and refusing to acknowledge that those issues have already been heard is ignorant. That's the most appropriate language to use for it.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,069 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    Oh good, they deleted the boycott post and didn’t close down the thread.

    At the risk of giving this more attention than I should, it is impossible to convince anyone you represent them. Either they believe you do based on your actions, or they don't. And if they don't, but you assert you do, that's going nowhere.

    People will climb mountains and swim oceans just to tell you that you don't represent them. I think people with current situational awareness will understand my point, regardless of what side you might be on.
    I’m sorry but I have no idea what that is in reference to.
    I believe he's referring to those organizing said action, and how they don't feel represented in these discussions. It's impossible to convince them that they're being represented here. They either believe it, or they don't. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.
    Ah, I think that’s what he meant. I doubt the boycott would even happen if Kabam would just give regular updates and announcements of what they are working on.
    Let's not forget this is being tipped off by a change that isn't even happening. They're taking feedback in, and they've acknowledged it. What isn't happening is completely unreasonable demands. They can't do away with all RNG. They can't buff all Champs overnight. They aren't likely going to delete all the "trash Champs" from the Crystal, they're not likely going to stop the current Season and remove Flow because people are already underway in it (of all the requests that one is the most doable, but their stance is they will readjust after the data from this Season comes), et al.
    They're hearing it. That doesn't mean they can snap their fingers and give people whatever they want. I don't mind saying this. The whole exercise is just entitled.
    I don’t think anyone expects Kabam to resolve these issues overnight, I think most people expect what we have been asking for: open communication and a clear plan of what they will do. I don’t think the boycott is entitled and I support it, but the forums is not the place to talk about it.
    I've outlined the various points they've already addressed, and larger points are being discussed by them. They've indicated as much. Have they systematically answered every issue in this Thread? No. The largest points have been addressed, and they can't provide much on something they're still talking about. More will be outlined in June.
    I don't support actions like that, never have. It's not the appropriate way to communicate. However, I would be less inclined to argue had they been issues that weren't already being looked at. I don't care who's behind it. Ignoring the discussions already taking place and refusing to acknowledge that those issues have already been heard is ignorant. That's the most appropriate language to use for it.
    Why isn’t a boycott and appropriate way to communicate? Players are under no obligation to spend their money on this game, so deciding not to spend is totally an appropriate response. And Kabam haven’t addressed the main concerns yet, we’re still waiting for that in the June roadmap. The short term roadmap they released was what they were already working on. We know they’re discussing the concerns but we don’t know how or what they are discussing to fix it. That’s the issue people have, the lack of proper communication. And, again, these aren’t new complaints, people have been complaining about this stuff for years and ever since Act 6 came out. If anyone is being ignorant, it’s Kabam. I myself will be waiting until the June Roadmap comes out to decide what I will do on July 4th.
    Extortion is never a reasonable way to communicate.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,069 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    Oh good, they deleted the boycott post and didn’t close down the thread.

    At the risk of giving this more attention than I should, it is impossible to convince anyone you represent them. Either they believe you do based on your actions, or they don't. And if they don't, but you assert you do, that's going nowhere.

    People will climb mountains and swim oceans just to tell you that you don't represent them. I think people with current situational awareness will understand my point, regardless of what side you might be on.
    I’m sorry but I have no idea what that is in reference to.
    I believe he's referring to those organizing said action, and how they don't feel represented in these discussions. It's impossible to convince them that they're being represented here. They either believe it, or they don't. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.
    Ah, I think that’s what he meant. I doubt the boycott would even happen if Kabam would just give regular updates and announcements of what they are working on.
    Let's not forget this is being tipped off by a change that isn't even happening. They're taking feedback in, and they've acknowledged it. What isn't happening is completely unreasonable demands. They can't do away with all RNG. They can't buff all Champs overnight. They aren't likely going to delete all the "trash Champs" from the Crystal, they're not likely going to stop the current Season and remove Flow because people are already underway in it (of all the requests that one is the most doable, but their stance is they will readjust after the data from this Season comes), et al.
    They're hearing it. That doesn't mean they can snap their fingers and give people whatever they want. I don't mind saying this. The whole exercise is just entitled.
    I don’t think anyone expects Kabam to resolve these issues overnight, I think most people expect what we have been asking for: open communication and a clear plan of what they will do. I don’t think the boycott is entitled and I support it, but the forums is not the place to talk about it.
    I've outlined the various points they've already addressed, and larger points are being discussed by them. They've indicated as much. Have they systematically answered every issue in this Thread? No. The largest points have been addressed, and they can't provide much on something they're still talking about. More will be outlined in June.
    I don't support actions like that, never have. It's not the appropriate way to communicate. However, I would be less inclined to argue had they been issues that weren't already being looked at. I don't care who's behind it. Ignoring the discussions already taking place and refusing to acknowledge that those issues have already been heard is ignorant. That's the most appropriate language to use for it.
    Why isn’t a boycott and appropriate way to communicate? Players are under no obligation to spend their money on this game, so deciding not to spend is totally an appropriate response. And Kabam haven’t addressed the main concerns yet, we’re still waiting for that in the June roadmap. The short term roadmap they released was what they were already working on. We know they’re discussing the concerns but we don’t know how or what they are discussing to fix it. That’s the issue people have, the lack of proper communication. And, again, these aren’t new complaints, people have been complaining about this stuff for years and ever since Act 6 came out. If anyone is being ignorant, it’s Kabam. I myself will be waiting until the June Roadmap comes out to decide what I will do on July 4th.
    Extortion is never a reasonable way to communicate.
    Dude a boycott is not extortion. Extortion would more like kidnapping someone from Kabam to force them to make changes. Boycotting is exercising their rights as spenders. Besides, Kabam makes more than enough money for a one week boycott to hurt them, this is a demonstration of how serious these issues are to us. What would you have them do? Continue their regular spending habits on something they no longer want to support?
    I can assure you the word extortion is appropriate. Choosing not to spend is one thing. Organizing a demonstration to get their own way is another. I think you're minimizing it just a bit. That's not what's going on. I'm also not delving into this anymore, so you can feel free to support whatever you like. I'm not agreeing with the altruism justification.
  • slackerslacker Posts: 772 ★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    ESF said:

    Seriously, though. Honest question: Why does it cost us anything to switch Masteries?

    I mean, I guess Kabam could say "why should it be free" and that is an answer, but we already know they can turn the respec costs off whenever they want and that players have to pay to unlock them with units they either grinded for or purchased in the first place.

    At some point, maybe it would be OK to admit that cow has been milked dry and unlock respec costs permanently for those who have done what it takes to get them

    This is just my opinion, based on my experience with other games. Most games go through an evolution on this. To start, the idea is that masteries, or other build-like structures in the game, are something that players should think about as they unlock and enable. There must be some opportunity cost associated with picking this mastery over that mastery. If you take this one, you can't take that one. Because if you can have everything, then the choices are meaningless. So the choices are irreversible.

    As the game matures, you enter a period where a sizeable percentage of your more veteran players have already done everything they can do with these builds, and are stuck with them forever. The irreversibility start looking less like a way to make the choices interesting and more like a shackle where players cannot explore other possibilities anymore. So the game starts to allow for respecification - you can change your build, but it costs something. This way you can't just turn on whatever you want whenever you want in an unlimited fashion, because again, that would make choices meaningless. You're almost in the situation where you have everything on all the time, just situationally. But you can now explore what the game looks like with a different build.

    At some point, the meta gaming situation often changes again, to where the idea of build switching becomes less the exception and more the norm in dealing with content. As content continues to get more complex, the developers of the content increasingly leverage differences in builds to offer increasingly high advantages and disadvantages to certain build options. And with that comes the belief that players should have the ability to change builds to counter content challenges. And that's usually when build-switching starts to become the norm, and most of the friction associated with it goes away, at least to a point. This is where you get switchable setups, and this is often where you get low or zero cost switching.

    So my answer to the question of why mastery switches have costs is I believe the Kabam developers currently see masteries as something players should be allowed to explore, but not allowed to leverage situationally. You're supposed to be able to see what it is like to play for a week or a month with one set up, and then another week or month with another set up, so the costs need to be high enough to make it difficult to switch constantly, but low enough to be reasonable if done infrequently. Costs will disappear when the devs decide that masteries are supposed to be a tool players can use per map, or even per fight if they want to, and they no longer care about the opportunity costs of having different masteries as much.
    All of this is generally true in other games, but by now other games would usually include a second "page" for a second set of masteries. A very simple solution to the mastery issue is after using cores, there's no cost to respec. You get a second page that costs a nominal cost to swap to, say 25 units, at level 60. At level 60, you unlock the ability to purchase additional pages on a sliding scale. Page 3 is say $5, page 4 is $10, page 5 is $15. You still keep the nominal fee for switching but the time to switch is reduced, Kabam still makes money off the pages, and players can switch up their masteries on the fly for different game modes.
    If I understand what you're saying, they way I've seen it most often is not to charge for swapping, but to charge for the additional builds. So you do XYZ to unlock build #2, but then you have to buy build #2 when it is unlocked. Once you've bought it, you can populate it with a different build and switch between B1 and B2 (which for MCOC would be a complete mastery setup). If you're concerned about over-switching, you use a cooldown. So rather than pay to switch, once you switch build you can't switch again for some period of time, a day, and hour, something.
    I think we should seperate the main mastery and AW mastery, cause they could switch between non-suicide when they off and suicide when they attack that cause imbalance( I think so ?)
  • DMAN232DMAN232 Posts: 26
    Kabam any news on what you have planned given the genuine feelings of the majority of your player base.
    Most feel that you are disengaged from the community and more communication is needed.
    Even if you don't know how you are going to win the players back please acknowledge that changes are needed and can you respond to these concerns raised?

    By not doing anything you risk alienating more of your players/customers
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 36,069 ★★★★★

    DNA3000 said:

    Oh good, they deleted the boycott post and didn’t close down the thread.

    At the risk of giving this more attention than I should, it is impossible to convince anyone you represent them. Either they believe you do based on your actions, or they don't. And if they don't, but you assert you do, that's going nowhere.

    People will climb mountains and swim oceans just to tell you that you don't represent them. I think people with current situational awareness will understand my point, regardless of what side you might be on.
    I’m sorry but I have no idea what that is in reference to.
    I believe he's referring to those organizing said action, and how they don't feel represented in these discussions. It's impossible to convince them that they're being represented here. They either believe it, or they don't. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.
    Ah, I think that’s what he meant. I doubt the boycott would even happen if Kabam would just give regular updates and announcements of what they are working on.
    Let's not forget this is being tipped off by a change that isn't even happening. They're taking feedback in, and they've acknowledged it. What isn't happening is completely unreasonable demands. They can't do away with all RNG. They can't buff all Champs overnight. They aren't likely going to delete all the "trash Champs" from the Crystal, they're not likely going to stop the current Season and remove Flow because people are already underway in it (of all the requests that one is the most doable, but their stance is they will readjust after the data from this Season comes), et al.
    They're hearing it. That doesn't mean they can snap their fingers and give people whatever they want. I don't mind saying this. The whole exercise is just entitled.
    I don’t think anyone expects Kabam to resolve these issues overnight, I think most people expect what we have been asking for: open communication and a clear plan of what they will do. I don’t think the boycott is entitled and I support it, but the forums is not the place to talk about it.
    I've outlined the various points they've already addressed, and larger points are being discussed by them. They've indicated as much. Have they systematically answered every issue in this Thread? No. The largest points have been addressed, and they can't provide much on something they're still talking about. More will be outlined in June.
    I don't support actions like that, never have. It's not the appropriate way to communicate. However, I would be less inclined to argue had they been issues that weren't already being looked at. I don't care who's behind it. Ignoring the discussions already taking place and refusing to acknowledge that those issues have already been heard is ignorant. That's the most appropriate language to use for it.
    Why isn’t a boycott and appropriate way to communicate? Players are under no obligation to spend their money on this game, so deciding not to spend is totally an appropriate response. And Kabam haven’t addressed the main concerns yet, we’re still waiting for that in the June roadmap. The short term roadmap they released was what they were already working on. We know they’re discussing the concerns but we don’t know how or what they are discussing to fix it. That’s the issue people have, the lack of proper communication. And, again, these aren’t new complaints, people have been complaining about this stuff for years and ever since Act 6 came out. If anyone is being ignorant, it’s Kabam. I myself will be waiting until the June Roadmap comes out to decide what I will do on July 4th.
    Extortion is never a reasonable way to communicate.
    Dude a boycott is not extortion. Extortion would more like kidnapping someone from Kabam to force them to make changes. Boycotting is exercising their rights as spenders. Besides, Kabam makes more than enough money for a one week boycott to hurt them, this is a demonstration of how serious these issues are to us. What would you have them do? Continue their regular spending habits on something they no longer want to support?
    I can assure you the word extortion is appropriate. Choosing not to spend is one thing. Organizing a demonstration to get their own way is another. I think you're minimizing it just a bit. That's not what's going on. I'm also not delving into this anymore, so you can feel free to support whatever you like. I'm not agreeing with the altruism justification.


    If you want to use a word you don't quite understand, just ask google. It's super easy to learn new stuff and improve yourself.
    You just gave the definition that supported my use of the word. I'm not getting pulled into any more of that aspect of the discussion. I think the entire movement is beyond disrespectful. It's been brought up so many times now that it's just a tactic to get what people want at this point. We're not Nurses fighting for fair wages. We're not Postal Workers that are overworked and underpaid. We're Gamers who play a mobile game. We have every right to say what we would like to see. We also have a choice as to whether we want to play it or not. Threatening to stop playing until we get our way is just manipulation. We're not entitled to get what we want. Not at all. When you add the fact that they've already heard the issues people brought up and others are still not satisfied because they're taking time to process, that's just ridiculous. That's how I feel on it, and we might as well put a period at the end of that sentence because I'm not going to risk my Forum Account over something I won't change my mind on. It's altogether in bad form.
  • Morpheus_123Morpheus_123 Posts: 792 ★★★
    Seems there has been a lot of boycotting talk while I had a sleep!

    As much as some aspects of the game annoy me, and I've suggested improvements myself, I don't think there is any need for that kind of talk. Boycotting is for serious situations when people have paid for goods/services and they are not getting what they have paid for. Has that happened to anyone?!

    I'm not the first, and probably not the last to say, if you are genuinely that unhappy with the game that boycotting is a something you're thinking about, then your better off deleting the app and getting on with your life. I don't mean that in a disrespectful way, there is just more important things to do in life.

    I used to play a game called Killshot, and the developers were constantly back tracking their offers once people had paid or worked hard in game to get them. That is a boycotting scenario, this is just people wanting the developers to make they game how they want it. Not the same.

    Thanks.
  • ChobblyChobbly Posts: 805 ★★★★
    CHIEF1121 said:

    Not sure if it’s been mentioned in prior posts or not. One potential fix for the champion requirement issues or repeated “bad pulls” would be to add an option to spin the Crystal one additional time if you receive an unsatisfactory result the first time.

    That's a great idea. Or if that wasn't palatable to Kabam make it a once per day ability, or make it only available if the first spin was a dupe. Or maybe just for 5* and 6* crystals. There's lots of options for this.

    Having just duped Daredevil (Netflix) as the reward for completing Act 5, this would really be appreciated...
  • cookiedealercookiedealer Posts: 260 ★★
    edited May 2020

    Unio77 said:

    To be honest I think a boycott is a very immature way of communication. Yes kabam have communicated with us and ppl want them to talk to us about future plans and all that but if they tell us what their planning and their progress every two days it will take that a certain thing away from it. (I dont really know how to explain it so plz dont ask for ine)

    I just think kabam havent been communicating as much with us lately becuase they are already teing to relieve the issues that we are bringing to them and these issues will take time to fix

    Ya'll just need to be patient. Theres always light at the end of the tunnel

    Immature?
    How long has the community asked for 30 min timers in AQ?
    How long has the community said remove act 6 gates?
    How long has the community asked to 6 star arena or 5 star basic arena?

    Now if there was no history of being ignored and these issues got addressed as they came up we wouldn't be here but to say its immature. I just believe that is a troll comment.
    So part of the problem is people feel ignore- makes sense. Another is, people want to hear how Kabam views the proposed methods solutions (we need to be specific), and what are they currently working related to playerbase pain points (so increased transparency).

    I agree, if there was more historical communication, more changes/buffs implemented, players wouldn't be as upset.

    Personally, I think it's more the long standing issues that players want to talk about/be fixed (Masteries, very little to play for for some, crystal RNG, very specific quest counters required, that node that requires players to have all champs alive, buffs/adjustments to champs/crystals, AW one global dominance). Some of these will take time to fix. However, I don't expect Kabam to address these problems with only one of the ways you've proposed. At least people are trying to provide possible solutions. I fall into the camp of, let's give Kabam some time to take in our feedback and hear their longer term roadmap.

    AQ and quality of life. The reduced AQ timers is one way to go about. Some ways: less link nodes, increase the AQ energy capacity, some node/champ combinations need be rethought, and/or have not too hard items to unlock that gives 3 or 5 AQ energy. Kabam may want enough attachfulness from players than what players want, so the solution may fall in between.

    ACT 6 difficulty. Act 6 gates may have been too harsh. 4 of each class is tough. The number of gates found is also a factor. I think that combined with certain nodes, make Act 6 a much higher roster+skill leap from Act 5 to 6.

    5 or 6 star arena is one way to unlock more specific access to champs for a very small part of the playerbase (those who grind arena for top rank rewards, top 150 level, or bot) and those who don't. This doesn't sound like it is addressing the major pain points of the playerbase. Better would be buffing the first 3 milestones of each arena? (If we're thinking about the majority, else it wouldn't really change much for people who don't grind for top 150 for whatever the reason).

    Better would be a different set of content/design/challenges that more people can participate in and not require 3 days windows of non-stop grinding, but at each individual's pace, say over a course of 2 weeks to 2 months, that can also unlock more ways for players to increase their odds for select champs. Similar to dungeons/incursion rewards, but for 6*s? This method of increasing 6*, and specific 6* will also fall in the category of who quality of life, but not sure if Kabam wants specific 6*s to be attained that quickly for playerbase across the board.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 7,233 ★★★★★

    Unio77 said:



    I just think kabam havent been communicating as much with us lately becuase they are already teing to relieve the issues that we are bringing to them and these issues will take time to fix

    Ya'll just need to be patient. Theres always light at the end of the tunnel

    I disagree. Perception is reality and Public Relations firms exist for a reason.

    Kabam may be actively working behind the scenes to try and improve their game, but if they're not engaging with the community, the community is left to wonder what's going on. Over the years, Kabam has given the community too many reasons to not take them at their word:

    -All champions have the same speed and cadence to all their moves
    -Sentinel's L1 has always been incredibly hard to punish
    -Archangel's passive stun is meant to bypass limber and stun immunity

    The list goes on. Either by making erroneous statements or walking back previously made statements, Kabam has made the community skeptical because they have cultivated an image of distrust.

    When a person or a company wants to change their image, they can hire a PR firm/manager to help. The PR firm's job is to make sure community engagement is on-point and on-message so the person/company can slowly adjust their image or public perception.

    Kabam could do this, though they don't have to hire a PR firm. They could simply commit a single person to come to this thread daily. The job would not be to give status updates, but rather to make a post that crystallizes all the concerns brought up that day. Make a list of the concerns and then forward that to the game team. For review. This could happen 5 days per week until the new roadmap is released.

    If a representative from Kabam commented on this thread regularly to engage with the players, could you imagine how much tension that would relieve? One of the main concerns I'm hearing is transparency and the lack thereof from the game team. The roadmap helps, but it pales in comparison to regular community engagement.
    While in general I agree with the sentiment of this, I don't really blame them for being hesitant to say much of anything until there's something concrete and decided on to say. Anytime they say anything and then change something you just get a bunch of "but but but you said..." rabble afterward.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 7,233 ★★★★★
    If they come out and say they're looking at x but don't actually make a major or any change to x, I can only imagine the "constructive feedback" they'd get here
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