Flow global node in War [Merged Threads]

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  • Mirage_TurtleMirage_Turtle Posts: 1,868 ★★★★

    still no new info about this from administrators? Yeh I was thinking right, its next season now probably

    I think that was a given. I can't think of a single major player-side AW change that they implemented during the season. If they implement a change, it'll be during the off-season. I just wish that they didn't wait so long for player concerns to fester before making an announcement.

    They have plenty of data and player input. They have already made a decision on whether or not they're going to change it. Why not announce that decision even if the implementation of that change is still a few weeks out? It would go a long way for transparency and player satisfaction. Not saying anything just feels like players are being blown off.
  • SeraphionSeraphion Posts: 1,496 ★★★★

    still no new info about this from administrators? Yeh I was thinking right, its next season now probably

    I think that was a given. I can't think of a single major player-side AW change that they implemented during the season. If they implement a change, it'll be during the off-season. I just wish that they didn't wait so long for player concerns to fester before making an announcement.

    They have plenty of data and player input. They have already made a decision on whether or not they're going to change it. Why not announce that decision even if the implementation of that change is still a few weeks out? It would go a long way for transparency and player satisfaction. Not saying anything just feels like players are being blown off.
    Yes. We for exmaple want to prep for next season. We went easy on this season bc of flow. I dont want to tell my teammates to R5 crossbones or rank up champs just for flow def to be honest. It hurts to do that.
  • Amazing_Demon05Amazing_Demon05 Posts: 2,949 ★★★★★
    i tried fighting a warlock the other day and it was mad how he got to near to sp3 i barely made him throw that sp2 and then i did one more combo and he filled his sp3 it was absolutely unbelievable. I don't have a g2099, am I being punished for that? lol
  • pseudosanepseudosane Posts: 2,196 ★★★★★
    yeah to fight these annoying defenders, ive had to switch my team to only three attackers, void magik and g99. It sucks. Asking my teammates to take out niche fights while i have to fight the flow boys.
  • SeraphionSeraphion Posts: 1,496 ★★★★
    edited May 2020
    In the last 5 wars the enemy went straight for the bosses vs us. Looks like a lot alliances gave up on clearing the map 100%.

    We skip some lanes as well if we see that.
    And Im talking about warrating ~ 3.100 (Tier 2 War)

    Flow broke War
  • Amazing_Demon05Amazing_Demon05 Posts: 2,949 ★★★★★
    I wish we had some kind of news like are they gonna remove this node or are they gonna remove defense tactics totally or what exactly are they gonna do So I can prepare my roster that way
  • Amadeo01Amadeo01 Posts: 201 ★★★
    A l p h a said:

    TL:DR... I see most people are saying things like bring void, or cap and tech, or doc ock etc... Against most nodes where you can stun the opponents it annoying but controllable, against stun immune there are less counters but still doable... But against debuff immune... Lets say debuff immune warlock with flow... I know of only 3 counters, Magik with heavy boosts, guillotine 2099 with a soul charge or a very skilled quake player! 2 of those being situational!

    War is supposed to be a fun yet competitive game mode... BUT THIS ISN'T FUN, when you can only bring the same maybe 10 champions that can actually fight well against this node. If you haven't been lucky enough to pull them... Tough luck! That's straight BS! I get there are some champs better than others for war, but I used to like seeing people bring unique attackers, I myself am a huge elsa user, but due to her high crit rate is practically unusable against flow! Honestly war was alot more fun without these global nodes...

    They should be a small simple bonus not completely change the fights! Say maybe extra 50% special damage, or 20% passive permenant armor, or a passive 50% fury if either foe is in the corner... Small bonuses that make them different but not make the fights only have specific counters!

    Thanks to anyone who bothered to read it!

    I completely agree with you. Flow is by far the most limiting, but even Siphon was/is terrible, especially before it got adjusted a bit. I think modifiers in general have just made war much worse. Like dodge, which was the initial modifier everyone used when they were first introduced. It doesn't change how you play really, it just gives you some RNG chance that you'll get randomly evaded and get killed right away. It didn't make wars any more fun.

    I also think if they're going to leave these kind of modifiers in, like siphon giving block penetration, flow giving some power gain...etc., can just leave it like that instead of adding in all the extra health and attack bonuses while benefiting from it.
  • Amadeo01Amadeo01 Posts: 201 ★★★

    I wish we had some kind of news like are they gonna remove this node or are they gonna remove defense tactics totally or what exactly are they gonna do So I can prepare my roster that way

    Yea, people are literally just ranking up relatively useless champs just b/c as long as they benefit from flow, they're golden. And if anyone's actually taking crossbones to r5...well...if flow gets nerfed (hopefully), then that would have been a complete waste of resources.
  • OdapoltronaOdapoltrona Posts: 11
    kabam bunch of **** mercenary
  • OdapoltronaOdapoltrona Posts: 11
    Aw is suck couse this node, most of the node is stun imune HOW WE FIGHT IN THIS SITUATION? STUN IMUNE, IMUNI OF DEBUFF? HOW WE FIGHT WITH THIS **** NODEE .....IDIOTSS
  • OdapoltronaOdapoltrona Posts: 11
    Who is the creator of this node idea? Let me know so i can make a visit.
  • Stamatakos24Stamatakos24 Posts: 23
    As far as I can understand Kabam is desperate to find a way for players to spend money and items in war...so they ended in a solution called “flow”. But it is really desperate...MCOC has so many champions and you can not play with them due to this global node. They are pathetic because there is no point in playing...there is no strategy in it...so for them are more units, more stash equal more money!! That’s all...more money. They do not care about players playing and enjoying the game but how they will take you more and more!!! And above all they call it “competitive” war with season rewards that do not represent the difficulty of the season...honestly I wish they lose more and more players because this is the only way to understand what they are doing.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 30,443 ★★★★★
    I'd hardly call it desperate. It's intended to provide a challenge level. Not to milk people. Whether or not they overshot the mark is on the table, for sure.
  • Stamatakos24Stamatakos24 Posts: 23
    Challenge? Where is challenge? MCOC has over 200 champs and you can play flow3 with how many? ( ghost trinity, Quake and Corvus-Magik with tones of boost ) where is the challenge in this? Where is the challenge when with 1 critical hit the opponent gain 45% of power meter? What is this...you call it gaming? Suppose that I do not have all these players above...can I play? The answer is no! As far it goes for me they do want to milk players...
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 30,443 ★★★★★

    I'd hardly call it desperate. It's intended to provide a challenge level. Not to milk people. Whether or not they overshot the mark is on the table, for sure.

    OMG do we again have the kid who has never played in high tier AW talking about high tier AW, also talking about the node that he has also never played against?? Dude, just realize when you’re out of your league, for gosh sakes.
    What are you talking about? I said it wasn't just designed to bleed people of money. Where did I even register an opinion on how it was fighting it? Do you realize how obtuse that same rebuttal sounds when it doesn't even pertain to what I said? Same response over and over. "You're not in that Tier."
    Very good. I'm not. Now how about what I actually said?!
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 30,443 ★★★★★
    That's one of the most common responses on here. It's a cash grab. Has it ever occurred to people that designing something is about a specific design goal, and not money?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 30,443 ★★★★★

    Challenge? Where is challenge? MCOC has over 200 champs and you can play flow3 with how many? ( ghost trinity, Quake and Corvus-Magik with tones of boost ) where is the challenge in this? Where is the challenge when with 1 critical hit the opponent gain 45% of power meter? What is this...you call it gaming? Suppose that I do not have all these players above...can I play? The answer is no! As far it goes for me they do want to milk players...

    It may have 200 Champs, but you're not going to be able to use all 200 options for Tier 1-5. Especially with a mechanic that's meant to limit the other side. That's the point of these Nodes. To stop the opponent up. Now, is it too limiting? I'll leave the team and you guys to decide. I'm not arguing it isn't. However, added challenge is the end goal of Defense Tactics. Make it harder for your opponent to win. I don't disagree that it's too much. I'm not saying either way. I just think it's nonsensical to expect to use any Champs when the point of these Nodes is to limit options.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 30,443 ★★★★★
    At the basic level, the game provides a challenge by narrowing down the options you have for fighting. Using specific Champs, combining them with Nodes, increasing Base Stats and Sigs, limiting Rarities, etc. There are a number of ways to do this, but the same basic principle applies. The higher you go, the harder it gets, and the more specific your choices become.
  • Amazing_Demon05Amazing_Demon05 Posts: 2,949 ★★★★★
    edited May 2020

    I'd hardly call it desperate. It's intended to provide a challenge level. Not to milk people. Whether or not they overshot the mark is on the table, for sure.

    OMG do we again have the kid who has never played in high tier AW talking about high tier AW, also talking about the node that he has also never played against?? Dude, just realize when you’re out of your league, for gosh sakes.
    What are you talking about? I said it wasn't just designed to bleed people of money. Where did I even register an opinion on how it was fighting it? Do you realize how obtuse that same rebuttal sounds when it doesn't even pertain to what I said? Same response over and over. "You're not in that Tier."
    Very good. I'm not. Now how about what I actually said?!
    because not fighting the node you don't get just how ridiculous it is. you don't get what the people here are feeling after fighting a flow war.
    so while the people here maybe right or wrong about talking about whether it is a cash grab or not. YOU actually have no right to "express your views" when you "actually" haven't even ever faced it and don't understand what we on t1-t5 go through everyday.
    If someone on t1-t5 said this people might even debate about it but debating with you would be pure bs considering you have no experience with it.
    You keep making statements and when someone points out that you are not in their tier so you won't know, you just reply with that what you say doesn't matters whether you are in the t1-t5 bracket or not.
    But it does, because you have no idea what the player base has gone through in war this whole season. Then again I am sure you still won't stop making baseless statements on your own because you can't accept the fact that this isn't a thread where you enough experience to spout nonsense like the other threads.


    I even explained how you flow restricts 3 champs to be used only and you still keep going on and on about diversity when flow keeps stopping exactly that. See this i where your knowledge about this topic ends. please stop it.
  • Liss_Bliss_Liss_Bliss_ Posts: 1,740 ★★★★★
    Amadeo01 said:

    I wish we had some kind of news like are they gonna remove this node or are they gonna remove defense tactics totally or what exactly are they gonna do So I can prepare my roster that way

    Yea, people are literally just ranking up relatively useless champs just b/c as long as they benefit from flow, they're golden. And if anyone's actually taking crossbones to r5...well...if flow gets nerfed (hopefully), then that would have been a complete waste of resources.
    I am contemplating just that. I have the resources to take Crossbones to r4 and then just have to wait a month to take him to r5. He is really the only flow counter I have. But I know the moment I take him up they will balance flow like they did siphon. And I would have wasted valuable resources I could have used on champs I actually want to rank.
  • SeraphionSeraphion Posts: 1,496 ★★★★
    edited May 2020

    That's one of the most common responses on here. It's a cash grab. Has it ever occurred to people that designing something is about a specific design goal, and not money?

    I would agree, but why is it that every single time, the player base just becomes a test subject for the nodes for an entire season or two before something is thought out? Why can't the developers do tests, run Beta like how they do with Act 6 or Act 7? They designed the node wrongly. When it was pointed out, they just changed the description and said it was intended.
    292 posts on this thread, and only 1 or 2 are from a moderator, first combining all the threads and then saying that we've forwarded it.
    Over a month of complaints and we've had literally no response.
    And that is where the cashgrab argument comes in. I dont like to call out kabam for things they dont do but every defender tactic that comes after the other is overtuned.

    They get worse the longer we play. The evade meta was okay at countering. It was the best of bad ones.
    Bullwark was just super overtuned. Then came siphon. Now flow. They always run for so long until they are changed.

    They are very bad at managing the war (they react SUPER slow to broken things in war) OR it goes as they want. I dont know which is worse.

    Their goal with war globals flopped big time. I hope they just delete them.

    And here a picture how Wars in Tier 2 are played in the moment at around ~3.100 warrating:







    Thats the endscreen btw.
    Everyone just goes for bosses and tries to skip as many lanes as possible.
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