LMFAO it took Seatin to make a video for kabam miike to decide to make this yesterday's total priority in discussions, and for kabam to actually start a lengthy discussion about our complaints, that just sucks TBH.
40 sheeps, that don't have an opinion of their own
Okay, that's enough. Just because we agree with the guy, it doesn't mean we don't have our own opinion. Calling anyone who disagrees with you 'sheep'? What're you, 5?
Everyone's constructively putting forward what they feel is wrong with the game, Kabam themselves said that they're looking into our complaints. The community needed a spark to light this long line of complaints that were being held back, and you'd think that the biggest MCOC YouTuber making a video on these things would be enough of a spark.
But no, of course anyone who disagrees with you is a sheep. You've got it all figured out, you're the best player there is, there simply cannot be people who think differently than you. And if anyone does, they obviously don't have their own opinion, they're just sheep.
Honestly, mate. Just stop, if you have something to add to the discussion, then by all means do it. If you don't, leave.
LMFAO it took Seatin to make a video for kabam miike to decide to make this yesterday's total priority in discussions, and for kabam to actually start a lengthy discussion about our complaints, that just sucks TBH.
People have had these opinions and thoughts for a very long time... Its always been there! All it needed was a push to get it going, Love him or hate him, Seatin is one of the biggest influencers in the MCOC community... When even he. Who has been able to make a living playing this game, has said he's had enough, thats the Catalyst needed to say, "you know what, he's right" we need to give our honest opinion and admit the content released in act 6 and other areas is boring, frustrating and irritating! There's no fun in content where it's a case of "bring this champ or spend a ton of money" otherwise what's the point of building a roster full of champions, if only 5 to 10 of them can actually be used in the game effectively! The game is reaching its end point if this is the direction it continues!
LMFAO it took Seatin to make a video for kabam miike to decide to make this yesterday's total priority in discussions, and for kabam to actually start a lengthy discussion about our complaints, that just sucks TBH.
People have had these opinions and thoughts for a very long time... Its always been there! All it needed was a push to get it going, Love him or hate him, Seatin is one of the biggest influencers in the MCOC community... When even he. Who has been able to make a living playing this game, has said he's had enough, thats the Catalyst needed to say, "you know what, he's right" we need to give our honest opinion and admit the content released in act 6 and other areas is boring, frustrating and irritating! There's no fun in content where it's a case of "bring this champ or spend a ton of money" otherwise what's the point of building a roster full of champions, if only 5 to 10 of them can actually be used in the game effectively! The game is reaching its end point if this is the direction it continues!
Damn, beat me to it. Was about to write my own thoughts on this exact thing.
Hey everyone, I am a bit late to the party, but lemme just quickly write my opinion and catch up.
Youtuber opinion First of all, as much as I like Seatin, his role in the game is overrated. He is a big youtuber for sure, it is impressive how many people watch him, but if you look at it objectively, he is just a normal player. Kabam releases a game for free, he plays it and shoots how he spends money. Fact is tho, that his opinions are eaten by many average players (majority of his fanbase are the so called "normies" imho, not 100% sure tho).
All I wanna say is, that basing a discussion like this on a burnout of one youtuber, is kind of silly.
Quest system
Now the state of the game has been far from optimal for months. I would dare to say that the very concept of the game is in a way wrong. First of all, the quests. They get gradually more difficult and award very inconsistent rewards, meaning that difficulty and rewards don't scale together. The difficulty has gotten to the point where it is close to impossible to not spend plenty of bonus items even on completion (6.2-6.4, Variants,...). Sure, thats why we have bonus items, but the players progress shouldn't be limited by having to farm items for months. As I see it, some players have gotten to insane levels of skill, they play almost perfectly, but they slip up from time to time and that is very costly in the endgame, meaning that players who don't have the cutting edge champions and tons of resources for one encounter, stand no chance.
Crystals
Now about the crystal and hero system: A thing that I like is, how nicely the skill level of characters is spread. Most champs are average, some are bad and some are good, and there are more good than bad. The issue with this is, that while the average champions arent totally useless, the closer players get to the endgame, the less useful they are. At this point, average champion isn't gonna help you at all in Act 6 and Variants (the current meta). Also the crystals are random, and with new heroes are being added, so it is becoming gradually more difficult to obtain certain champ twice, despite the crystals being much more avaliable. And with the rarity of 5&6* awakening gems and signature stones, a free to play player has very slim chances of getting their desired champion on better level. And the game progresses so fast, that f2p ppl never have a chance to catch up on spenders.
My solutions
On the other hand, Kabam has to somehow get money feom this game. They chose in-game benefits over ads, which I won't critisize. This choice resulted into spenders getting more and more advantage, until now, when it is barely possible to be successful without either spending or mindlessly grinding.
Now I am going to list my ideas for improvement:
1) make items a bit easier to get for normal players (e.g. pots for gold, revs for a bit less units). The current paid offers aren't a problem imo, keep them. This way both normal players and spenders get satisfied
2) make a bit of change to the crystal system. Let there be basic crystals with full pool and then some more expensive one with only above average champions for more shards. This way the beginners get the basic 5&6* crystals for 10k shards to get a basic roster and then, as they will gt much more shards, they can buy the lets say 50k shards one with only actually great champions. There are currently enough good champs to maintain the RNG aspect of the game and at the same time allow people to get more or less good instead of great or terrible, but at higher price.
3) Add more rankup and awakening items here and there. The early Act rewards reworking programme is just the thing.
Final notes Please excuse my grammar and typos, I am not a native english speaker.
This comment is my general feedback to Kabam who supposedly reads this. It states my personal opinion and nothing in this comment should be taken as absolute truth. I have no insight into Kabam's business, so only thing ppl here on gorums can do is agrer or disagree with my opinion.
Before you decide to comment on something, I would suggest you to READ first I said 'And NO. This guy doesn't speak for all of us' How can someone disagrees with that, if he is not a sheep? It is a fact that he doesn't speak for me, so why the disagrees? And now I can see that I am talking to another sheep
I agree, he doesn't speak for all of us. He never said that, I never said that. There are people who agree with what he said, they're saying that Seatin covered most of the points that they wanted to get across, so they're saying that Seatin speaks for THEM specifically. Believe it or not, two people can have the same opinion.
If you disagree with him, no problem. Just lay out your points on why you disagree, simple. Calling people "sheep" isn't helping anyone.
Whilst I can’t comment on the act 7 beta (from what I’ve seen it looks tedious and stupidly roster dependant) I can comment on act 6. Exploration of act 6 is so beyond achievable right now without spending a ton of revives or units, this to me isn’t right. For a largely f2p player to explore act 6 is going to take so much arena grinding and so much time it does completely suck all fun out the game. This has to be changed for act 7, it can’t carry on like this or else people will get bored apart from the mega whales who will throw all sorts of money at quests to get through.
Also AQ and AW needs a total revamp in my opinion. AQ map 6/7 is too time consuming for your average working person, I can’t commit to logging in every 2-4 hours to make moves, I’ve got kids and a life and appreciate not everyone Is in my position but still does anyone actually find AQ Fun anymore? AW needs no long rant really, everyone knows it’s in tatters. Flow, matchmaking and stupid nodes altogether have created a horror show of a game mode. My opinion on how to solve that is to create a league system where in the first season everyone gets put into league matching their prestige. At the end of each season top 50 in gold 1 Get promoted bottom 50 in p4 get demoted etc and scales with amount of teams per league. Remove a few **** nodes and you have a working system and of course update rewards.
Thanks for the feedback. Please remember to keep your conversations civil though. Any attacks on each other or volatile comments will be deleted. As an open Forum, disagreements will occur, but that doesn't give license to break the forum rules.
As for the subject at hand, everybody is welcome to their own opinions, and there's a lot of great feedback in that video, and in your responses. Building new content in this game is not easy, nor is it quick. We're always looking at what you guys have to say, and where possible, we plan it into our roadmaps down the line. We planned on giving you guys a glimpse of what's on the horizon in a week or two, but I can see about moving that up.
We're always working to come up with new and interesting things for you all to do in-game, and deliver a constant stream of new content every month. We're also always looking at ways we can improve the existing content for everybody. We've worked on a bunch of Quality of Life stuff, some of which has already come out, and some of which is coming pretty soon (Battlegroup assignments at last!)
Less than a month ago we launched Incursions, one of the craziest, most ambitious projects that we'd ever undertaken. That took 8 to10 months from concept to release, depending on when we decide the start of that concept phase is. The reaction to that was great, and it's motivated us to look around for other areas of improvement, but identifying what we want to do, and then going through an ideation period, planning, building, testing, etc., takes a lot of time. It also takes a specific set of skills. We can't ask one of our designers to build a new game-mode, no less than we could ask a member of the Community team to model and texture a new Champion. I wish we could move faster, but we can't. It's physically impossible, and even more difficult given the current world situation.
I see a lot of conversations about Book 2 Act 1 Chapter 1 (Act 7), and one of our Quest Designers will be making a post for our Beta Testers on the feedback so far in a day or 2. But Act 7 has already seen changes made to it while it's still in Beta testing. We've reduced the Attack Boost twice, and that's only to address one pain point. We know there are others, and we appreciate all of the (constructive) feedback that we've received. The point of a Beta Test is to identify these pain points before the content is live in a test environment so that we can improve the final product and have it in its best shape possible.
Alliance Quest and Alliance War are 2 very important parts of this game. We know there are a lot of opinions about them, and we sure as hell are not ignoring them. We just don't have anything to say on them at this time. You'll see an update to Alliance Quests in the next couple of months that include an update to Rewards, AQ Modifiers, and Mini-Bosses. AW will see a small refresh soon as well, but that doesn't mean we're not already thinking about our next big change.
Just because we haven't made the specific change you want, doesn't mean that we haven't discussed it, or looked at the actual root cause. What the issue looks like on the surface isn't always what it is at the root. There's also so many of you, with different priorities and concerns. Just look through this thread and see the spectrum of different ideas and asks. Many of them contradict each other, and many have no appeal to somebody else. Even the video that was posted and the OP's comments are VERY different.
Again, we welcome the feedback, and we're going to discuss it. In fact, I'm going to make sure we discuss this all today. I probably won't have anything to come back with, but I can promise that I will make these points known.
Well, maybe you think you have done a lot to improve the "Quality of Life" of the players, but from the players' perspective not so much.
You haven't really solved any MAJOR issues that players have long been pointing out, all your changes mean little in the global perspective.
I strongly emphasize, I have nothing against the fact that you want to earn money, I run a business myself and I want to earn too.
Unfortunately, your current business model is destructive and harmful to players - customers.
You understand that you work in the entertainment business, don't you?
In my opinion, if you want to keep this product on the market, you must redefine the way you earn on it.
Every business requires a balance between making money and the quality of the product offered.
In your case, this balance has been disturbed to the detriment of customers for a long time.
You may have earned a lot of money during this period, but the consequence of this is increasing discouragement, weariness, rage, etc. of your customers.
This state of affairs cannot go on forever, sooner or later it must fall down, because the negative emotions of customers will grow more and more every day.
For a long time there has been practically no month in which some crisis arising from your decisions would not break out. Does it really have to be this way?
It is not a matter of implementing any small changes in the game, but a major change in the business model. You must be innovative, not repetitive.
Here's another major problem... No guaranteed value when clearing very difficult content, and the sheer difference in rewards right...
Summoner 1...
Summoner 2...
Summoner 3...
These 3 did the same content... Same troubles, got through the same awful node combinations... Look at the difference in value between them! No one should get through 100% and have nothing useful to their account..
I myself have 2 t5cc, which I cannot use because I haven't yet been lucky enough to pull a 6 star champion i would deem worthy of those resources! Meaning I've cleared that content for no benefit because although I could r3 a 6 star in 4 classes... I pulled the 2 classes I didn't need! Those t5cc should have been selectors or guaranteed value!!
As one of millions of subscriber of Seatin’s Channel, I pretty understand his feeling in his level. One core thing making a game attractive is that it’s really entertaining and fun!
Unfortunately, I didn’t get too much entertainment when I was working for Act6 completion. Quite a few fights were really annoying and discouraging. It seems that Kabam is putting more efforts on sucking our units ($$Money) Instead of creating a game which is fun to play as it used to be.
By the way, Act5 is the most enjoyable Act by far. And the Variants are pretty exciting as well.
I highly recommend Kabam somehow use the ideas of incursion to building the Book2 Chapter 1 (i.e. Act7)——players are able to receive temporary buffs/boosts after winning a fight, then challenge the next one with these buffs/boosts.
All these champs saying god tier/beyond god tier all are based on the quest the kabam introduce specifically for them usually for new champs ,if they start making some quest/act for which the old champs will benefits then that would be really nice and no more feeling bad I guess
May the way just click on gw name and click ok the upper right and hit ignore. You will be a happier person and can get on to discuss changes/problems rather then deal with someone who's just always argues on Kabams behalf NO matter what the discussion is. No group or organization has ever been right 100% of the time in history except kabam according to gw. If you want to fix the game let's all talk abt fixing the game rather then get sidetracked into pointless arguments that never go anywhere with a certain individual whenever any of issues come up.
I cannot see the above option when clicking on his profile. Can you block him for me, if this is a feature of being gated, that I cannot?
There are some considered, thoughtful, constructive posts in this thread and having to wade through his posts, which are not on topic, is adding to the sense of kabam not really giving a damn about the state of the game or players feelings.
May the way just click on gw name and click ok the upper right and hit ignore. You will be a happier person and can get on to discuss changes/problems rather then deal with someone who's just always argues on Kabams behalf NO matter what the discussion is. No group or organization has ever been right 100% of the time in history except kabam according to gw. If you want to fix the game let's all talk abt fixing the game rather then get sidetracked into pointless arguments that never go anywhere with a certain individual whenever any of issues come up.
I cannot see the above option when clicking on his profile. Can you block him for me, if this is a feature of being gated, that I cannot?
There are some considered, thoughtful, constructive posts in this thread and having to wade through his posts, which are not on topic, is adding to the sense of kabam not really giving a damn about the state of the game or players feelings.
Thanks
If you're using the forum on your phone, try switching to the desktop site in your browser. Click on his profile, there should be a pull down box near the top right of the screen, select ignore.
The best thing to do in order to have constructive feedback is to block GW. I'm blessed to discover there is actually a way not to see ignorant and irrelevant comments
I haven't played aq or aw since 2018. I completed 6.1 and V2 but, haven't gone into 6.2 or other variants yet. I really don't want to do all that grinding and it will be a grind for me to complete the other variants or 6.2+, just to get the disappointment of some champs or resources I won't use.
For the past 18 months I've just done the monthly content and kept it as simple as possible. I see a lot of retirement alliances and I hope the game does improve and draw players like me back into the more active alliance play mode.
The game needs to transition soon or more and more players will get to the point where Seatin is. You will see in the coming weeks the disappointment and frustration continue growing and trickling down. I feel as kabam is to reliant on Marvel's global brand and success its accumulated into believing that we just want to collect champions, which is true to an extent. We also want new exciting game modes, with fresh content that's rewarding and skill based. What you're doing is making these nodes that are awful and champion based, such as act 7 chapter 1.2 that the only counter would be Red Guardian. This way people will need to spend a ton of money so they can have a shot of beating that node. Listen, we all love this game and want it to succeed, but so far you're doing a disservice to it. Hope this helps.
Great point about this being dependent on marvel. Watching a lot of the phase 1 films back again, some of the Sony ones and the X-Men films, the fact that iron Man, og Spiderman, og Thor, og cap, cap ww2, groot, drax, bw, strange, magneto, storm, cyclops, are all so terrible, makes me question if kabam actually understand the value of the marvel brand.
Especially when you've read some of the comics that provided the Genesis for those story lines and why those characters are so cherished.
Not only does this game need to feel entertaining and rewarding, it also needs to make the brand work with the imagery that people associate with that brand.
I used to enjoy spinning crystals, but I have now resorted to only popping crystals. Seeing near misses on a crystal you’ve invested a lot of time, effort and sometimes money into can really play with one’s psychology. I guarantee most people will feel different about this game if spinning was abandoned.
This is not meant to be a criticism, but constructive feedback. The rewards need to be commensurate with the level of investment, and I think that has started to break down in the endgame.
Even rats take it in turn to win wrestling matches, so that the weaker rat doesn’t give up playing with the stronger rat.
Thanks for the feedback. Please remember to keep your conversations civil though. Any attacks on each other or volatile comments will be deleted. As an open Forum, disagreements will occur, but that doesn't give license to break the forum rules.
As for the subject at hand, everybody is welcome to their own opinions, and there's a lot of great feedback in that video, and in your responses. Building new content in this game is not easy, nor is it quick. We're always looking at what you guys have to say, and where possible, we plan it into our roadmaps down the line. We planned on giving you guys a glimpse of what's on the horizon in a week or two, but I can see about moving that up.
We're always working to come up with new and interesting things for you all to do in-game, and deliver a constant stream of new content every month. We're also always looking at ways we can improve the existing content for everybody. We've worked on a bunch of Quality of Life stuff, some of which has already come out, and some of which is coming pretty soon (Battlegroup assignments at last!)
Less than a month ago we launched Incursions, one of the craziest, most ambitious projects that we'd ever undertaken. That took 8 to10 months from concept to release, depending on when we decide the start of that concept phase is. The reaction to that was great, and it's motivated us to look around for other areas of improvement, but identifying what we want to do, and then going through an ideation period, planning, building, testing, etc., takes a lot of time. It also takes a specific set of skills. We can't ask one of our designers to build a new game-mode, no less than we could ask a member of the Community team to model and texture a new Champion. I wish we could move faster, but we can't. It's physically impossible, and even more difficult given the current world situation.
I see a lot of conversations about Book 2 Act 1 Chapter 1 (Act 7), and one of our Quest Designers will be making a post for our Beta Testers on the feedback so far in a day or 2. But Act 7 has already seen changes made to it while it's still in Beta testing. We've reduced the Attack Boost twice, and that's only to address one pain point. We know there are others, and we appreciate all of the (constructive) feedback that we've received. The point of a Beta Test is to identify these pain points before the content is live in a test environment so that we can improve the final product and have it in its best shape possible.
Alliance Quest and Alliance War are 2 very important parts of this game. We know there are a lot of opinions about them, and we sure as hell are not ignoring them. We just don't have anything to say on them at this time. You'll see an update to Alliance Quests in the next couple of months that include an update to Rewards, AQ Modifiers, and Mini-Bosses. AW will see a small refresh soon as well, but that doesn't mean we're not already thinking about our next big change.
Just because we haven't made the specific change you want, doesn't mean that we haven't discussed it, or looked at the actual root cause. What the issue looks like on the surface isn't always what it is at the root. There's also so many of you, with different priorities and concerns. Just look through this thread and see the spectrum of different ideas and asks. Many of them contradict each other, and many have no appeal to somebody else. Even the video that was posted and the OP's comments are VERY different.
Again, we welcome the feedback, and we're going to discuss it. In fact, I'm going to make sure we discuss this all today. I probably won't have anything to come back with, but I can promise that I will make these points known.
First of all I’m glad that this post can survive without being deleted. Opinion, even it is against your thought, can be constructive. For those who didn’t experience endgame contents and offer generic strange opposite comment, the number of “disagree” per post is good enough signal. It is just like a guy who didn’t watch the movie (or just watched part of it) and then start against those who have watched the whole movie. As some players said above, no need to enter muddy fight. Just ignore it.
For Kabam, mass grievance events happened periodically. From version 12.0 nerf, regular sudden server collapse incident, to the boycott movement a year before. Most of the time Kabam just use “compensation” items as a relief, and then business as usual. I’m not saying Kabam didn’t listen the community, yet I think the communication and feedback system is not functioned well, just not good at all.
I remembered when Kabam Miike addressing about the community resentment over rebalancing a year ago, he said that the communication with the community should be improved. Frankly the moderators are relatively more responsive since then and they won’t delete post straight away just because OP tag their names. However, most of the time those suggestions from the community are like throwing rocks into the well.
As Kabam Miike said, suggestions from the community maybe contradicting and/or the development schedule can’t cater, but I think there is lack of transparent feedback channel to let the community know what is contradicting and why those suggestions cannot be implemented. Everyone can said diplomatically like “we hear your voice” “your suggestion is great” “I want to let you know I have listened”, so and so forth. Nonetheless, the most important part such as “which suggestion have been discussed and we will put it into project phase xxx”, “the reason why your suggestion can not be taken becoz of xxxx”, “the suggestion X is contradicting with Y, and Kabam’s stand is ....” are seldom being communicated to the community. In this respect, Kabam and the community are still disconnected imho.
Spending is not the only way to acquire Champs and Rank them. The most primary source of them is playing the game. Experience.
Spending is the only way to avoid the rut than many of us get into of months and months and months without a champ we want to do anything with. Spending is the only way to avoid potentially going years without the one counter that works for a particular fight. 6*s entered the contest in January of 2018. It took me over 2 years to get one that I wanted to rank. Spending is the only cure for that.
Would that were so— it’s an imperfect cure at best.
May the way just click on gw name and click ok the upper right and hit ignore. You will be a happier person and can get on to discuss changes/problems rather then deal with someone who's just always argues on Kabams behalf NO matter what the discussion is. No group or organization has ever been right 100% of the time in history except kabam according to gw. If you want to fix the game let's all talk abt fixing the game rather then get sidetracked into pointless arguments that never go anywhere with a certain individual whenever any of issues come up.
I cannot see the above option when clicking on his profile. Can you block him for me, if this is a feature of being gated, that I cannot?
There are some considered, thoughtful, constructive posts in this thread and having to wade through his posts, which are not on topic, is adding to the sense of kabam not really giving a damn about the state of the game or players feelings.
Thanks
If you're using the forum on your phone, try switching to the desktop site in your browser. Click on his profile, there should be a pull down box near the top right of the screen, select ignore.
The game is not fun anymore.... been playing since it first came out I have sat through all the nerfs and changes, the overheating issues, the bait and switch tactics and put up with it I have finished act 6, AOL and all content is up to date Act 6 nearly made me quit .... AOL came out and I finished it .... rewards are unusable I have 3 T5CC I can't use as I dont have the champs and doubled up on 2 skill cats... all that time and effort for nothing Act 7 beta is crazy so much worse than act 6 which was ridiculous... I wont be doing it when it drops I spend and I spend big.... not anymore ..... I'm done with the game Seatins video really hit the mark with me and articulated the way I am feeling Kabam can salvage this make the game fun again - stop the ridiculous content .... however I think they are so out of touch with the player base they wont do anything .... and if they dont the game is doomed
Is there really any use for parry in act7 the block damage is hilarious. I think is time for the new masteries and extra mastery points cause Act 7 if left in that state is unfair to summoner's. I mean look at the mercy node, it is complete BS and just a revive fiesta this has to change along with other core aspects of the game.
The goal of the game should be to try to make the players feel good about accomplishing something, not feel bad about failing something. And while those are two sides of the same coin, that doesn't mean you can't skew that coin in one direction.
You and I haven’t always seen eye-to-eye and I disagree with some of what you said, but I like this paragraph.
The only way I might tweak it would be to say something about how so many of us don’t feel good even after we accomplish something great, because the rewards themselves don’t turn out in our favor.
More often than not, I’ve accomplished difficult content without the right champs and felt great about it - only to have the wind sucked out of my sails with another dupe on my Thor Jane Foster.
The reward vs. disappointment ratio is just way off - and it just seems to get worse the further you go. And by reward I mean in-game rewards AND player satisfaction for completing difficult content.
Maybe that’s exactly what you were saying and I misunderstood - but, everyone seems to have a different view on where things seem to turn for the worse for themselves in regard to this game, and it seems like everyone who plays it eventually crosses a line where disappointment outweighs gratification so much, that they eventually feel defeated no matter what they’ve accomplished or how far they’ve come.
Let me toss this out there. I agree with what you're saying here up to a point. I think no one would argue with wanting the content itself to be sufficiently entertaining on its own, regardless of rewards (as subjective as that is). When it comes to actual in-game rewards I think the same principle applies, but while there's no counterbalancing priority to making the content entertaining (there's no reason at all to go the other way) the rewards do have balance concerns that mean you can't simply make the rewards as rewarding as possible. What you can do, and I think Kabam has taken very small steps in this direction, is to make the rewards have a better "lower bound" the greater the content accomplishment associated with them is. But I think they should go much farther.
I think it is perfectly reasonable for rewards to be highly random when you're grinding for them. The 5* basic crystal I open with the 5* shards I grind for in the arena is a repeatable reward I'm going to be opening over and over and over again. RNG makes sense, because I will eventually have lots and lots of rolls. But when you complete Act 6, you're only going to get those rewards once. The psychology of those rewards is different, because they feel like a once in a lifetime thing (because for most players, they are). So the disappointment associated with them should be as low as possible. The Nexus crystals are a kind of way to do that. You can think of the Nexus crystal as a way to roll a 5* champ three times and pick the best one. But another way to look at it is the Nexus crystal is a basic crystal with some of the disappointment removed. The best case scenario is still the same, and you still get only one champ, but the odds of being disappointment are much lower.
I think just letting people directly pick their rewards is a bridge too far in most cases. But a compromise in the middle would seem to be helpful, specifically when it comes to once in a lifetime rewards. If i'm disappointed when I open a crystal that I grind out several times a month, that's on me. If I'm disappointed in the reward I get for the one and only time i fully explore Act 6, I think the game has to take some responsibility for that.
Here's a crazy idea. Suppose we were to datamine the game and determine which champions were the top twenty four champions used in Act 6.1. And suppose the reward for first time completion of 6.1 was a crystal that contained those twenty four champions. I understand there's a lot of impracticality with the details of this idea: how do you revise the crystal over time, and how would you have bootstrapped the crystal when 6.1 first came out. But just as a brainstorm, what would it mean to the game if the reward for completing 6.1 was a crystal that was almost guaranteed to help you explore 6.1, because it contained the very champions the end game players were using to explore 6.1? Is that broken? is that too good? I don't know myself, but I think it is worth asking the question, because it directly tackles the question of how appropriate should the rewards be to the content awarding the rewards. Shouldn't the reward for completing 6.1 be useful for exploring 6.1? Where do we draw the line?
I cannot emphasize enough how much I agree with two points made here:
1. Completion/Exploration rewards are big deals and aren’t the same as Basics. At some point, we all have to be able to agree that it’s not a great feeling to complete something like a 6.1 or higher and pull a character that you basically cannot use — we have to be able to acknowledge that some characters cannot clear post-Cavalier content and there has to be some way people at that level can consistently, not every single time, but consistently have a milestone to shoot for that they can clear and know that they will get something to help them clear post-Cavalier content
2. No game should leave people feeling as empty as MCoC can consistently. Again, consistently. I get it, we all get it, RNG means you aren’t gonna get everything you want, when you want it. But there has to be another way to help players not feel that instant feeling of misery when they open a six-star multiple times in a row and it just isn’t good enough to help them clear anything
I don’t know what the final answer would look like, but today’s outburst on all levels has to indicate that what has been done can be questioned
When I did my first completion of the Abyss I was so exhausted from the grind that instead of popping 2 6* crystals, I accidentally popped open a featured 6* and got Groot. Yes, a 6* Groot out of a featured crystal after completing the single hardest content in the game.
I kept asking: why the heck is Groot in the 6* pool, let alone in the featured pool?
It's really baffling to me because in the recent Q/A with Kabam devs by Dorky Diggity Dave the guy who has been working on Hulkbuster buff says he's excited about Hulkbuster rework because he's in the 6* pool and that he wants the players to be excited about 6* champions. Well, then, why has Kabam been adding the absolute trash like Groot and Falcon and others into the pool before they've been buffed?
First things first, that’s pretty terrible.
You have to assume it’s 100% intentional. The game team has always assured us they keep detailed stats on champ usage in game, which means they can’t help knowing which ones aren’t useful and aren’t used. I would guess they put trash champs in the pool because someone concluded the frustration it breeds can be profitable.
Back to the same theme @DNA3000, @ESF, @LeNoirFaineant , @Timone147 have emphasized: It can’t be all about the agony of defeat; there has to be a decent dose of thrill of victory as well.
That ratio is currently whacked. Act 7 looks like it doubles down on whacked.
But it’s also why I’m enjoying logging on at 1PM to run one Intel duel a day and promptly logging out.
Comments
Everyone's constructively putting forward what they feel is wrong with the game, Kabam themselves said that they're looking into our complaints. The community needed a spark to light this long line of complaints that were being held back, and you'd think that the biggest MCOC YouTuber making a video on these things would be enough of a spark.
But no, of course anyone who disagrees with you is a sheep. You've got it all figured out, you're the best player there is, there simply cannot be people who think differently than you. And if anyone does, they obviously don't have their own opinion, they're just sheep.
Honestly, mate. Just stop, if you have something to add to the discussion, then by all means do it. If you don't, leave.
Youtuber opinion
First of all, as much as I like Seatin, his role in the game is overrated. He is a big youtuber for sure, it is impressive how many people watch him, but if you look at it objectively, he is just a normal player. Kabam releases a game for free, he plays it and shoots how he spends money. Fact is tho, that his opinions are eaten by many average players (majority of his fanbase are the so called "normies" imho, not 100% sure tho).
All I wanna say is, that basing a discussion like this on a burnout of one youtuber, is kind of silly.
Quest system
Now the state of the game has been far from optimal for months. I would dare to say that the very concept of the game is in a way wrong. First of all, the quests. They get gradually more difficult and award very inconsistent rewards, meaning that difficulty and rewards don't scale together. The difficulty has gotten to the point where it is close to impossible to not spend plenty of bonus items even on completion (6.2-6.4, Variants,...). Sure, thats why we have bonus items, but the players progress shouldn't be limited by having to farm items for months. As I see it, some players have gotten to insane levels of skill, they play almost perfectly, but they slip up from time to time and that is very costly in the endgame, meaning that players who don't have the cutting edge champions and tons of resources for one encounter, stand no chance.
Crystals
Now about the crystal and hero system: A thing that I like is, how nicely the skill level of characters is spread. Most champs are average, some are bad and some are good, and there are more good than bad. The issue with this is, that while the average champions arent totally useless, the closer players get to the endgame, the less useful they are. At this point, average champion isn't gonna help you at all in Act 6 and Variants (the current meta). Also the crystals are random, and with new heroes are being added, so it is becoming gradually more difficult to obtain certain champ twice, despite the crystals being much more avaliable. And with the rarity of 5&6* awakening gems and signature stones, a free to play player has very slim chances of getting their desired champion on better level. And the game progresses so fast, that f2p ppl never have a chance to catch up on spenders.
My solutions
On the other hand, Kabam has to somehow get money feom this game. They chose in-game benefits over ads, which I won't critisize. This choice resulted into spenders getting more and more advantage, until now, when it is barely possible to be successful without either spending or mindlessly grinding.
Now I am going to list my ideas for improvement:
1) make items a bit easier to get for normal players (e.g. pots for gold, revs for a bit less units). The current paid offers aren't a problem imo, keep them. This way both normal players and spenders get satisfied
2) make a bit of change to the crystal system. Let there be basic crystals with full pool and then some more expensive one with only above average champions for more shards. This way the beginners get the basic 5&6* crystals for 10k shards to get a basic roster and then, as they will gt much more shards, they can buy the lets say 50k shards one with only actually great champions. There are currently enough good champs to maintain the RNG aspect of the game and at the same time allow people to get more or less good instead of great or terrible, but at higher price.
3) Add more rankup and awakening items here and there. The early Act rewards reworking programme is just the thing.
Final notes
Please excuse my grammar and typos, I am not a native english speaker.
This comment is my general feedback to Kabam who supposedly reads this. It states my personal opinion and nothing in this comment should be taken as absolute truth. I have no insight into Kabam's business, so only thing ppl here on gorums can do is agrer or disagree with my opinion.
If you disagree with him, no problem. Just lay out your points on why you disagree, simple. Calling people "sheep" isn't helping anyone.
Also AQ and AW needs a total revamp in my opinion. AQ map 6/7 is too time consuming for your average working person, I can’t commit to logging in every 2-4 hours to make moves, I’ve got kids and a life and appreciate not everyone Is in my position but still does anyone actually find AQ Fun anymore? AW needs no long rant really, everyone knows it’s in tatters. Flow, matchmaking and stupid nodes altogether have created a horror show of a game mode. My opinion on how to solve that is to create a league system where in the first season everyone gets put into league matching their prestige. At the end of each season top 50 in gold 1 Get promoted bottom 50 in p4 get demoted etc and scales with amount of teams per league. Remove a few **** nodes and you have a working system and of course update rewards.
Well, maybe you think you have done a lot to improve the "Quality of Life" of the players, but from the players' perspective not so much.
You haven't really solved any MAJOR issues that players have long been pointing out, all your changes mean little in the global perspective.
I strongly emphasize, I have nothing against the fact that you want to earn money, I run a business myself and I want to earn too.
Unfortunately, your current business model is destructive and harmful to players - customers.
You understand that you work in the entertainment business, don't you?
In my opinion, if you want to keep this product on the market, you must redefine the way you earn on it.
Every business requires a balance between making money and the quality of the product offered.
In your case, this balance has been disturbed to the detriment of customers for a long time.
You may have earned a lot of money during this period, but the consequence of this is increasing discouragement, weariness, rage, etc. of your customers.
This state of affairs cannot go on forever, sooner or later it must fall down, because the negative emotions of customers will grow more and more every day.
For a long time there has been practically no month in which some crisis arising from your decisions would not break out. Does it really have to be this way?
It is not a matter of implementing any small changes in the game, but a major change in the business model. You must be innovative, not repetitive.
@Seatin, thank you for starting this discussion!
Let's hope it leads to some breakthrough.
Summoner 1...
Summoner 2...
Summoner 3...
These 3 did the same content... Same troubles, got through the same awful node combinations... Look at the difference in value between them! No one should get through 100% and have nothing useful to their account..
I myself have 2 t5cc, which I cannot use because I haven't yet been lucky enough to pull a 6 star champion i would deem worthy of those resources! Meaning I've cleared that content for no benefit because although I could r3 a 6 star in 4 classes... I pulled the 2 classes I didn't need! Those t5cc should have been selectors or guaranteed value!!
Unfortunately, I didn’t get too much entertainment when I was working for Act6 completion. Quite a few fights were really annoying and discouraging. It seems that Kabam is putting more efforts on sucking our units ($$Money) Instead of creating a game which is fun to play as it used to be.
By the way, Act5 is the most enjoyable Act by far. And the Variants are pretty exciting as well.
I highly recommend Kabam somehow use the ideas of incursion to building the Book2 Chapter 1 (i.e. Act7)——players are able to receive temporary buffs/boosts after winning a fight, then challenge the next one with these buffs/boosts.
Hope this can help.
I cannot see the above option when clicking on his profile. Can you block him for me, if this is a feature of being gated, that I cannot?
There are some considered, thoughtful, constructive posts in this thread and having to wade through his posts, which are not on topic, is adding to the sense of kabam not really giving a damn about the state of the game or players feelings.
Thanks
Click on his profile, there should be a pull down box near the top right of the screen, select ignore.
I completed 6.1 and V2 but, haven't gone into 6.2 or other variants yet.
I really don't want to do all that grinding and it will be a grind for me to complete the other variants or 6.2+, just to get the disappointment of some champs or resources I won't use.
For the past 18 months I've just done the monthly content and kept it as simple as possible. I see a lot of retirement alliances and I hope the game does improve and draw players like me back into the more active alliance play mode.
Especially when you've read some of the comics that provided the Genesis for those story lines and why those characters are so cherished.
Not only does this game need to feel entertaining and rewarding, it also needs to make the brand work with the imagery that people associate with that brand.
They are missing the mark on all three counts.
This is not meant to be a criticism, but constructive feedback. The rewards need to be commensurate with the level of investment, and I think that has started to break down in the endgame.
Even rats take it in turn to win wrestling matches, so that the weaker rat doesn’t give up playing with the stronger rat.
Picture to illustrate a point:
For Kabam, mass grievance events happened periodically. From version 12.0 nerf, regular sudden server collapse incident, to the boycott movement a year before. Most of the time Kabam just use “compensation” items as a relief, and then business as usual. I’m not saying Kabam didn’t listen the community, yet I think the communication and feedback system is not functioned well, just not good at all.
I remembered when Kabam Miike addressing about the community resentment over rebalancing a year ago, he said that the communication with the community should be improved. Frankly the moderators are relatively more responsive since then and they won’t delete post straight away just because OP tag their names. However, most of the time those suggestions from the community are like throwing rocks into the well.
As Kabam Miike said, suggestions from the community maybe contradicting and/or the development schedule can’t cater, but I think there is lack of transparent feedback channel to let the community know what is contradicting and why those suggestions cannot be implemented. Everyone can said diplomatically like “we hear your voice” “your suggestion is great” “I want to let you know I have listened”, so and so forth. Nonetheless, the most important part such as “which suggestion have been discussed and we will put it into project phase xxx”, “the reason why your suggestion can not be taken becoz of xxxx”, “the suggestion X is contradicting with Y, and Kabam’s stand is ....” are seldom being communicated to the community. In this respect, Kabam and the community are still disconnected imho.
Dr. Zola
I have sat through all the nerfs and changes, the overheating issues, the bait and switch tactics and put up with it
I have finished act 6, AOL and all content is up to date
Act 6 nearly made me quit ....
AOL came out and I finished it .... rewards are unusable I have 3 T5CC I can't use as I dont have the champs and doubled up on 2 skill cats... all that time and effort for nothing
Act 7 beta is crazy so much worse than act 6 which was ridiculous... I wont be doing it when it drops
I spend and I spend big.... not anymore ..... I'm done with the game
Seatins video really hit the mark with me and articulated the way I am feeling
Kabam can salvage this make the game fun again - stop the ridiculous content .... however I think they are so out of touch with the player base they wont do anything .... and if they dont the game is doomed
You have to assume it’s 100% intentional. The game team has always assured us they keep detailed stats on champ usage in game, which means they can’t help knowing which ones aren’t useful and aren’t used. I would guess they put trash champs in the pool because someone concluded the frustration it breeds can be profitable.
Back to the same theme @DNA3000, @ESF, @LeNoirFaineant , @Timone147 have emphasized: It can’t be all about the agony of defeat; there has to be a decent dose of thrill of victory as well.
That ratio is currently whacked. Act 7 looks like it doubles down on whacked.
But it’s also why I’m enjoying logging on at 1PM to run one Intel duel a day and promptly logging out.
Dr. Zola